RO-PariserPlatz-III-ISU-152

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Mike_Nomad

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 15, 2006
5,024
1,037
0
79
Florida, USA
www.raidersmerciless.com
Well i do think i have already reduced the number of AT-guns and pakwagens for the next version, and increased the allied reinforcements so they never get out anymore (never thought it would happen!)
im specially waiting for the StuG 3G to replace some of the panthers, and only give them 1 panther and 2 StuG's.
im still not eager to mess with allied tanks, i have made textures and sign already that warn tankers of the limited respawns.
maybe if i have time i will rework the last capzone a bit, to intensify it.

Sepp we've had this map in our rotation and played since day one... We've enjoyed thoroghly, all your changes. This last set of requested changes however, worries me. Frankly, it is your map to do with as you please, and that's that.

Simply put...... if the map portrays a decided bias toward either the Germans or Russians... it will hurt the map's playability and balance.

I can see it now....... the Russians have the T34, IS2 and IS152.. the Germans have the Panther and two stugs..

Game over. :eek:
 
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SchutzeSepp

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 23, 2006
1,540
8
0
36
well i have been hard for the allies, so now the germans get the same treatment :p
rather then searching a better balance by boosting the allies and allow them to be less "good", i would rather de-boost the germans and force them to do better.
i suppose it takes time for players to get used to it, i remember that in the beginning my map was "revolutionary" because the germans had limited tanks. it was somethimes frustrating to see them get wasted by misconducting players. but when you see now, one year later the 3 panthers oftenly outlive the 14 allied tanks!
 

LogisticEarth

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 24, 2007
831
132
0
Pennsylvania, USA
I can see it now....... the Russians have the T34, IS2 and IS152.. the Germans have the Panther and two stugs..

Game over. :eek:

And a dozen AT guns. And AT halftracks. And unlimited panzerfausts. And the EH MG-42s.

One thing, though Sepp, might want to scale back the Russian arty a bit so the German's whole tank defense doesn't get wiped out with one shot.
 

EvilHobo

Grizzled Veteran
Dec 22, 2005
2,613
192
63
Germany, NRW
This thread is about:

RO-PariserPlatz-III-ISU-152

What you do with your map is your business.

Playability and Balance in this thread is being discussed for RO-PariserPlatz-III-ISU-152 .... I stand on what I said. This is a GAME not a HISTORY LESSON.

Balance and playability are all important for any game/map to be a resounding success. That is a very basic and unavoidable fact. All the banter in the world will not change that fact.

You forgot the -v3

Anyway, I used my map to highlight how balance can be done. You know, in discussions people like to use things called examples. I feel they do more for my argument than bold text. You haven't even said what you think would provide balanced gameplay, all I see is bold text with no real driving point.
 

Trendkill

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 21, 2006
642
4
0
Dorset, UK
Wasn't there an immobile StuG in one of the older versions? Anyway I think StuGs are a cool idea, I'm also happy that you agree that the Germans could do with some reduction. I'm only trying to suggest what I think will work and be enjoyable, I hope you don't take it offensively Schutze, when I keep throwing my ideas out.
 

Atomskytten

Active member
Jul 18, 2006
467
54
28
48
The best german AT-assests are still the panzerfausts as there are both an unlimited amount of them as well as many excellent places for ambushing the sovjet tanks. It is not that hard to sneak through the sovjet lines and to lay an ambush for the sovjet armour in my experience. The best tactic for using the Panther is to keep it behind the Brandenburger Tor and hold it in reserve untill the Sovjets is breaching that objective and my experiences playing on both teams is that the Panther is easily killed by either the sovjet tanks or sovjet soldiers who have picked up panzerfausts so whether the germans have 4 panthers or 1 panther plus 2 StuG III Gs doesn't really have an impact on the map play if they are going to be used the way the panther is usually used now.
The last objective can be hard to cap for the sovjets if the leader is incompetent and/or if the rest of the team is not aggressive and determined enough. A good german team can also stop a sovjet attack on the last objective fairly easy if they understand how to defend in the full depth of the objective while holding the corner buildings so effective overlapping fields of fire can be established. On the whole I think this map is balanced and when a particular game seems unbalanced the quality of the players is what causes it.
 

