Here is some context into the amount of work that goes into a game like KF2.

[weeman2412]

I'm still waiting for the mutator that disables player sprinting, disables increased movement speed on zeds per difficulty, and also a mod that keeps big zed raging as predictable as possible for fun gameplay.

That way I can have fun on HoE with a crap load of zed without having to worry about bs zed movements or op'ness of big zeds. Basically Killing Floor 1 with better graphics. I hope this is top priority for some master Killing Floor modders out there.

 

[vealck]

I'm still waiting for the mutator that disables player sprinting, disables increased movement speed on zeds per difficulty, and also a mod that keeps big zed raging as predictable as possible for fun gameplay.

That way I can have fun on HoE with a crap load of zed without having to worry about bs zed movements or op'ness of big zeds. Basically Killing Floor 1 with better graphics. I hope this is top priority for some master Killing Floor modders out there.

Don't forget about fast weapon switching and disabled camera shake.

Would be a nice mod indeed.

 

[YtsorF]

With all the craziness that happened in KF1 thanks to the mutators in that game, I'm sure that some equally crazy stuff will be done in this game as well.

 

[CJx101]

I'm still waiting for the mutator that disables player sprinting, disables increased movement speed on zeds per difficulty, and also a mod that keeps big zed raging as predictable as possible for fun gameplay.

That way I can have fun on HoE with a crap load of zed without having to worry about bs zed movements or op'ness of big zeds. Basically Killing Floor 1 with better graphics. I hope this is top priority for some master Killing Floor modders out there.

+1 from me. As boring as it may seem to some ppl, KF1 + KF2's graphics would be exactly what I'm looking for. Unless they can add some better balance to this game that is.

 

[Quadruplesword]

I'm still waiting for the mutator that disables player sprinting, disables increased movement speed on zeds per difficulty, and also a mod that keeps big zed raging as predictable as possible for fun gameplay.

That way I can have fun on HoE with a crap load of zed without having to worry about bs zed movements or op'ness of big zeds. Basically Killing Floor 1 with better graphics. I hope this is top priority for some master Killing Floor modders out there.

No offense... but I hate it when people think this way. Why would you want the sequel to just be the first game with prettier graphics? That's the kind of thinking that allows big publishers to lazily pump out yearly sequels. The whole point of a sequel is to innovate and build upon the original. Yeah there might be some growing pains along the way, not the least of which is the current state of KF2's balancing, but if the end product ends up being even more awesome than the first then it was worth the trouble.

 

[DirtySpartan]

No offense... but I hate it when people think this way. Why would you want the sequel to just be the first game with prettier graphics? That's the kind of thinking that allows big publishers to lazily pump out yearly sequels. The whole point of a sequel is to innovate and build upon the original. Yeah there might be some growing pains along the way, not the least of which is the current state of KF2's balancing, but if the end product ends up being even more awesome than the first then it was worth the trouble.

Because most of KF2's design choices so far are crap. KF1's mechanics are proven already.

 

[moleculo]

They've explained that the implementation of the zedconomy didn't delay any updates since the people who worked on it aren't the same people who do modeling and animations. Also, their defense for implementing the system in early access was to iterate on it and improve it before release. Now, since Tripwire is still a relatively small studio, I have a hard time believing the zedconomy didn't cause any delays at all, but they probably weren't huge delays, either. And adding the micros now to improve them with feedback makes sense, but it's not going to stop them from leaving a bad taste in the mouths of people who would have rather seen new content or balance updates.

Come to think of it: wouldn't that kinda arrangement mean they now have a team that has no work to do since MTs got implemented and they can't participate in any other stuff? Suspicious.

 

[vealck]

Because most of KF2's design choices so far are crap. KF1's mechanics are proven already.

This.

So far, the only improvements of KF2 versus KF1 is the graphics and hit detection. Literally everything else, even sounds included, is worse.

 

[2Clicks]

No offense... but I hate it when people think this way. Why would you want the sequel to just be the first game with prettier graphics? That's the kind of thinking that allows big publishers to lazily pump out yearly sequels. The whole point of a sequel is to innovate and build upon the original. Yeah there might be some growing pains along the way, not the least of which is the current state of KF2's balancing, but if the end product ends up being even more awesome than the first then it was worth the trouble.

Exactly how I feel. I didnt want KF1.5. A full blown sequel that took the key ingredients and made it better!

I think for the most part TW are on the right track. Thats just my personal preference. There is still along way to go.

