Think of it this way: You are in the drivers position in a Panzer moving down a soviet road at around 40 km/h in the dead of winter with negative temperatures. Without some form of armorglass in the drivers viewport the windchill will freeze your eyeballs in a matter of minutes. Very painful.
Tanks in ROHOS
- Thread starter GfrSeifter
- Start date
Think of it this way: You are in the drivers position in a Panzer moving down a soviet road at around 40 km/h in the dead of winter with negative temperatures. Without some form of armorglass in the drivers viewport the windchill will freeze your eyeballs in a matter of minutes. Very painful.
First those pics are of what Ro calls "overlays" they are not very detailed and are an easy way to have the player's camera sit outside the tank for better visibility... actually the makers of the game may have given the KV and the T-34 the same overlay in which case that model is supposed to be a periscope not a vision port..Cpt-Praxius said:
Well I have never really come across one with out armored glass or periscopes either in WWII anyways however I know that most vehicles had armored glass in their vision ports or periscopes as I stated earlier even lowly armored APCS such as the Sdkfz-251 had it hell even aircraft had it (the HS-129 had 75mm of it!). The problem is that in Red orchestra they did not bother to model the glass in it instead its an empty space which leads to these kinds of posts. Here is a picture of the Stug III G's interior zoom in on the pic to see glass (looks like the last layer they may have removed the rest) also notice the latches that hold it in place....RedGuardist said:
I will try to find a better pic... The only pics I have atm are of broken armored glass from a dug in Panzer IV position... I will try to find them. Also don't forget this:
Yes they are locked on some of RO's tank models you can actually see the locking mechanisms on the hatch. On the AHZ's KV tanks I actually animated them to unlock and lock when the hatch opens and shuts.RedGuardist said:
Last edited:
I live in Canada, I know how cold it can get and what windchill can do.... which is why I figured they had goggles.
Honestly it's not something I ever bothered to delve into.... I'm more of the troop guy then the tank guy, even in the game. I used to be a tank guy in the mod, but since I now have to re-learn all the angles and stuff, I can't be bothered, so I stay as troop. I get more kills easier anyways.
Anyways, since we concluded that there's protective glass, what about the idea of applying damage to the glass area to obstruct the driver's view in the next RO (if there are tanks)?
Last edited:
This was discussed already and it is not needed. Periscopes could be replaced in seconds if damaged.
What is much more needed is AT mines. So now infantry has a better choice of weapons. In RO:OST satchel charges alone are not enough against tanks because they have time fuses. AT mines will detonate on contact with the tank and this adds a lot more gameplay into the game. For example the defenders should know how to correctly lay the 5-6 mines that they have to maximise the chances of taking out some enemy tanks/
What is much more needed is AT mines. So now infantry has a better choice of weapons. In RO:OST satchel charges alone are not enough against tanks because they have time fuses. AT mines will detonate on contact with the tank and this adds a lot more gameplay into the game. For example the defenders should know how to correctly lay the 5-6 mines that they have to maximise the chances of taking out some enemy tanks/
Last edited:
I think adding the magnetic hollow charges to the Germans (and something to the Soviets if possible) could be a better solution.
Problem with ordinary AT mines is that laying mines is part of the preparations done before the battle. In generally, laying mines/building mine fields is not something you do during the actual battle.
Ok so you can replace the scopes in seconds... but can that be done inside the tank or do you have to get out and fix it in real life? Did these replacements occur on the fly in the middle of the battle and if so, how many replacements did they have in the tank?
As well, I was leaning more towards the regular view ports and not the scopes.
From what I seen in the animation in the T34, your head moves to the left viewport in the hatch, not a scope. While I imagine there was a scope, it doesn't appear to be used based on the animation provided. And besides that, in the german tanks that use scopes, you have a blacked out scope texture applied or a full screen view of the scope..... in the russian tanks, you're looking through the viewport.
German Example:
How quick was it to change this glass in the middle of the battle?
