Can we get the SDK early

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Divinehammer

FNG / Fresh Meat
Mar 9, 2006
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Sunny, Obamalot
I would like to know Trips plans on making the SDK available to the community. Would it be possible to make the bare bones editor available before release? It would be nice to be able to have the bones of a map laid out and put the bells and whistles in on release. I am thinking something like just the SDK and a texture pack we could build buildings then and make up some tutorials for the community. Understand i am not asking you to reveal anything but if we could start making buildings and such that would be great.
Further I would like to start a discussion here about the new editor what do we know we can do that we couldnt before what new bells and whistles are there? Are the old tutorials going to be roughly the same? What things are easier than before? Thanks.
 

Drecks

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 26, 2005
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The Netherlands
With the UT3 editor which shipped with UT3 you can do a lot already.
Make lay outs, buildings and add meshes. The game is a few bucks these days.
Adding custom content in there won't differ much from the editor
they use for HOS. Correct me if i'm wrong.
 
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SchutzeSepp

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 23, 2006
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i don't think theres a chance for them doing that, they can't just hand out their new engine for free. plus it wouldn't take long for code-guys to entirely decipher what the game is gonna be like.
an official or officious statement that the UT3 editor can make meshes, bsp and texture packs compatible with their game would do.

but i personally think it's way to early to switch over already, i plan on continuing mapping for DH and making a few trips this summer to get some pictures done for textures etc... and only by the end of this year actually start thinking of making meshes and textures for the new game.
but thats just me, the DH map that took me longest to make was stavelot with less than 4 weeks, and the shortest was raids with 3 days. so i wouldn't know what the hell to do if i switched already.
 

=GG= Mr Moe

FNG / Fresh Meat
Mar 16, 2006
9,797
890
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Newton, NJ
With the UT3 editor which shipped with UT3 you can do a lot already.
Make lay outs, buildings and add meshes. The game is a few bucks these days.
Adding custom content in there won't differ much from the editor
they use for HOS. Correct me if i'm wrong.

I have only really created one map, and it is not really released yet. I have found that I rather enjoy working in the (previous) editor. This sounds like a good idea if the game is cheap (I would only be interested in the editor) and I could get a little experience for when ROHOS finally comes out. I know with the current map I am on, my inexperience has really cost me months of time :D
 

SchutzeSepp

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 23, 2006
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i think the editors are basically the same, the biggest differences would probably be the game specific actors and features. wich we will only get to discover and master once it's out.
so i would advise you to to get some more experience with the current version, the better you will be prepared i guess.
 

worluk

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 21, 2005
2,226
85
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Your best bet is to work with Ued4. It is vastly different from previous versions in many aspects. Also level creation differs from UE2x to UE3.
Way larger emphasize on SM, far less BSP.
 

smokeythebear

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 21, 2005
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Sheppards house
Like everyone else has said, start making textures and models to get a nice head start. Since HOS will be Stalingrad exclusively all the more reason to start making something unique. I'd wait to get a confirmation on what HOS's gameplay is like before making outlines and terrain though.
 

Divinehammer

FNG / Fresh Meat
Mar 9, 2006
1,397
6
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Sunny, Obamalot
So I am still not following I guess should I get UT3 and the editor? or UED4 ? Will the file extensions be different? and IF HOS uses UT3 series editor will I just be able to change the file extensions to open in HOS editor it would be Nice if we could get a TWI person in here so we are not assuming to much and going down the wrong rabbit trail. Thanks.
 

EvilHobo

Grizzled Veteran
Dec 22, 2005
2,613
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Germany, NRW
My personal suggestion: start learning a 3D modeling application. By the looks of it, UE3 is very reliant on meshes for level creation purposes with BSP being relegated to a lesser role. I still do not understand how the engine works and handles these things, but from what I have seen meshes will play a huge role. Depending on the amount of 3D artwork that comes with HOS it may not be too big of an issue, but if you want to create some truly unique work now would be a good time to start learning 3D modeling. I suppose the other up-side to that would be that no matter what the scale turns out to be for the next game, you can always scale your models with little hassle.

Best of luck to you in your UE3 mapping endeavors!
 

slavek

Grizzled Veteran
May 4, 2006
3,075
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UnrealEd: Viewport #1
UT3 Editor is alot different than RO/UT2004 Editor. Alot of concepts have changed.

1. The Map making process is additive, not so much subtractive anymore. You no longer subtract a cube and add stuff into it. You can start a map just from the start in the "void".
2. No more skyboxes. Instead you have a hude dome you put around your map to mimic sky.
3. All content is stored in .upk files. Best way to describe it is a bundling system.
4. Maps are "Cooked" When they are done and rebuilt. This compresses the map size.
5. Lighting is alot more prominent in UT3. Light maps are more detailed and terrain supports detailed light maps. As a result rebuilding a map takes MUCH longer.
6. The editor includes a powerful tool called kismet. It allows the author to set up complicated sequences(Make lights turn on and off/change color, make pawns or vehicles appear and do certain actions, change actor code, endless possibilities.)
7. Terrain is no longer limited to 1 size. It is way more flexible allowing expansion after you have started on it without interfering with what you have already done. Terrain has new setting that allows it to auto occlude itself depending on what the author has it set for.
8. Height fog: Allots distance fog to be limited to a certain height if desired(You could have fog only over water or the knee height in a room.
9. Maps can be MUCH larger. Maps don't "Cut-off" when really big. You can have a endless valley without that annoying BSPhole/occlude style dropoff.
10. No more fluid surface info. Now go back to ut99/u1 style sheets with water volume under it. Sheet texture is advanced water texture to allow distortion when looking through it as in real life.

This is only some of the changes. There are too many others to list but these are some of the ones I could think off the top of my head.
 

Divinehammer

FNG / Fresh Meat
Mar 9, 2006
1,397
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Sunny, Obamalot
Good list here Slavek, I was afraid I was going to have to learn a 3d editor any suggestions for the best one to use(easiest to learn). Will buildings have to be made in a 3d editor? Hopefully we can post some links for tutorials I am guessing 3dbuzz is still the best place to get tutorials. Anyone find any tuts on making buildings pleas post them. I found this link but havent explored it yet. [url]http://utforums.epicgames.com/showthread.php?t=598243[/URL]
 

EvilHobo

Grizzled Veteran
Dec 22, 2005
2,613
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Germany, NRW
My head is already spinning...
It's a lot of information to digest. In about a month or so I think I will probably start to delve in full in to the intricacies of the new editor, but it is very uplifting to see many mappers hoping to get a head start on content creation this early!

I'm probably going to do something stupid like another titan project as my first map for the new engine...
 

Drecks

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 26, 2005
2,393
218
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The Netherlands
Lately i have been fooling around in 3D Max and UT3. Make different wall meshes in 3D max export them and import them in UT3. Works well and you can combine them together with bsp for the ceiling, floors or whatever to make larger building. All the meshes use one 2048x2048 texture and so far i'm happy with the results.
 
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worluk

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 21, 2005
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Lately i have been fooling around in 3D Max and UT3. Make different wall meshes in 3D max export them and import them in UT3. Works well and you can combine them together with bsp for the ceiling, floors or whatever to make larger building. All the meshes use one 2048x2048 texture and so far i'm happy with the results.

pics or it didnt happen ;) :p
 

EvilHobo

Grizzled Veteran
Dec 22, 2005
2,613
192
63
Germany, NRW
Cool stuff Drecks. Would you say you prefer being able to create these meshes in an external application and is it easier than say, BSP construction?

Also, any knowledge concerning the optimization applications of static meshes as opposed to BSP, since SMs now play a larger role?

Just wondering.