wai... what? how did fullmj not get in top 3???
Well i felt it would be unfair for me to submit it as clearly no other map comes close in comparison to it
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Mapping Contest Phase I Results
- Thread starter [TW]Wilsonam
- Start date
Well i felt it would be unfair for me to submit it as clearly no other map comes close in comparison to it
.Well i felt it would be unfair for me to submit it as clearly no other map comes close in comparison to it
Very public spiritted of you sprad.
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this is rather obvious to me as well. I frankly wonder what the critera were, who was judging, and what maps they happen to favor during their personal play time.
by any reasonable objective standard, it's not only the best map in the contest, it's the best map for the game of RO:O.
those, like it or not, are the facts my friends.
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Congratulations to the three winners! I have played all three maps at various times and I enjoy all of them enough to say you all surely deserve your prizes!
Kurland has great atmosphere, a very immersive winter infantry skirmish experience--Brrrr! I love this map for bolt rifles!
Berezina, what can I say, I was amazed when I first played this map, I was telling my friends about this great new map. What I like the most is its realistic look and feel, and the scale. Where some maps are like skirmishes, this map has the feel of an epic battle with distinct phases, and the ending has a truly climactic atmosphere; I can almost hear the orchestral music in the background as the germans try to push across the river with the Russians give it all they have in their last hope to defend. If I have the misfortune to be on a team that loses its reinforcements, I love to roam over the battlefield admiring a bird's eye view in spectator mode, it looks beautiful, especially the west bank with the trees and ruined tanks!
Black Day July I have played through its many versions and it is possibly my favorite map to go tanking in. I have not played the latest version enough to give my final judgement but aesthetically it looks great, has an ominous feeling, like any tanker has to be thinking "I don't want to die out here". Had some really fun experiences on this map, and there is nothing like advancing round that south side as part of a line of Russian tank teams all anticipating the big encounter with those panzers that will be coming over the hill....
anyways, I was disappointed not to see a short list of honorable mentions...a contest like this is a way for good quality custom maps to get some publicity so that more servers will add them to their rotation. Surely there were perhaps 3 more maps that deserve an honorable mentions to get a boost in server time?
Kurland has great atmosphere, a very immersive winter infantry skirmish experience--Brrrr! I love this map for bolt rifles!
Berezina, what can I say, I was amazed when I first played this map, I was telling my friends about this great new map. What I like the most is its realistic look and feel, and the scale. Where some maps are like skirmishes, this map has the feel of an epic battle with distinct phases, and the ending has a truly climactic atmosphere; I can almost hear the orchestral music in the background as the germans try to push across the river with the Russians give it all they have in their last hope to defend. If I have the misfortune to be on a team that loses its reinforcements, I love to roam over the battlefield admiring a bird's eye view in spectator mode, it looks beautiful, especially the west bank with the trees and ruined tanks!
Black Day July I have played through its many versions and it is possibly my favorite map to go tanking in. I have not played the latest version enough to give my final judgement but aesthetically it looks great, has an ominous feeling, like any tanker has to be thinking "I don't want to die out here". Had some really fun experiences on this map, and there is nothing like advancing round that south side as part of a line of Russian tank teams all anticipating the big encounter with those panzers that will be coming over the hill....
anyways, I was disappointed not to see a short list of honorable mentions...a contest like this is a way for good quality custom maps to get some publicity so that more servers will add them to their rotation. Surely there were perhaps 3 more maps that deserve an honorable mentions to get a boost in server time?
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erm, yeah "objective standard"
that's all standards should be dude, is objective, in a contest like this. "subjective standard", as a concept, makes no sense. it just means personal preference.
it's rather simple, frankly.
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that's all standards should be dude, is objective, in a contest like this. "subjective standard", as a concept, makes no sense. it just means personal preference.
it's rather simple, frankly.
sorry, mapping is nothing that can be measured, its all about preferences.
Its not a file format, procedure, protocol.
If you think a map is good or not is merely your own perception (or that of the judges in this case)
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Heinz - I don't normally get inspired to have a go like this but you are just saying here that your opinion is a fact, rather than an opinion.
I personally am not aware of any objective standard (reasonable or otherwise) by which any person can say that a map is incontrovertibly, objectively 'better' than others - all I can do is what the judges did and say that in my opinion X map is better than Y map.
You have made no secret of the fact of where your sympathies lie in this contest. Fine. But to imply that the judges' motives were suspect because they did not share your enthusiasm to the same extent as you is specious to say the very least.
If you disagree with the opinion of a judge it would be valid to say that you disagree, not that you have empirical evidence to back up your disagreement.
I think it is rather indicative of the level of debate that certain people may now assume that I dislike Berezina. This is not true - all I can say is that I am glad I did not have the job of judging and making this call.
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erm, yeah "objective standard"
To further go off topic: Find anyone's list of objective movie evaluation criteria. I'll bet I could successfully argue that Lethal Weapon 2 is the finest movie ever made.
/Patsy Kensit ftw
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There are plenty of screenshots and discussions in the /beta section of the Level Design forums.
