Will you guys buy RO:HOS if there are no tanks?

[Floyd]

I hate it when I come late to a party....

Consider this post a:

Starwars double facepalm pic.
Starwars double facepalm pic.
Threes Stooges triple facepalm pic.

For those who watch too much US television: It would appear to me that more than a few posters stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night.... More that enough definitives to be sure.....

 

[The_Emperor]

I want my k

 

[reyalpOR]

I don't care about tank only maps and I'd still buy it, but the game would lose a lot of depth if there are no CA maps.

^^^This, for me.

As I said in another thread...I really liked how the DH team did some of the CA maps. Bois Jacques and Stoumont kept the number of tanks minimal, while having about 95% of the players as infantry.

However, I did not like (even though I still had fun ) maps such as Arad, Ogledow, or DH's Vieux where 95% of the players were in tanks and the remaining few infantry became really out of place.

 

[MEGADETHTHRETH]

So everyone says that in red orchestra ostfront, tanks were added in late and just as it would be coming out, so it must not not been that difficult to implement, also, they already did it for the first one so it makes things easier this time. I said that it can't be THAT hard to implement, I didn't say it easy or hard because I don't know, but it is something that has been done before in ostfront and other games, so I don't find what I said before so funny or stupid. If you all know the process that will be so hard to implement I would like to here it, honestly. It would be cool if someone could take me through the steps of making a realistic tank in a game since three of you seem to know.

 

[SheepDip]

Adding vehicles isn't difficult to do at all if you're talking a similar level of complexity to the standard vehicles in UT2004/UT3.

Tanks were added late into the Red Orchestra mod to make it Combined Arms - the MSU contest basically required the mod to implement vehicles in order to progress, and the early versions the tank combat were really (no disrespect to TWI) rough. The damage model was basic and it was usually a "who shot first" situation. It was vastly improved for RO:OST but still way off a level that would satisfy everyone.

The variables that go into a tank shooting at another tank - even on a lower level simulation that need to be modelled are considerable.

What tank/weapon fired the shot?
What tank/weapon is being shot at?
What range has the shot covered?
How fast was the round going when it hit?
What is its angle of impact vertically?
What was the angle of impact on the target horizontally?
How thick is the armour where it hit?
What is the likelyhood of achieving penetration on armour of thickness x at the angles y & z?
Where on the target is the shot?
Has it hit a track?
Did it hit an engine component?
Did it hit the ammo stores?
Would it have wounded a crew member?
Is the vehicle damaged already?
Was the vehicle was moving?
How fast was it going? And in which direction in relation to the impact?

These aren't the sorts of things that the Unreal Engine 3's default vehicle code allows a developer to just "tweak" in order to create something. As far as damage modelling goes, it's extremely limited.

There's a reason most sim-level (vehicle) games use bespoke game engines from the ground up...

 

[Lucan946]

Of course I will. RO is an infantry combat simulator at its heart.

 

[Kipper]

Megadeth, you're not listening. Tanks weren't added quickly before release. Tanks were added in for RO 3.0, if I recall the version number correctly, and were there through 3.3 and then retail nearly two years later. The tank system wasn't changed all that significantly between the mod and retail. Tripwire is now starting from scratch with a new version of the engine and any work on tanks will be from scratch. Given the scope and level of detail they've said they want for RO: HoS expecting tanks to be an intricate part of the game is a little much. I'm sure we'll see some AFVs in game. I doubt we're going to have more than a handful of large tank maps that being the case.

And really, just because an engine supports vehicles doesn't mean adding tanks is magically easy. There's a lot to do, as has been pointed out before. I mean, let's be honest, Source supports vehicles too, would you use that engine for detailed tank combat?

