Tanks in ROHOS

[The_Emperor]

What HoS's tanks also need is a delay for getting in and getting out. There's nothing more annoying than those guys driving tanks towards the enemy and then they get out with in a second, with their handgun ready to fire.
I'd really like to see a delay and also an animation showing the guy opening the hatch and then climbing inside. And vice versa.

Also I'd like to see a kind of weapon restriction. It's a nail in the *** for me that you can board a tank when armed with a larger weapon f.ex. an MG 42. Yet I read some forum postings telling that yet a PPSh 41 SMG was too large to be taken into a tanker's cabin.
This should be changed.

 

[BlackLabel]

"abillity" to overheat the tank/vehicle mg

 

[TT33]

with their handgun ready to fire.
I'd really like to see a delay and also an animation showing the guy opening the hatch and then climbing inside. And vice versa.

At the very least the vehicle should have to come to a complete stop before bailing is even possible...

Also I'd like to see a kind of weapon restriction. It's a nail in the *** for me that you can board a tank when armed with a larger weapon This should be changed.

Yeah especially when the enemy tank crew has a PTRD, Panzerfausts, and satchel charges (all at once..)...as these guys don't really tank but use the Tank or Clown car as a taxi....run into your tank bail out and shoot you with one of these At weapons.

"abillity" to overheat the tank/vehicle mg

 

[Zetsumei]

Werent the vehicle MG's equipped with heavier barrels?

 

[TT33]

Yeah it was armored. "MG34 Panzerlauf":

 

[shaqism]

I personally want to see a kettenkrad charge into battle.

 

[The_Emperor]

Well they yet bashed me for the wish of a k

 

[RedGuardist]

Well they yet bashed me for the wish of a k

 

[The_Emperor]

Is a Sdkfz 251/2 halftrack a combat vehicle then?

Why I'm wishing this kind of vehicles is that larger maps are horrible for infantry. You can't provide that many halftracks to satisfy everyone. What's so bad about combat engineers riding a motorcycle? Nothing at all. If you can choose a krad to get to the enemy your advantage is you're fast, the disadvantage is that actually every weapon can take you out of the saddle and therefor kill you.

Also I always missed the chance of doing some recon and sentry duty. Particularly in clan games it was always a good thing to position a squad leader with binoculars somewhere above and he good spot enemy movements and tell his team. I always wanted a fast vehicle for this kind of surveillance duty.


Yes they are fast but you don't have to worry about them being used to exploit things, you can't rush through enemy lines with them as the crew doesn't survive.

The Germans even had Kradsch

 

[Cpt-Praxius]

If there are going to be tanks.... at least get them back to the way they responded to damage/deflections like in the mod..... or just leave them out.

One thing I'd like to see in the new RO are more interactive static items in the maps, like Mounted MG's, PaK 36's, and the sort.

Also what would be great would be some dead bodies that are randomly generated in the map each round with different ammo and wepons one could pick up (ie: head to the church bell tower and there's a dead sniper with rifle, or empty MG nests with an extra ammo one can pick up)

Besides the realism of additional bodies on the ground, you could only pick these weapons/ammo up once per round. And the bodies are randomly generated at different locations so there isn't always a mad dash to the same places all the time.

Perhaps if the game is geared mainly towards soldiers and very little or no tanks... maybe in some maps, if there are going to be tanks, they should be restricted from entering the main battle area and can only provide support from a distance like a ridge line aiming inside the town/village, while PTRD's and Fausts can only try to take them out or keep them busy from buildings and such inside the battle area. (Like manual arty)

 

[TT33]

If there are going to be tanks.... at least get them back to the way they responded to damage/deflections like in the mod..... or just leave them out.

That would be 2 steps back I do not think the Mod had side or rear armor, I know it did not have turret armor as the game version does not either.... What we need is not a slightly tweeked or a previous version of the tanking system, we need a new dynamic tanking system based off actual ballistic data with more tank armor modeled (upper lower turret armor roof armor etc.) gears, engine overheat (you can't go top speed all the time),crew deaths, overmatch, shatter-gap, dynamic wheel damage, suspension, turret ring damage,proper working optics, tank fires, working commanders cupolas (they were not very useful in ro1) , different round types (AP,APC,APCBC, HEAT,HE, canister shot) etc. In other words a tanking system that has as much work behind it as the infantry stuff...