Mayb down the like they will take it towards a more KF1 feel and play. I know dozens of ppl I met playing the original want that. More than us it seems. I guess well have to wait and see.

 

[Hellmeat]

I generally enjoy a good "behind the scenes" look at how things are made... cars, buildings, games, movies, etc.

That being said, there is a good documentary on Youtube of the making "Star Wars: The Phantom Menace" and all the work, money, blood, sweat, and tears that went into making the film.

... and the movie was pretty awful. I hated it, and seeing how hard all the people involved with the film worked and all the stuff they had go go through and deal with to get the picture out makes no difference in how I feel about it.

I'm not sure if the OP was trying to get the nay-sayers and critics of the game to lay off and cut TWI some slack? Which is cool, I get it, but keep in mind that ultimately the customer is going to judge by the final product. No amount of "But guys! Look at all the work that went into this!!" is going to change how the end result is received by the masses.

I like KF2 a lot, I've gotten my moneys worth out of the game several times over (in my opinion), for what that's worth, and my enjoyment or lack there of is now way effected by how many hours some guy spent coloring the eyeballs of the Clots.

I will say "Good job, TWI!", and thank you for a fun game, though.

 

[weeman2412]

No offense... but I hate it when people think this way. Why would you want the sequel to just be the first game with prettier graphics? That's the kind of thinking that allows big publishers to lazily pump out yearly sequels. The whole point of a sequel is to innovate and build upon the original. Yeah there might be some growing pains along the way, not the least of which is the current state of KF2's balancing, but if the end product ends up being even more awesome than the first then it was worth the trouble.

Except KF2 didn't take what KF1 did and improved it. It took everything KF1 did right, deleted it, and call of dutified what made KF1 great.

Remember the slow and methodical gameplay that defined KF1? Where is that? Oh right nowhere to be seen.

Nothing about Killing Floor 2 is innovative. It is basically stealing ideas from games that already exist, such as Team Fortress 2, Call of Duty, Quake, Unreal Tournament, and then duct taped together to create a game that is neither coherent or balanced.

Nothing plays like Killing Floor 1, it was a class all on it's own. Killing Floor 2 in it's current state is basically Call of Duty zombie mode but not fun and not balanced.

 

[xmrmeow]

I wouldn't say it's completely "call of duty"-ified, but there is a big list of things in kf2 that I don't like that kf1 didn't have.

-Camera shake

-Sprinting (if you're not holding shift while moving anywhere you're doing something wrong) If you're going to add running it should have some kind of trade off, not just always be better. Like put your gun away but gain a lot more movespeed.

-Teleporting zeds. I made a mod that removed this, and I'd say it makes hoe a LOT more fair and similar to kf1 movement and being able to run around the map WITHOUT seeing a zed around literally every single corner you turn. However, I will say that on normal and hard where zeds move lower, it makes the game feel the pace it should. I'd remove teleporting completely from suicidal and hoe. There's a lot of things that is in the game that people shill for even though most say it's bad, but I've never seen anyone support teleporting.

-Perk homogenization. Large zed killing mechanics are "everyone look at that thing and hold mouse 1". Knowing what to focus fire isn't strategy.

-Syringe feels worthless as 20 hp with a 15 second cooldown is really bad on hoe and makes healing without a medic nearly impossible. One hit from a husk literally takes a full minute to heal up. That's ridiculous. Also team-heal with the syringe has a shorter cooldown instead of half ammo cost. Both of these make medic almost 100% necessary for team survival on upper difficulties, even on 2 or 3 person teams. If I'm playing with 2 friends, we don't want to have to have a medic or we lose.

-Removal of leveling maps. I like playing the EA not just to play the game early but to test how the new content feels and if it could use some changes as well as making sure there are no bugs. Without access to all the content, I have to grind a lot to be able to do this, and with the game in its current state, I hardly feel like playing 30+ hours on a low difficulty on a perk I may not even like just to be able to test out if it feels as strong as it should be. A lot of mmos get boring really fast if you set yourself to max, but this isn't an mmo. Most of my time in kf1 is spent on maxed perks because the game is fun and I play it for fun, not to watch a number go up. Of course this one is more debatable than all the others on this list, and doesn't really affect the gameplay itself, it just affects how long it takes before you can actually play the full game.

