I have no issues with bayonets, this sounds like a lag issue, whats your ping during this? Also, it helps to charge your bayonet.
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melee system desperatly needs an update
- Thread starter Jolly Jew
- Start date
I have no issues with bayonets, this sounds like a lag issue, whats your ping during this? Also, it helps to charge your bayonet.
To be honest I would say to anyone that, if you rage at failure, this *might* not be the game for you. The realistic abundance of failed tries, random deaths, and hidden gotchas DO make the fewer successes more satisfying, but you have to be able to roll with the punches. A lot of punches.
I for one have basically no trouble at all getting what I want out of the melee system. But I sympathize.
I for one have basically no trouble at all getting what I want out of the melee system. But I sympathize.
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Melee is currently unrealistically difficult. I wouldn't mind harder aiming, more weight penalty, slower bolting, more suppression, but killing somebody with a bayonet should not be this challenging.
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Maybe for RO3....
I'd love to be able to bayonet parry & then fencing with bayonets along with a alt melee allowing you to also bash the fecka with your rifle butt if you so please. This would only be for rifles though & only under certian conditions like IRL (i.e. facing attacker).
Also like to see combat spades / entrenching tools available as maybe a hero melee weapon for other classes. These were especially popular with the frontovicki in Stalingrad to the point were they slept on their spade & carved their names into the handles. I reckon you could have alot of fun tip toeing around urban maps with your spade, a pistol, & grenades!
I'd love to be able to bayonet parry & then fencing with bayonets along with a alt melee allowing you to also bash the fecka with your rifle butt if you so please. This would only be for rifles though & only under certian conditions like IRL (i.e. facing attacker).
Also like to see combat spades / entrenching tools available as maybe a hero melee weapon for other classes. These were especially popular with the frontovicki in Stalingrad to the point were they slept on their spade & carved their names into the handles. I reckon you could have alot of fun tip toeing around urban maps with your spade, a pistol, & grenades!
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OK well... I disagree. I think it SHOULD be very challenging, as killing someone hand-to-hand actually seems to me to be much more difficult and risky than shooting them. Hence all the training. And I don't think it's all that difficult now to begin with. *shrug* It almost never fails for me.
But I respect your differing opinion.
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Melee fighting in 2nd world war was completly ineffective. Look at the results of japanese suicide charges.
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Modern media gives people the impression that once you're in range, stabbing someone is as easy as making the effort to, and it really is harder than that.
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True. But the difficult part should be bayonet fencing (though it would be very uncommon in RO2 even if implemented), not hitting a standing or slow-moving target. And the risky part should be getting in range, not having an enemy survive a gruesome bayonet wound and shoot back.
I think it's because the Japanese couldn't actually reach the melee range. Not because they couldn't stab without missing all the time and not because Americans shrugged off bayonet wounds as mere scratches.
Is it really harder if the enemy is unaware, for example? It seems to me that situations when the enemy would block or parry your strike are unusual in RO2.
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Do you really have trouble if the enemy is unaware? You should check your connection or do a better job aiming.
This all depended on where your reading. Some units were very effective at melee combat. Especially the germans, though they mostly used their spades over their bayonets.
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The realism/classic thing comes into this I find. In classic I find bayonets fairly consistently either kill or mortally injure people, while one or two other melee attacks will do the same. In realism though I'm constantly frustrated by people simply shooting me and bandaging the bayonet wound right afterwards.
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no it's not, unless the enemy dodges the thrust -as in, jump or run away, not take a step backwards- or parry the blow, he is dead.
right now stabbing an enemy while moving is nearly impossible, you have to stop, and release the melee exatly 1 meter if front of him. and then pray that your stab didn't hit is stomach or shoulder otherwise you basically did 0 damage.
again, hand to hand combat was effective in WWII because if you got in melee range he will be be able to shoot at you because the gun is too large to manuever properly in tight spaces.
but in this game if the enemy got in range there is a high chance he will just stab the air around you, allowing for an easy potshot.
im willing to bet the bayonet never gave you prolems becuase you only used it against stationary and/or unaware enemies
if you would really like to prove me wrong.
please present real evidence that someone charged at the enemy and just stabbed thin air instead of the enemy. then i will belive you, but im pretty sure you will won't find any of that because you have to either be a complete idiot or 100% lack hand to eye coordination to miss a stab at point blank range.
just look at CoD:WaW, RO2's spiritual predecesor, it had fluent melee combat, and no one ever complained about it - if the enemy was in range and in your view your character would succefully stab him, making bayonets a worthy attachment not not a little decoration.
but if you people hate CoD so much, just make stabs insta kills anywhere and increase the width of its range.
because someone who managed to get close enough to the enemy live long enough to stab him, should be rewarded, and not screwed over!