 

[Ermac]

God some of you people are just don't get it, Maybe there is a good chance that some of us play red orchestra for both experiences. TANKS AND INFANTRY. Why are you all saying one or the other, I don't get it. Have you never seen infantry and tank maps, why is there a need to have one over the other. Its far more immersive for both to be in. For instance, I like to blow up tanks with my panzershreck, so that means, no tanks, no bazookas, no ptrd, no panzerfaust, satchel charges, etc. and I mean in the way they were used and not for infantry. So that's some of the classes taken out. Infantry only maps are boring the same as tank only, when you combine them, the best times happen. Whether its small maps in a village with only 1 or 2 small tanks or even a big map with tanks and infantry, the immersion effects is phenomenal. I can understand the people that say they will buy it and be sad that there ain't any tanks, but the people that say get rid of them annoy me because why would you want less in a game? That is like saying "No I don't want the free heated seats, sunroof and air conditioning on the car". I don't get it, someone please enlighten me.

So you only liked tanks just to blow them up? I guess I did too.

 

[Hans Ludwig]

If all the infantry fanboys had their way this game would be an epic disaster.

You guys keep talking about the mod before it went retail as the greatest thing because it was only infantry and tanks destroyed RO. Yet you failed to mention no one knew about this "mod" because there was nothing spectacular about it. Gamers want tactical immerssion and a combined arms approach to video games. The days of 32 PvP on a small, linear map with only infantry are over.

Oh, and I want my tanks.

KTHX BAI

 

[Kipper]

If you guys want to wank over tanks and only tanks, you can play World of Tanks. It's in beta right now and has a ridiculous amount of tanks. And, it actually models more things than RO tanks do. You can't lose.

 

[Miro!]

How cant u buy the game dude ?
I dont understand.

 

[shea]

If you guys want to wank over tanks and only tanks, you can play World of Tanks. It's in beta right now and has a ridiculous amount of tanks. And, it actually models more things than RO tanks do. You can't lose.

What the hell are you talking about World of Tanks is more of a strategy game and or 3rd person view game,more than anything else,it is defo not a FPS,It looks like we have a few call of duty modern warfare 2 fans here,who want to run around like headless chickens on small maps.

 

[shea]

How cant u buy the game dude ?
I dont understand.

No Vehicles (TANKS) No chance,Just look at DH servers and RO,Most people are playing on tank and inf servers like PZDF,Jolly Rodgers,Pzd,etc.The way i see it is if RO:HOS dosen,t implement vehicles it just like the rest of the boring FPS,s out today

 

[Fedorov]

I'll buy it regardless, as it was already good enough for me before tanks were added, however...

I'm sure that the game WILL feature tanks... as tanks were an important part of the battle of Stalingrad, specially on the battles surrounding the city which were already mentioned to be featured.

If TWI really aims for history accuracy and realism, they just can't leave tanks out of this one.

 

[SheepDip]

If all the infantry fanboys had their way this game would be an epic disaster.

You guys keep talking about the mod before it went retail as the greatest thing because it was only infantry and tanks destroyed RO.

No one here said tanks "destroyed RO", or said that they don't want tanks or vehicle combat - just that it isn't a gamebreaker if they aren't there in the same way they are in RO:OST.

The infantry combat in RO:OST and whilst it was a mod - is/was far and above any other infantry combat fps around (except maybe Infiltration), the tank combat is (again, no disrespect to TWI) quite a long way from being on the same level as dedicated tank sims that are around. If RO:HOS is definitive in terms of infantry combat, and vehicular combat - then good for TWI!

Yet you failed to mention no one knew about this "mod" because there was nothing spectacular about it. Gamers want tactical immerssion and a combined arms approach to video games. The days of 32 PvP on a small, linear map with only infantry are over.

Yeah, no one knew about RO before 3.0...it's like a community just popped out of nowhere as soon as we all knew cool tanks like the IS2 and the Panther were coming...are you actually suggesting that the infantry v infantry (only) multiplayer will be a thing of the past?

All the media we've seen so far has been focussed on the infantry combat model. We're all expecting tanks, but if you're expecting them to be the focus of the game - I think you'll be disappointed.

 

[ButchCassidy]

The game looks wonderful and all the new stuff thats going to be added will bring in a heap load of new players into the community..

