Not sure why the M99 and Railguns are being switched this like. Seems a very odd decision. It's obvious which should be better and higher tier.
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Summer Update Second Beta Changelog
- Thread starter Yoshiro
- Start date
Can you please roolback all "reload cancellation fixes", the game really becames unplayable for me with out it, really. I know you consider this an bug, but this is an very important feature for advanced players and its very fun to play with it, and sucks with out it.
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So now, you can no longer Block while reloading the Eviscerator & took out another method of reloading cancelling. Anymore surprises?
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Please, rollback the reload cancellation fixes. It added more depth to the gameplay and made the game more interesting for me.
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my problems are as follows: The point of the upgrade system was to diversify the weapons meta, right? Well it only reinforces it. The "bad" weapons are still bad, even upgraded, While the good weapons are still usable/godly upgraded.
Take the scar and AK-12: upgrade both to tier 5, and the damage breakpoints they hit on small zeds are the same (you save a bullet on husk headshots with the scar i think; thats it.) while the ak-12 has 15 more bullets per mag and makes scrake killing so easy. They both kill bots equally as well too, so what is the point? OFC the only choice here is AK-12...
Ditto for railgun, ditto for aa-12 + double barrel
Firebug still has no large zed take down, bezerk can still kill scrakes and FP, but the scrake takedown got a lot harder, and needs parry bonuses, and the FP takedown got messy.
Husk cannon went from stupidly OP to useless, cant kill FP anymore, which is what really made it intresting, while the microwave guns alt fire still cant really incap big zeds other the non rages scrakes. Spitfires are useless, so is the trenchgun compared to the SMG, which burn through its ammo so fast, and the UMP upgraded once can 1 hit heashot gore fasts off-perk.
And while we are at it: perk choices... there are so many bad ones!... I mean, siren resistance vs frag shells (which are arguably a downgrade) for demo, hollow point rounds vs eat lead, heatwave vs firestorm and bring the heat vs HCFT... All these choices are so one sided...
The upgrade system is something im ok with, but it makes so many weapons sub-par, others OP, and the perk skill builds are still as rigid as ever.
Take the scar and AK-12: upgrade both to tier 5, and the damage breakpoints they hit on small zeds are the same (you save a bullet on husk headshots with the scar i think; thats it.) while the ak-12 has 15 more bullets per mag and makes scrake killing so easy. They both kill bots equally as well too, so what is the point? OFC the only choice here is AK-12...
Ditto for railgun, ditto for aa-12 + double barrel
Firebug still has no large zed take down, bezerk can still kill scrakes and FP, but the scrake takedown got a lot harder, and needs parry bonuses, and the FP takedown got messy.
Husk cannon went from stupidly OP to useless, cant kill FP anymore, which is what really made it intresting, while the microwave guns alt fire still cant really incap big zeds other the non rages scrakes. Spitfires are useless, so is the trenchgun compared to the SMG, which burn through its ammo so fast, and the UMP upgraded once can 1 hit heashot gore fasts off-perk.
And while we are at it: perk choices... there are so many bad ones!... I mean, siren resistance vs frag shells (which are arguably a downgrade) for demo, hollow point rounds vs eat lead, heatwave vs firestorm and bring the heat vs HCFT... All these choices are so one sided...
The upgrade system is something im ok with, but it makes so many weapons sub-par, others OP, and the perk skill builds are still as rigid as ever.
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thag;n2320590 said:
Have not played Zerker yet (so will not comment about Eviscerator) (actually, since Eviscerator got nerfed at first beta do not like berserker that much), but I kinda agree about M99 and Doomstick
But not 100% and at first also felt like... "WTF Tripwire"
It is not so bad for doomstick, but a bit worse for M99. But in both cases they are "okay" if you do not upgrade weapons. And do not forget about mighty 9MM.
In case of Doomstick, it is possible to buy Doomstick and M4 Shotgun and you still have one extra slot for healing pistol (or maybe upgrade for M4, did not check how much upgrade weights). Well M4 is not as fast as AA12 in shooting and reload, but it is quite powerful and with doomstick it hs enough ammo to clear the wave (specially at higher levels, when ammo capacity gets bigger) (unless team dies, then have fun searching ammo boxes) (and since i do not want to prestige support atm, do not know if level 0 support can even carry 20 units). Keep in mind, that doomstick is meant to be large zed killing weapon, so it should be used... as you me guess, for large zeds mostly
But for Sharpshooter and M99 story is harder
Because only reasonable loadout with M99 seems to be with Magnum revolver. Rest in peace, if team does not kill trash-zeds.