-Zed moving animations. I like the new looks of all zeds except the fleshpound, which I think looks too short and bulky, but the bobbing movement animations are regularly frustrating. Zeds in kf1 moved much smoother, and I think the faster movespeed of zeds in this game is enough of a difficulty increase, head bobbing, and any arm in front of face animations need to go.
Animations I, and all of my friends, don't like at all are:
--clot and slasher jump-attack animation as they hold their hands infront of their face while jumping
--stalker ballerina attack animation
--gorefast's attack animation as its head moves all over the place through the whole animation
--fleshpound's rage running animation where it holds it's meatgrinders infront of its torso, making it's head and torso much harder to hit. It running at you is enough of an issue, I don't want him blocking while running. I looks cool, but gameplay is more important than looks

I gotta stop making such big posts...but there's just so much worth complaining about...I feel if I don't state it somewhere on the forums now while it's still in EA, the game will just end up staying like this. Although I'm pretty confidently at least some of this will get fixed before release...

 

[Quadruplesword]

Except KF2 didn't take what KF1 did and improved it. It took everything KF1 did right, deleted it, and call of dutified what made KF1 great.

Remember the slow and methodical gameplay that defined KF1? Where is that? Oh right nowhere to be seen.

Nothing about Killing Floor 2 is innovative. It is basically stealing ideas from games that already exist, such as Team Fortress 2, Call of Duty, Quake, Unreal Tournament, and then duct taped together to create a game that is neither coherent or balanced.

Nothing plays like Killing Floor 1, it was a class all on it's own. Killing Floor 2 in it's current state is basically Call of Duty zombie mode but not fun and not balanced.

Killing Floor 1 has been out for 6 years, so it's had plenty of time to be balanced and improved. Killing Floor 2 has only been out for about 9 months. I'll fully admit I don't like a lot of the choices that TWI has made with the new game, but they said themselves prior to the game's release that they wanted to release to early access first so they could get the community's help to balance and improve the game (granted that hasn't really happened yet). Besides, I guarantee you if KF2 was just KF1 with prettier graphics, you'd have a whole new camp of people on the forums complaining about how similar the game is to the first.

 

[Rocker Fox]

-Syringe feels worthless as 20 hp with a 15 second cooldown is really bad on hoe and makes healing without a medic nearly impossible. One hit from a husk literally takes a full minute to heal up. That's ridiculous. Also team-heal with the syringe has a shorter cooldown instead of half ammo cost. Both of these make medic almost 100% necessary for team survival on upper difficulties, even on 2 or 3 person teams. If I'm playing with 2 friends, we don't want to have to have a medic or we lose.

Personal little niggle but can i also add to this list that the syringe doesn't want to heal a lot of the time? I'm not sure if it's just me but it feels like im trying to give medicine to a dog whenever im using that thing, it just feels impossible to use. You can be right inside someone's player model clicking on them repeatedly and it will only work on like the 4th or 6th click. Yeah, that is fine for trader time but it really makes it a non-option for anything during actual combat.

You have a better chance blocking your teammate and doing nothing (alternatively blocking them into a group of zeds and getting them killed) instead of actually getting a heal off on them that will save them.

The kf1 med syringe was never like that, it would pretty much work fine every time even if a teammate was moving.

 

[weeman2412]

Killing Floor 1 has been out for 6 years, so it's had plenty of time to be balanced and improved.

Killing floor 1 was already basically perfect at release. Time only made it better as new maps and weapons were added.

I wouldn't hold my breath with Tripwire listening to player feedback, so far everything they've done is based on knee jerk balances rather than carefully balancing on majority feedback.

Case in point, buffed zerker into insanity, then immediately nerfed zwei into the ground. No sane company does balances like this, usually game company balance stats by taking it step by step slowly to tweak over time. Tripwire went completely extreme on every balance update, and then they take months plugging in numbers to balance, which hardly ever fixes the problem and only introduces more issues, which also takes more months to fix.

It just doesn't make sense. I bet my left bollocks the next patch will nerf firebug and gunslinger to uselessness. There is simply no moderation in Tripwire's method, something is either too strong, or god awful.

 

[Quadruplesword]

Killing floor 1 was already basically perfect at release. Time only made it better as new maps and weapons were added.

I wouldn't hold my breath with Tripwire listening to player feedback, so far everything they've done is based on knee jerk balances rather than carefully balancing on majority feedback.

Case in point, buffed zerker into insanity, then immediately nerfed zwei into the ground. No sane company does balances like this, usually game company balance stats by taking it step by step slowly to tweak over time. Tripwire went completely extreme on every balance update, and then they take months plugging in numbers to balance, which hardly ever fixes the problem and only introduces more issues, which also takes more months to fix.