Vehicles will be a bonus in my opinion but not the end of the world if they are not included...

Stalingrad was infamous for its bitter house to house street fighting and immersing players into that kind of "edge of your seat" gameplay must surely be the priority of the game.

I can't wait to start clearing rooms/houses/streets with my Clan mates and all the tension of "whats waiting around the next corner" that comes with that type of gameplay..

Bring on the beta..

 

[SiC-Disaster]

I sure will still buy ROHOS.
I am an infantry guy at heart, and hardly ever touch tanks and usually leave a server when a tank map comes up.
I dont like hiding from the bayonet inside a tin can. Bring the cold steel, commie scum!

 

[MEGADETHTHRETH]

Adding vehicles isn't difficult to do at all if you're talking a similar level of complexity to the standard vehicles in UT2004/UT3.

Tanks were added late into the Red Orchestra mod to make it Combined Arms - the MSU contest basically required the mod to implement vehicles in order to progress, and the early versions the tank combat were really (no disrespect to TWI) rough. The damage model was basic and it was usually a "who shot first" situation. It was vastly improved for RO:OST but still way off a level that would satisfy everyone.

The variables that go into a tank shooting at another tank - even on a lower level simulation that need to be modelled are considerable.

What tank/weapon fired the shot?
What tank/weapon is being shot at?
What range has the shot covered?
How fast was the round going when it hit?
What is its angle of impact vertically?
What was the angle of impact on the target horizontally?
How thick is the armour where it hit?
What is the likelyhood of achieving penetration on armour of thickness x at the angles y & z?
Where on the target is the shot?
Has it hit a track?
Did it hit an engine component?
Did it hit the ammo stores?
Would it have wounded a crew member?
Is the vehicle damaged already?
Was the vehicle was moving?
How fast was it going? And in which direction in relation to the impact?

These aren't the sorts of things that the Unreal Engine 3's default vehicle code allows a developer to just "tweak" in order to create something. As far as damage modelling goes, it's extremely limited.

There's a reason most sim-level (vehicle) games use bespoke game engines from the ground up...

Ok, that fine, but are tripwire not just going for this same simple system this time as they did with the first game, ie. whoever sees first approach. Because they didn't announce any complicated system, but that would be real nice to see, but if what you said is true about the engine being limited then, it can't be done?
I'd rather have tanks that are the same system but better, than the first game rather than have no tanks at all, the advanced tank system would be great and probably would attract more than the average fps shooter people, it would attract people that play all those simulation tank games like tiger vs t-34 steel fury and steel beasts players too. I'm sure in 1 month we will find out.

If you guys want to wank over tanks and only tanks, you can play World of Tanks. It's in beta right now and has a ridiculous amount of tanks. And, it actually models more things than RO tanks do. You can't lose.

LOL, World of tanks from what I saw looks arcadey, there was red outlines of enemy tanks and there is 3rd person view, however I only saw it once or twice, plus I don't like tank only games, boring. And I hate the tank only maps in Red Orchestra where you have about 20 tank crewman on each team, I like the ones where there is infantry, like snipers who shoot the tank commanders head off when hes out of the hatch and Anti tank guys who blow the tanks that's coming into cap a point. But the best is the combined arms where there is only very few tanks and lots of infantry, the tanks are just so dominant in these maps because the AT men cant get close enough to blow them up because of the infantry. But anyway, I don't like infantry or tanks separate, I like them both in the same map with exceptions of course.

 

[Drecks]

Did anyone tried to turn the question around ??
So to feed my neverending curiosity for pointless discussions.

Would you buy RO HOS when it don't have infantry ?

 

[NoxNoctum]

Did anyone tried to turn the question around ??
So to feed my neverending curiosity for pointless discussions.

Would you buy RO HOS when it don't have infantry ?

Now if it didn't have infantry, I wouldn't buy it. But that's kind of a dumb question, because it's obvious that there is infantry. In every video so far that's been their sole focus, as it should be.