It may not be needed for the tank crew, but I think the soldiers being run over and shot at by tanks with invincible glass that is never obstructed wouldn't mind this feature in the game..... esspecially those who are stuck with rifleman classes and have no way of taking out a tank except perhaps trying to screw up it's vision and make a run for it.
And if it forces the driver to pop their head out to see where they're going or be stuck listening to the tank commander on where to go, then so much the better.... it's probably make drivers a bit more cautious and listen to their crew more often.
As well, I was leaning more towards the regular view ports and not the scopes.
From what I seen in the animation in the T34, your head moves to the left viewport in the hatch, not a scope. While I imagine there was a scope, it doesn't appear to be used based on the animation provided. And besides that, in the german tanks that use scopes, you have a blacked out scope texture applied or a full screen view of the scope..... in the russian tanks, you're looking through the viewport.
German Example:
How quick was it to change this glass in the middle of the battle?
It may not be needed for the tank crew, but I think the soldiers being run over and shot at by tanks with invincible glass that is never obstructed wouldn't mind this feature in the game..... esspecially those who are stuck with rifleman classes and have no way of taking out a tank except perhaps trying to screw up it's vision and make a run for it.
And if it forces the driver to pop their head out to see where they're going or be stuck listening to the tank commander on where to go, then so much the better.... it's probably make drivers a bit more cautious and listen to their crew more often.
Last edited:
I disagree. When mines were available and there was an emergency they were used. Someone posted a training film in which a german soldier arms a mine and throws it into the path of an oncoming soviet tank. Magnetic charges, satchel charges and AT mines should all make it into the game.
It was done from the inside. I am not aware, how many spare periscopes/armored glasses there were in each tank models. But I would assume that couple or more.
And the idea was that the periscopes/armored glass would not be shot in the first place. That
Last edited:
Rifleman class will not even leave a scratch on that armored glass. You will need an AT rifle like the Panzerbusche which can disable light and medium tanks. I am just saying that this is not necessary for a game.
Last edited:
In either case, they are then vulnerable and the rifleman can stand a bit of a chance, so the driver has to determine if it's smart to get out and risk being shot, open the hatch and risk being shot, or try and replace the glass and risk being shot..... or try and guess where the heck the enemy is while almost blind.
And a rifle wouldn't make much of a scratch on metal armour, but we're talking about WWII quality layered laminate glass here being hit by a 7.62mm bullet..... I think damage to the glass would be quite significant, considering that a 7.62 round can do plenty of damage to today's quality of layered laminate protective glass.
[URL]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f8/IDET2007_bulletproof_glass_armor.jpg[/URL]
^ Image of bullet resistant glass being hit by 7.62mm rounds. (Large image)
If a round hit the viewports of any of the tanks, you'd be lucky to see anything afterwards.
This would be far more useful in game then some of the other ideas floating around here in the forums. Even if it only takes the driver a few seconds to replace the glass, that's a few second the other guy has to run.
Last edited:
In that image the bullet fired is 7,62x39 API BZ. The thickness of glass is 55,6mm. I do not know how this bullet compares to those fired by MN and K98 rifles or the thickness and strength levels of protective glass in tanks of WWII so I cannot pass a judgment here. I only think it is most likely that drivers were protected from these firearms, otherwise what is the point of designing them in the first place. Either way periscopes ensured absolute safety.
I'm not talking about allowing the bullets to pass through, just to screw up their vision enough to be somewhat of a distraction.
I think that if in the new RO they're planning on having bullets and such to pass through walls, wood and other objects, then this would fall right in line with that style of realism by smashing up the viewport glass and obstructing view, even if it's only for a few seconds or minutes until they can be replaced/fixed.
And unfortunatly it's not easy to find a detailed image of broken protective glass with a paticular sized round.... that was the closest I could find.... and I'm not an expert on this either, which is why I was throwing it out there and asking questions.
How about headlights? That'd be nice head lights for tanks that are switchable on/off. Since the mod days I hated it that you can't use the headlights to see at least where you're driving to. Sure you're a better target for the enemy, still it's better as you see where to go.