I am sure the judges had a list of criteria/catagories and a point scale where each participant rated each map on each item. A total of points certainly came through in the end. I would expect the totals to be fairly close. Personal preference certainly would come through to a degree but if you scored each map as objectively as you can, you do all the justice you can to the mapper. I certainly would dock myself points for a few things. Like I said before, three items were sure to cost Berezina points. I think it is a unique map and does something no other RO map did before or since, to date. That can be improved upon, however, and I certainly have more ideas than capability for the map and RO at this point. It will be back for phase 2 and it will contain improvements and new vehicles. I promise that.
I wanted the map to become an epic that would set a new standard. I think by virtue of community reaction, I accomplished that. None of that, however, diminishes the accomplishments of the other mappers in this community and the competition. Everyone of them should be proud as should be the members of the community who took the time to play and to comment/offer suggestions. It all adds up to a better product and we mappers couldn't be as effective without you.
I am sure the judges had a list of criteria/catagories and a point scale where each participant rated each map on each item. A total of points certainly came through in the end. I would expect the totals to be fairly close. Personal preference certainly would come through to a degree but if you scored each map as objectively as you can, you do all the justice you can to the mapper. I certainly would dock myself points for a few things. Like I said before, three items were sure to cost Berezina points. I think it is a unique map and does something no other RO map did before or since, to date. That can be improved upon, however, and I certainly have more ideas than capability for the map and RO at this point. It will be back for phase 2 and it will contain improvements and new vehicles. I promise that.
I wanted the map to become an epic that would set a new standard. I think by virtue of community reaction, I accomplished that. None of that, however, diminishes the accomplishments of the other mappers in this community and the competition. Everyone of them should be proud as should be the members of the community who took the time to play and to comment/offer suggestions. It all adds up to a better product and we mappers couldn't be as effective without you.
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From here: http://www.maporchestra.com/downloads/p13_sectionid/23/p13_fileid/280
Congratulations for the winners, your maps fantastic. Can't wait to see the phase II entries, I hope they are as high quality as the blitzkrieg-winning maps.
One thing though, Tripwire folks, next time you post the results, I'd like to see a list of honorable mentions included like suggested before.
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Many thanks to all the mappers for their time and hard work. We regular players really appreciate your efforts and your maps.
Many thanks to TWI for promoting additions and improvements to a great game.
Congratulations to the winners!
I must confess that Berezina is my favorite of the three for it's size and style of play. Kurland is also very nice and is one of my favorite maps. I'm afraid I haven't played Black Day July as much as I would have liked. In fact, I've only played it once. It looked nice but I wasn't on it long enough to learn how it really plays. I don't get to play RO much these days so I haven't had time to learn the tanks well. I don't like playing tank-only maps because I'd feel more like a liability than an asset to my team. Maybe over the holidays I can get some tank practice and play that map again.
Again, thanks to all involved and congratulations to the winners.
Many thanks to TWI for promoting additions and improvements to a great game.
Congratulations to the winners!
I must confess that Berezina is my favorite of the three for it's size and style of play. Kurland is also very nice and is one of my favorite maps. I'm afraid I haven't played Black Day July as much as I would have liked. In fact, I've only played it once. It looked nice but I wasn't on it long enough to learn how it really plays. I don't get to play RO much these days so I haven't had time to learn the tanks well. I don't like playing tank-only maps because I'd feel more like a liability than an asset to my team. Maybe over the holidays I can get some tank practice and play that map again.
Again, thanks to all involved and congratulations to the winners.
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I assume that maps that we will see in Phase 2 are not public and work on them is kinda in secret. I have to say that I am realy looking forward to THEM
They need to be tested - my guess is that the main entrants are going to be the ones you can see in Beta testing about now. There may be one or two that come from out of nowhere but not many.
You should also see that there aren't any quantum leaps in terms of the amount of time the maps appear to have had spent on them as most of the maps entered into the first phase had been in development long before the compo was announced.
The only possible exceptions to the previous statement are maps that will be entered for phase 2 that were already in development when the whole competition was announced *cough - Leningrad*.
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I am working on a map from scratch its called RoterBoden (Red Soil) its in beta testing with my clan TAW. Extra time is welcome but i dont mind if not.
Devs could you please change the date on the RULES page for the competition deadline because i dont know which to go by, i dont want my map handing in 2 months late.
Devs could you please change the date on the RULES page for the competition deadline because i dont know which to go by, i dont want my map handing in 2 months late.
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I was not a judge, obviously, however if the contest was well structured (not saying it was not), there would have been specified criteria as follows (for example):
1. Aesthetic (map layout, creativity, mapping ability, use of available graphics/features/terrain, etc.).
2. Game Play - how does the game of RO:O play out on the map. This includes play balance, use of available vehicles, infantry types, vehicle and infantry load outs, round times, and map size relative to the game play.
3. Historical Accuracy - this would be an important category here for many of us, not to others. But this area, if used, is ripe for objective scrutiny.
4. Map as promoting RO:O - does the map promote the "best" of RO:O, in terms of it's uniqueness (RO's uniqueness), and does it promote and/or use all the features of RO:O.
5. Intagibles - this category would leave some wiggle room for a little subjective "gravy", where points could be given for some relatively important area that the judge thinks is important. things like "ambience", "game feel", etc. things of that nature.
If all of the judges had to run through catagories like this, and vote on some pre-determined point scale, you'd have a scoring basis that would ba as close to objective as possible. Like in the Olympics. Athletes are judged on certain catagories.
As such, my opinion is that some level of objective analysis is possible.
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