 

[VariousNames]

I am sure that tripwire will not create all tanks like IS-2, only tanks related to battle of Stalingrad era. So try to discuss penetration vs early T-34 tanks, BT-7, T-60 or else. Dont discuss penetration against tanks which dont existed yet, RO HOS is about late 1942 and some first days of 1943.

When we're talking about 100mm of penetration at 1000m (roughly Tiger I's APCBC penetration) versus 120mm frontal plate and 90mm side plate (IS-2)....

This is roughly comparable to, say, 40-50mm of armor penetration at 1000m (approximately equal to the penetration values of a PzIII L/42/60 or PIV L/24) with a 45mm thick sloped frontal and side armor plate (T-34/76).

Effectively....the performance of a T-34's sloped armor against the guns I mentioned are going to be nearly identical to the performance of an IS-2's sloped armor against the late-war guns of maps like Arad in Ost Front (I.E. Tiger, PzIV Ausf. H, Panther)

 

[VariousNames]

Yeah especially when the enemy tank crew has a PTRD, Panzerfausts, and satchel charges (all at once..)...as these guys don't really tank but use the Tank or Clown car as a taxi....run into your tank bail out and shoot you with one of these At weapons.

This is fixed easily by making the game like the Darkest Hour mod. I am not a big fan of the Darkest Hour mod but it did unarguably fix a lot of glaring realism/gameplay issues with Ost Front. In DH you cannot exit a vehicle unless you have the hatch open. DH also has driver sights that you can angle, and you also cannot exit a vehicle when it is moving (you will be killed).

Add all that and you now have clowncar rushes that are nullified. DH even has faster vehicles, the Volkswagens, but it's extremely difficult to suicide bomb tanks in DH due to the changes I mentioned.

It also includes the ability to kill machine gunners through gaps in the armor shield in addition to the ability to shoot through open driver sights/hatches, which makes sniping suicide clown car drivers far easier with the tank's hull machine gun.

 

[the_TeuTon]

At the very least the vehicle should have to come to a complete stop before bailing is even possible...

Yeah especially when the enemy tank crew has a PTRD, Panzerfausts, and satchel charges (all at once..)...as these guys don't really tank but use the Tank or Clown car as a taxi....run into your tank bail out and shoot you with one of these At weapons.

As long as the barrel can be changed like it could be in real life on the German tanks.

In that case, tank crews should be able to fire through the little gun holes in the turrets on those tanks that have them (like the Panther and Panzer IV). I believe they could do this with MP-40s, as German tank interiors were spacious.

Also, the rear turret MG on the KV-1 should be usable. And there were KV-1's at Stalingrad right?

 

[TT33]

Yeah those are pistol ports they should function, as they provided good side and rear protection. It would be nice to toss grenades from the vehicle as well saw a 1943 training video of this...

 

[Cpt-Praxius]

That would be 2 steps back I do not think the Mod had side or rear armor,

The side and rear damage in the mod compared to Ost is almost identical as far as I can tell from PTRD and Faust hits done identically in both..... my issue is the frontal and angled shots and how flimsy the tanks are on those impacts, esspecially the one's that are supposed to take those kind of shots.

I know it did not have turret armor as the game version does not either....

I noticed in Ost that hitting the turrent while angled is different then hitting the angled body.... where in the mod, hitting the turret while the body was angled was the same as the body angled, AKA: deflected, while in Ost, makes impact.

That I have no issue with.

What we need is not a slightly tweeked or a previous version of the tanking system, we need a new dynamic tanking system based off actual ballistic data with more tank armor modeled (upper lower turret armor roof armor etc.) gears, engine overheat (you can't go top speed all the time),crew deaths, overmatch, shatter-gap, dynamic wheel damage, suspension, turret ring damage,proper working optics, tank fires, working commanders cupolas (they were not very useful in ro1) , different round types (AP,APC,APCBC, HEAT,HE, canister shot) etc. In other words a tanking system that has as much work behind it as the infantry stuff...