I had an idea, to decrease its weight to 10 (from 11), so it could be used with Centerfire, but that is stupid, since Railgun weights 9 units already. Not easy to balance. Maybe it would be good idea to allow sharpshooter to carry 16 units and make Winchester weight 4 units. Dunno... What I mean, I agree, that with M99 Sharpshooter becomes useless in means of general Zed killing and deals only with bosses or large zeds, which is not that bad if team is good and helps sharpshooter to shoot those big things without beeing interupted by trash-zeds
Of course, these things I mentioned also means no upgrades which kinda sucks... like - you can buy weapon you are used to, you can crank it up... and forget that there are more weapons that could save in different situations. Or use loadout you want and forget about upgrades.
Upgrades is the thing that makes it difficult to balance, because everyone wants at least one upgraded weapon that is not 9MM
DeadPlayer123;n2320593 said:
Well, reload cancelling was kinda bug, I also support idea of rollback.
But I would suggest to just make reload speeds a bit faster to most of the weapons, to somehow compensate lack of this "bug" almost all community is used to. I think it would be reasonable
By the way, did not someone mention EMP blast from EDAR, that gets killed in weakspot in chest?
That is my two cents, good job + played all day, no lags and saw my hands all the time
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Vapid;n2320559 said:
Especially when it doesn't take glock mags.
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Yoshiro;n2320521 said:
So, i recently crunched some numbers. In Beta 2, the M99 deals 850 damage. In Beta 1, the M99 dealt 637 / 850 / 955 damage per tier. Now in Beta 2 you turned it into T5, but took the damage of the T4-variant in previous beta. Why?
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So I'm in the 33rd wave on 6P HOE, zerkers and medics all dead...
I must have cleared 200 zeds on my own as gunslinger before your amazing game code spawned a scrake directly behind me in zed time...
The game was still winnable but I decided to quit from console anyway because it's been _YEARS_ now that you people have had to fix the spawn points...
You're obviously all either trolling or just retarded, but either way I quit for now, enough's enough
I must have cleared 200 zeds on my own as gunslinger before your amazing game code spawned a scrake directly behind me in zed time...
The game was still winnable but I decided to quit from console anyway because it's been _YEARS_ now that you people have had to fix the spawn points...
You're obviously all either trolling or just retarded, but either way I quit for now, enough's enough
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Good to see that you listen to the community, the Beta 2 notes reflect that, but also create some points of discussion.
E.D.A.Rs: Now feels great, but need a little bit more to reach a good spot. The EMP will be added later, I assume? Or am I just having bad aim? Further, I like how they walk slowly and does not dodge when they been decapitated, was that intended? It's great nevertheless. I can definitely see them as a good implementation into the game.
Weapon Upgrade System: Man, I am not fond of it now. Before the betas I felt like you could make do with using a lower tier weapon, like if you put restrictions on yourself, challenging your ability with the perk, but now you can actually make it clearly viable but not as good as the T3-5 which still remains the better options. It feels bad, committing into a lower tier weapon for a game, perhaps not filling a niche in your group depending on what weapon you picked all the way to the end. I think that the Upgrade System should be separated from Survival, to keep the game close to it's roots. Adding it to Endless or a separate new mode instead.
Nerfs & Buffs: M99 need to have an edge and Railgun a nische now that they been separated but I am generally happy with the M99, so maybe make Railgun stun more often? Faster reload? Make penetrating shots not lose as much damage?
Doomstick was overnerfed I feel. I'm on the "Revert-Damage-and-make-it-T5"-train and please change the world-echoing sound coming from it.
Husk Cannon could use more damage. Less then it's first iteration but more then it had in either beta. And keep working on that MWG, we'll soon get it into a good spot again.
The "Fallback" perks being nerfed is fine by me. 9mm should be a backup, not hot stuff preferred over the main weapons.
Overall this beta is closer to what I'd like to see, but a big part still remains to be solved and that is what the Upgrade System should be. A integral part running through the whole game which will see alot of time and energy put into it to keep evolving it? A system used for one or two modes which add variety and incentive to be more economic? Or perhaps not fitting into the game at all? I know I am for the 2nd alternative, but I prefer the main part of the game to be simple and think the Live version is in a good spot right now, what will you commit to, TWI?
/DreaderVII
E.D.A.Rs: Now feels great, but need a little bit more to reach a good spot. The EMP will be added later, I assume? Or am I just having bad aim? Further, I like how they walk slowly and does not dodge when they been decapitated, was that intended? It's great nevertheless. I can definitely see them as a good implementation into the game.