It just doesn't make sense. I bet my left bollocks the next patch will nerf firebug and gunslinger to uselessness. There is simply no moderation in Tripwire's method, something is either too strong, or god awful.

Fair enough. It does seem like Tripwire is trying way too hard to appease a vocal minority of players, and as such are just nerfing stuff into uselessness. Hopefully that will go away with future updates.

 

[2Clicks]

Killing Floor 1 has been out for 6 years, so it's had plenty of time to be balanced and improved. Killing Floor 2 has only been out for about 9 months. I'll fully admit I don't like a lot of the choices that TWI has made with the new game, but they said themselves prior to the game's release that they wanted to release to early access first so they could get the community's help to balance and improve the game (granted that hasn't really happened yet). Besides, I guarantee you if KF2 was just KF1 with prettier graphics, you'd have a whole new camp of people on the forums complaining about how similar the game is to the first.

Is this statement that irks me.... Any reason they could not have waited for all the perks to be in before releasing to EA? Cause it just seems to me to be an exercise in frugality! Like they needed the money upfront from sales. That worried/s me!

Or even just... 8 or 5 before releasing the game! I know one thing for sure theyll be no buying KF3 or any other title on EA dude to nostaglic or sentimental reasons for "owing" one to the developer. 1 game from another developer has already suffered from that!

 

[Rocker Fox]

Is this statement that irks me.... Any reason they could not have waited for all the perks to be in before releasing to EA? Cause it just seems to me to be an exercise in frugality! Like they needed the money upfront from sales. That worried/s me!

Or even just... 8 or 5 before releasing the game! I know one thing for sure theyll be no buying KF3 or any other title on EA dude to nostaglic or sentimental reasons for "owing" one to the developer. 1 game from another developer has already suffered from that!

I think the problem is honestly less about the community not knowing what an EA game is supposed to be but tripwire not understanding it themselves. I played at least a few Early access titles that got what the early access was for and could interact with the community well. The small number of perks is one thing but what really makes me confused is how they are doing balance.

Part of what makes early access a useful tool is quick reaction from both the devs and the community. You can release a balance patch, get people to play it, tell you what is wrong or what is right and release another small one weekly or bi weekly. That way you don't get these big problems with balance that come from trying to fix too many things at once, instead it's a series of smaller tweaks that are easier to fix and adjust as time goes on which results in a well rounded and balanced perk for example instead of it being in a binary state of Underpowered or Overpowered with each update.

Betas, Alphas, and early builds are nothing new to me but the way things are being handled as they are now is very alien. It feels like there is very little point to calling this an EA since it feels like the community is not being used to test things and find bugs in a steady stream of content like you would normally do but instead just there to put funding into it.

 

[Shambler]

Killing floor 1 was already basically perfect at release. Time only made it better as new maps and weapons were added.

Take off your nostalgia specs. Kf 1 was a horribly broken mess at release but no-one had any expectations of it. Most maps had exploits which took months to be fixed, you could waste the healing syringe if you missed another player and the commando had only one gun in his arsenal, the flippin' bullpup. I loved kf1 from the get go but don't lie about it not taking years to become polished.

Also, it took players literally years to figure out all the ins and outs of kf1. Kf2 is a different game, please everyone stop wishing it was the same as kf1 and instead enjoy learning the new ins of a new game.

 

[weeman2412]

Take off your nostalgia specs. Kf 1 was a horribly broken mess at release but no-one had any expectations of it. Most maps had exploits which took months to be fixed, you could waste the healing syringe if you missed another player and the commando had only one gun in his arsenal, the flippin' bullpup. I loved kf1 from the get go but don't lie about it not taking years to become polished.

Also, it took players literally years to figure out all the ins and outs of kf1. Kf2 is a different game, please everyone stop wishing it was the same as kf1 and instead enjoy learning the new ins of a new game.

1. I started to play Killing Floor 1 in the summer of 2010 during the sale.
2. I don't care for healing as I played sharpshooter 99% of the time and I only ever self healed. In fact, I made sure to leave the healing to the team medic only.
3. Exploits? Meh. Cheaters gonna cheat.
4. Who even uses commando in Killing Floor 1
5. I stand by my statement, Killing Floor 1 was perfect.
6. I have already mastered Killing Floor 2, there is nothing you can show me that I don't already know. Exploit? Check. Valid winning strategy for HoE? Check. Avoid playing crap like commando and support? Check, check. Maxed achievements except for perked up (because it's somehow broken for me). Check.