Well that's a long santa list for sure. I look at it as RO being the most complex multiplayer tanking system today compared to other games like BF2, etc. and thus already is way a head in many ways. I'd just be happy to have the frontal angle systems tweaked to whatever they used to be.... be that going back a version in some ways or going back to realism, whatever..... but once the current problems are fixed, then I have no issue moving onto the other ideas mentioned above.

Let's not get the cart ahead of the horse and end up with more problems later down the road..... and taking out the current system just to re-create a whole new one would take a lot of time and resources when just modifying/working off of the current system which already shows promise, would be much easier, and faster.

..... and you also cannot exit a vehicle when it is moving (you will be killed).

Well that's nothing new, as that happened a lot in the RO mod days cuz of where the body would spawn while the tank moved, you'd end up getting run over and the driver got a TK.

That to me was more of a glitch. I mean in real life you could still jump from a moving tank. You'd probably injure yourself but you wouldn't die.

Yeah those are pistol ports they should function, as they provided good side and rear protection. It would be nice to toss grenades from the vehicle as well saw a 1943 training video of this...

At the same time, it'd be nice to shoot into the view ports, even when hatches are down. Afterall, there wasn't bullet proof glass there and sometimes when some tank driver wants to get cocky and run me over, it'd be nice if a bullet or two could get in there to take them out before they do.

 

[RedGuardist]

At the same time, it'd be nice to shoot into the view ports, even when hatches are down. Afterall, there wasn't bullet proof glass there and sometimes when some tank driver wants to get cocky and run me over, it'd be nice if a bullet or two could get in there to take them out before they do.

What do you mean? I didn

 

[Cpt-Praxius]

What do you mean? I didn

 

[RedGuardist]

I always figured they were just clear since back then and what the tanks would be driving through, they'd get gunked, chipped and screwed up to see through after a while. It'd be the first I ever heard of them being in tanks and every image I can find online or elsewhere don't show or talk about bullet proof glass..... not to mention that the models in game, the HT's, Panzers, T-34's, all of them have solid metal view ports with no place for the glass to be bolted or installed into, so I don't think they did.

But I could be wrong and if I am, then perhaps they should be modeled into the game.

I am sorry, but I still do not understand what do you mean.

If the hatch is opened, like for example in T34, ofcourse then there is no armored glass. And you can shoot the driver in RO:OST, if the hatch is open.

But if the hatch is closed, in T34 driver drives through periscopes. There is no "view port" in T34, only periscopes.

If there are no periscopes for the driver, in other German and Soviet tanks there is armored glass in each and every tank

 

[Cpt-Praxius]

Well my basis was button down mode and being able to shoot in the view ports, as I'm aware you can pick off people with the hatches already open and has been in the game forever...... but it was the first time I've been told there was any sort of protective glass in tanks and figured they were open holes just reduced in size and angled to reduce the chances of objects coming through.

If there was protective glass in these tanks, then never mind, but I never seen any modeled in the game, never heard anybody mention it before, so my mistake.

I knew this stuff exists in today's tanks, just didn't think it applied back then.

Well the history base says this type of glass has been in use since WWII, but could not find details on which vehicles used them and when this glass was first introduced.

Never mind.

But tossing grenades in open hatches would be nice.

Also, this just popped in my head. If they do have protective glass, then what I just browsed through shows when shot up, it's not all that pretty and easy to look through..... so.....

^ How about rather then having a perfect view port you can't get hurt behind.... how about have some real effects like the glass smashing up and making it harder for you to see where you're going at least? I think that'd level out the playing field and then the driver would have to listen to the commander on where to go.... or open the hatch and risk getting shot...... or get another tank.

Shooting the glass won't kill the driver, but could give you that extra chance of getting the hell out of the way and out of sight.