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It really is. I'm talking about reality here, why do you think they had to train people on just stabbing with a bayonet? Blades don't track people, plus handling a big long stick of any size is always awkward. And I can personally say that I, as a human, have missed large stationary objects with all sorts of melee weapons, including the thrusting type.
That said, If you sneak up on someone and it still doesn't work, you might have some kind of latency problem.
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Cod:waw came out in 2008. RO: Ostfront came out in 2006. Please do a little research before you make comments.
Real melee combat isn't fluent. Unless the target is totally unaware its not gonna be just "walk up, stab, move on." If bayonets are so effective then why did veterans prefer their shovel for melee?
I dont hate COD its just a different sub-genre of FPS, it falls heavily on the unrealistic side. Trying to add unrealistic features to a game that falls on the realistic side is not gonna go well with the gameplay or with the community.
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This whole argument reminds how ridiculously STUPID and easy it was to melee stab and kill someone in BFBC2? I could fire countless rounds into an enemy at close/moderate range and NOTHING and the enemy would still survive, yet I was super master ninja knife guy that could kill anyone remotely within range with just the click of a key, easy as pie. So dumb and unrealistic. I wish my clan never got into that game.
That said, the RO2 system is slightly clunky but I would bet you have a latency problem Jolly.
That said, the RO2 system is slightly clunky but I would bet you have a latency problem Jolly.
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I beg to differ. I don't see enemies missing their bayonet attacks on me very often at all.
JJ said:
Well there's something to that, most of my bayonet kills are on at least partially unsuspecting enemies, yes. But by no means all of them. Every night that I play, I usually at least a handful of times end up charging straight (zig-zag) at an aware and firing enemy, and probably about half the time, I end up with a melee kill out of the exchange. The Japanese Banzai effect for instance is not to be underestimated.
I don't think CoD arguments are going to fly here. So they had insta-kill on melee? Well that's lame because successful melee attacks in real life are by no means always fatal. Not all stabs end up skewering vital organs or achieving full penetration. How would you take that reality into account?
Dude... he IS rewarded. He gets a kill quite often, and when he does get the kill, it isn't the kill that's his real reward... its the glory. The thrill of victory vs the agony of defeat. Melee killing someone who is shooting at you is one of the greatest joys of the game (and not because its easy).
JJ said:
Ladies and gentlemen of the jury... the defense rests.
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Ive found that if you just hold the fire key and stab, it will not kill immediately but if you hold the fire key down for several seconds (charging the strike) it kills instantly every time. At least it does for me.
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nope, won't do jack if you hit his shoulder or lower part of the torso.
for the BFBC argument, i don't think i need to remind you that it takes an avarage of 7 bullets to kill someone in that game. try getting knife kills in hardcore mode.
as for jank. i get enemies missing their bayonet at me a lot, each time after i kill them i tell them "hope you learned never to use this terrible combat mechanic again". and even if they do hit, i still survive, kill him, and patch up.
and even if the stab is not realistically fatal, the enemy should still be neutralized, no one can fire his rifle while a heavy man is pressing a spear down his stomach, but in this game it's very common.
as for the thrill and glory, you basically confirm my statement that melee combat in this game is simply novelty and not a feature that has any tactical uses
for the BFBC argument, i don't think i need to remind you that it takes an avarage of 7 bullets to kill someone in that game. try getting knife kills in hardcore mode.
as for jank. i get enemies missing their bayonet at me a lot, each time after i kill them i tell them "hope you learned never to use this terrible combat mechanic again". and even if they do hit, i still survive, kill him, and patch up.
and even if the stab is not realistically fatal, the enemy should still be neutralized, no one can fire his rifle while a heavy man is pressing a spear down his stomach, but in this game it's very common.
as for the thrill and glory, you basically confirm my statement that melee combat in this game is simply novelty and not a feature that has any tactical uses
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Well I mean, it is :/
Melee is a last resort thing, no one ever did that if they had a choice.
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