SchutzeSepp

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 23, 2006
1,540
8
0
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haha! there you go atomskytten, thats how i feel it is.
the thing is that the allies have more crucial weapons at hand( arty, 2 tanks) wich if they are used correctly will multiply their chances of victory. so chance plays a big role, if the tanker slots are taken by good tankers or not.
i feel that the germans have less critical weapons, the main effort on their side is given by the infantry. so chance plays a less bigger role, because there are always good and bad soldiers in the infantry.

hey trendkill i don't feel offended m8 :p you were there from the start and always gave advice! there was a stug in the early versions, but it was more of a AT-gun placeholder. the StuG 3G will have a MG on top, and i think it will be coded to act like a StuG 3g not anymore like the RO stug3. so with the limited range on the map, i think that a correct use of this tank could make it more effective than the panther.
so the german will have a harder to use weapon, but more effective if used correctly.
 

EvilHobo

Grizzled Veteran
Dec 22, 2005
2,613
192
63
Germany, NRW
As a tiny recommendation for the map, I think that the Allies should have a "last ditch" tank for their spawns that respawns infinitely but at a significantly reduced frequency (think 120 seconds or more). So, when the Allies are out of tanks, they aren't completely without armor support. You could make it a T-34/76 for instance, these were used in the Battle of Berlin and so having it would be perfectly valid. Due to its low status among players, the bigger, limited respawn tanks should end up being used and just leaving the T-34 as time progresses. As it stands, the Germans have enough AT capability to deal with the threat of an extra tank, in my opinion.

Something to ponder, I suppose.
 

Trendkill

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 21, 2006
642
4
0
Dorset, UK
This new StuG sounds very interesting indeed, I look forward to yet another new version of this map :D

How well it would work in actuality I don't know but I think that 'last ditch' tank is quite a nice idea EH.
 
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ro50pc

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jun 27, 2007
136
0
0
Ok, so its 1 am and I dont feel like reading 6 pages so if this has already been posted, sorry.

Any whooo, we were playing tonight and experienced an issue which seemed to lock up the objectives. As you can see, we capped everything but the Brandenburger Tor. At one point WE DID cap it and moved forward but as we were capping the Pariser Platz, the axis team re-capped the Brandenburger Tor. Now, I dont know remember exactly, but I think we somehow capped the Unter den linden Crossroad right after, at which point I noticed that the Brandenburger icon was now faded, i.e. not cappable.

So, we finished capping everything but couldnt win because of the Brandenburg. So we had the axis cap EVERYTHING back all the way to the Brandenburger Tor Approach. Then we tried again, but, the Brandenburger Tor was never open for us to cap again. We just restarted the map. I understand "cap in order" but if the order is broken, then its locked out.

pariserbug.jpg
 
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[BW-UK]NorS

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jul 29, 2007
101
13
0
Ok, so its 1 am and I dont feel like reading 6 pages so if this has already been posted, sorry.

Any whooo, we were playing tonight and experienced an issue which seemed to lock up the objectives. As you can see, we capped everything but the Brandenburger Tor. At one point WE DID cap it and moved forward but as we were capping the Pariser Platz, the axis team re-capped the Brandenburger Tor. Now, I dont know remember exactly, but I think we somehow capped the Unter den linden Crossroad right after, at which point I noticed that the Brandenburger icon was now faded, i.e. not cappable.

So, we finished capping everything but couldnt win because of the Brandenburg. So we had the axis cap EVERYTHING back all the way to the Brandenburger Tor Approach. Then we tried again, but, the Brandenburger Tor was never open for us to cap again. We just restarted the map. I understand "cap in order" but if the order is broken, then its locked out.

Same happend on ours!!!
 

SchutzeSepp

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 23, 2006
1,540
8
0
36
well it shouldn"t happen, must be an error from my part. but there is not much i can do about at right now
 

ro50pc

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jun 27, 2007
136
0
0
well it shouldn"t happen, must be an error from my part. but there is not much i can do about at right now


No, no, I understand. I just thought you were going to have to work on the map because of Kriegstadt 3 mismatch issues, or something like that. Its no big deal, I can imagine it happening on a server when 30+ players are playing. I just figured you might want to know.

I like the map and Im not trying to be hyper critical, cause lord knows I cant make a map.
 

SchutzeSepp

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 23, 2006
1,540
8
0
36
well i had an improved version ready, i was just waiting for some new vehicles to add. the problem is that my HD has crashed a month ago and i lost pretty much all my work.
im not sure yet if i will get the data back.

anyways thanks for mentioning this problem, i didn't know it happened yet!
 