Last edited:
Ah, that'd go right along with my ideas of having to blink and tie your shoe so you don't trip every so often, along with the head bobbing and class rapes other's were talking about.
I mean if we're going to screw the whole game up with these randomly dumb ideas, then why not go all out and toss them all in?
Obviously nobody caught onto that with my glass idea. Every other joe schmo on here tosses out their crazy and stupid ideas with half-arsed justifications and reasons, and won't let up until people ignore them (then they just start more threads for the same thing) and think they're perfectly fine in doing so, yet when someone else does the exact same thing.... ah.... then the mocking and trivializing comes from these same hypocrites and wonder why it keeps coming back to them.... and the cycle continues.
Honestly the developers will make whatever they please, regardless of how many lame ideas any of us come up with, so I don't even see a point for this section other then to see members bi'atch each other out for sharing their ideas that will probably never even be considered in the first place.
So long as they pump up the graphics, details, environments etc. and keep somewhat on the beaten trail they already started out on, I'll be happy.
I'm hoping for a nice suspension modelling. RO's tanks feel far too "bricky" because they have no suspension. Annoying and takes away from immersion. Tanks like Panther had very smooth suspension which made shooting on the move relatively easier and accurate.
UT2.5 actually had support for it but devs never used it afaik.
UT2.5 actually had support for it but devs never used it afaik.
Agreed, one thing I never liked was how every little thing you rolled over made the whole tank tilt, bounce or move a certain way that would have normally been a smooth ride with maybe a slight lift here and there, but smooth.
And operating the cannon always was annoying, esspecially when you have a driver who doesn't listen to you or a bot takes over and while you have a shot in place, they move the damn tank and not only do you lose your shot, but you also can't get it back because the tank is rotating all over the place and bouncing around.
Of course the tanks are certainly a lot better then when they first popped onto the game. Great speed and power going up hills, etc. but don't ever try to make a sharp turn or you'd flip the tank.
They fixed that by reducing their power and automatically slowing speed when you turn..... while this fixed many of the problems with flipping, they left the tanks weak when it comes to hills and they crawl real slow unless you climb on a very wide angle, zig zagging back and forth up the hill.
I miss the old days of having some ballz to the tanks and being able to go up hills decently without ending up in a crawl. I'm not talking about obviously steep hills that a tank shouldn't climb up, but just your everyday mole hills and mounds you have to drive over once in a while..... say like a spawn ridge.
Last edited:
Well I really had to laugh when reading this. Half-arsed ideas, that's funny. Still TWI has taken the advice of the bullet penetration and the mantling option. Gee of course they'll do what they believe to be the right thing. The only thing you could do as some vengeance is that you don't by the upcoming game. (Like a lot of people did with MW2)
Yep that's something really annoying, tanks that "abandon" their drivers when facing a slight hill. At least the tanks aren't as slow as they were in the CC Mod. Remember this? You could even sprint beside them even if they were at full speed
Honestly the developers will make whatever they please, regardless of how many lame ideas any of us come up with, so I don't even see a point for this section other then to see members bi'atch each other out for sharing their ideas that will probably never even be considered in the first place.
So long as they pump up the graphics, details, environments etc. and keep somewhat on the beaten trail they already started out on, I'll be happy.[/QUOTE]
Well I really had to laugh when reading this. Half-arsed ideas, that's funny. Still TWI has taken the advice of the bullet penetration and the mantling option. Gee of course they'll do what they believe to be the right thing. The only thing you could do as some vengeance is that you don't by the upcoming game. (Like a lot of people did with MW2)
Last edited:
for the record:
german Panzers had bulletproof glass that you can always change from inside the tank.
But of course a bullet from a rifle can destroy your vision (it wont break, but it would scratch)
Soviet MGs shot at vision hatches (especially the commanders!) so the tank is blind for at least a few seconds.
(I
german Panzers had bulletproof glass that you can always change from inside the tank.
But of course a bullet from a rifle can destroy your vision (it wont break, but it would scratch)
Soviet MGs shot at vision hatches (especially the commanders!) so the tank is blind for at least a few seconds.
(I