Weapon Upgrade System: Man, I am not fond of it now. Before the betas I felt like you could make do with using a lower tier weapon, like if you put restrictions on yourself, challenging your ability with the perk, but now you can actually make it clearly viable but not as good as the T3-5 which still remains the better options. It feels bad, committing into a lower tier weapon for a game, perhaps not filling a niche in your group depending on what weapon you picked all the way to the end. I think that the Upgrade System should be separated from Survival, to keep the game close to it's roots. Adding it to Endless or a separate new mode instead.
Nerfs & Buffs: M99 need to have an edge and Railgun a nische now that they been separated but I am generally happy with the M99, so maybe make Railgun stun more often? Faster reload? Make penetrating shots not lose as much damage?
Doomstick was overnerfed I feel. I'm on the "Revert-Damage-and-make-it-T5"-train and please change the world-echoing sound coming from it.
Husk Cannon could use more damage. Less then it's first iteration but more then it had in either beta. And keep working on that MWG, we'll soon get it into a good spot again.
The "Fallback" perks being nerfed is fine by me. 9mm should be a backup, not hot stuff preferred over the main weapons.
Overall this beta is closer to what I'd like to see, but a big part still remains to be solved and that is what the Upgrade System should be. A integral part running through the whole game which will see alot of time and energy put into it to keep evolving it? A system used for one or two modes which add variety and incentive to be more economic? Or perhaps not fitting into the game at all? I know I am for the 2nd alternative, but I prefer the main part of the game to be simple and think the Live version is in a good spot right now, what will you commit to, TWI?
/DreaderVII
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Result from removing bash reload cancelation :
- 50% less servers and players.
Thanks for the fix TW. I will go back to the original until you fix it.
- 50% less servers and players.
Thanks for the fix TW. I will go back to the original until you fix it.
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After playing:
The EDARS are much less tanky which is good. They make more noise when shooting at you which is also good. The Trapper range reduction is great. So much better. Getting trapped every 2 seconds was dumb. Their looks are not great but overall they are much less enraging and more fun. On their looks, something more like a zed with blood and guts would be better.
The upgrade system is just not doing it for me. The way weapons and their stats were done before the beta was much better. M99 is too expensive. Rail gun is actually nice after playing with it!
Doomstick is ok, but I much prefer using other weapons.
Husk Cannon is viable again thank you! It could benefit from a slight damage boost but it's a good weapon again.
The EDARS are much less tanky which is good. They make more noise when shooting at you which is also good. The Trapper range reduction is great. So much better. Getting trapped every 2 seconds was dumb. Their looks are not great but overall they are much less enraging and more fun. On their looks, something more like a zed with blood and guts would be better.
The upgrade system is just not doing it for me. The way weapons and their stats were done before the beta was much better. M99 is too expensive. Rail gun is actually nice after playing with it!
Doomstick is ok, but I much prefer using other weapons.
Husk Cannon is viable again thank you! It could benefit from a slight damage boost but it's a good weapon again.
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DeadPlayer123;n2320662 said:
That's quite a leap. I suspect the truth is that not many server owners have either partaken in the beta at all or they haven't patched to beta 2.
Having said that, I'd be really, really happy if they allowed the Berserker to parry properly again. I'm kind of hoping that if I keep saying it, eventually it'll happen.
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RawrUK;n2320676 said:
What's wrong with parrying? A couple of my parries lately haven't worked but as a zerker who uses the parry skill I'd say that's the least of KF2's concerns...
http://steamcharts.com/app/232090
This chart speaks for itself; note how new players bail just as quickly as they're tempted in... The worst part is the game is comprised of 99% awesomeness with the 1% being insufferable problems that drive most players away so at this point I feel like half of my 1k hours have been pissed up the wall
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ShingoMurata;n2320679 said:
That's not bad. It seems on average at any given time, there's nearly 4000 players online. Obviously the population peaks when updates come, but those who uninstall for silly **** are probably not worth wasting time on.
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Dr. Lethal;n2320688 said:
Hehe. Cute. I do love how toxic the community has become, but at least it was actually a breath of fresh air to come across new players who haven't been tainted yet and are very nice even if they need more carrying than usual...
I and the others who echo my thoughts all have thousands of hours and have generated god knows how much in market commissions, but as I implied, this kind of bite-the-hand-that-feeds mentality is why it's a "not bad" chart (under the circumstances) and not a great one with signs of any real momentum being built... It _should_ be even fivefold more by now and even I was shocked to see the stagnation there after a year still but it speaks for itself like I said
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