Panzerfaust60

FNG / Fresh Meat
Aug 6, 2007
8
0
0
Hi
You may have seen this photo before but I thought I would post it, as is shows the entire Pariser Platz right after the battle

wanze_02.jpg


Picture taken from http://www.achtungpanzer.com/articles/wanze.htm

And since you are talking about reducing the axis tank force, you might add the vehicle in the link, the Wanze, it can be seen in the foreground in the photo
 

7-CLOWN-7

Active member
Jan 20, 2007
743
64
28
54
Pittsburgh
www.cellar-dweller.com
Yes just add these lines to the servers redorchestra.ini file put these under this section [Engine.GameEngine]

This will kill all zombie problems. Not all lines are needed just the ones where the proper uniforms for that map are needed - I just don't remember exactly which lines they were but all of this will NOT hurt to have.


ServerPackages=EH-M43Uniforms
ServerPackages=G_Late1StandardMod
ServerPackages=G_Late2StandardMod
ServerPackages=G_Late3StandardMod
ServerPackages=G_Late4StandardMod
ServerPackages=G_Late5StandardMod
ServerPackages=G_M43OakCamo1SSMod
ServerPackages=G_M43OakCamo2SSMod
ServerPackages=G_M43OakCamo3SSMod
ServerPackages=G_M43OakCamo4SSMod
ServerPackages=G_M43OakCamo5SSMod
ServerPackages=G_M43Standard1SSMod
ServerPackages=G_M43Standard2SSMod
ServerPackages=G_M43Standard3SSMod
ServerPackages=G_M43Standard4SSMod
ServerPackages=G_M43Standard5SSMod
ServerPackages=RKKA_M41TelogreikaUniforms
ServerPackages=RKKA_M41PaddedCoatAMod
ServerPackages=RKKA_M41PaddedCoatBMod
ServerPackages=RKKA_M41PaddedCoatCMod
ServerPackages=RKKA_M41PaddedCoatDMod
ServerPackages=RKKA_M41PaddedCoatEMod
ServerPackages=RKKA_M41PaddedCoatFMod
ServerPackages=RKKA_M41PaddedCoatGMod
ServerPackages=RKKA_M41PaddedCoatHMod
ServerPackages=RKKA_M41PaddedCoatIMod
ServerPackages=RKKA_M41PaddedCoatJMod
ServerPackages=R_Late1GreatcoatMod
ServerPackages=R_Late2GreatcoatMod
ServerPackages=R_Late3GreatcoatMod
ServerPackages=R_Late4GreatcoatMod
ServerPackages=R_Late5GreatcoatMod
ServerPackages=R_Late1StandardMod
ServerPackages=R_Late2StandardMod
ServerPackages=R_Late3StandardMod
ServerPackages=R_Late4StandardMod
ServerPackages=R_Late5StandardMod
ServerPackages=ROEffects
ServerPackages=ROEngine
ServerPackages=ROGame
ServerPackages=ROAmmo
ServerPackages=ROInventory
ServerPackages=ROInterface
ServerPackages=RORoles
ServerPackages=Volkssturm
ServerPackages=WaffenSSCamo44
ServerPackages=VS1MOD
ServerPackages=VS2MOD
ServerPackages=VS3MOD
ServerPackages=VS4MOD
ServerPackages=VS5MOD
ServerPackages=VS6MOD
ServerPackages=WSSCamo44_1MOD
ServerPackages=WSSCamo44_2MOD
ServerPackages=WSSCamo44_3MOD
ServerPackages=WSSCamo44_4MOD
ServerPackages=WSSCamo44_5MOD
ServerPackages=WSSCamo44_6MOD
ServerPackages=WSSCamo44Tanker1MOD
ServerPackages=WSSCamo44Tanker2MOD
ServerPackages=WSSCamo44Tanker3MOD
ServerPackages=WSSCamo44Tanker4MOD
ServerPackages=WSSCamo44Tanker5MOD
ServerPackages=WSSWinter1MOD
ServerPackages=WSSWinter2MOD
ServerPackages=WSSWinter3MOD
ServerPackages=WSSWinter4MOD
ServerPackages=WSSWinter5MOD
ServerPackages=WSSWinter6MOD
ServerPackages=WSSWinter7MOD
ServerPackages=WSSWinter8MOD
ServerPackages=WSSWinterTanker1MOD
 

[BW-UK]NorS

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jul 29, 2007
101
13
0
This is still a problem on our server asswell.... iwe adde all pacages witch kills the ZOMBI bugg, but caps must bee scrued up on this map:rolleyes:

Shot00103.jpg


You got to cap in a corect order! Exp. 1-2-3-4-5-6 ore it locks Brandenburgtor. Brandenburgertor is the only cap witch is bugger *** far *** i can find. Seen this on many servers!!!

Go 1-2-3-4-6.5 nr 5 will bee locked til germans take paritzer back...
Hope this made sence:D