Dosh.

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Lacedaemonius

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 16, 2011
1,078
324
0
(Please pardon my naivette if this has been posted before)

The sad fact of the matter is that any professional developer needs a return on their investment. Now that Killing Floor is a few years old it's coming very close to the end of its development cycle.

To extend KF's lifespan and make the good folks at tripwire some well deserved DOSH I have a two-fold proposal. This took a few hours to type up so any feedback would be appreciated.

1. A new content pack under a theme of OPERATORS OPERATING.
While this may sound like a very tall order, I propose saving much time and effort while still greatly adding to the replay value of the game by reusing much content that has already been produced. (Edit: since this seems to be turning into tl:dr, I'll put all the important text in bold)

First off, creating TACTICOOL lightweight variants of several of the weapons.

Example: a short-barrel variation of the Winchester Model 94 with skeleton stock. Offer the weapon as a lighter-weight alternative to the regular Winchester at the cost of decreased accuracy and magazine capacity. Maybe even add a laser-sight or 2x mini-scope etc. By doing this the devs could save a lot work by not having to design a completely new weapon from scratch. Change a few of the values on the stats of the 94, make a few modifications to the model, and do a little balancing and we could potentially have a brand new and unique weapon for a minimum of effort.

Example 2: Bring in a full size L85A2 for the commandos. Once again a minimum of company resources would be required to scale up the weapon. The current L22A1 model is already surprisingly similar And it would be a hell of a lot of fun to use a full-auto AR with a nice SUSAT scope.

This could be repeated endlessly for countless new and unique weapons. Shrink the mag on the AA12, lighten it up a little bit, semi-auto only, and rip and mod the M3 Super 90 model and suddenly you have a SPAS-12! Pick a weapon and add a few tactical rails, change some config values, mount an underbarrel flashlight and you have a brand new ______.

Next, new voice recordings would do everyone well. Include plenty of SAS operator sounding quotes by some new voice actors (in the comically thick British accents, naturally).


Make a new player model from scratch in keeping with the theme. Keep it minimalist for reasons to be explained later. A simple BDU (maybe London PD blue? Mute grey? etc.) with a kevlar vest and balaclava to be included free.

Map Pack! With some creativity there are a million things that could be done with this theme while keeping tongue firmly in cheek. However, mapping is a considerable amount of work, and we want to keep this nice & lean. Put maps last on the list. (Maybe turn it into some kind of contest for community mappers?)

Many other small additions could be made to help give it a fresh new feel, such as the option for a new UI, or different boot sounds when running with the OPERATOR model.

This leads to the business end of the plan, where Tripwire could really make DOSH.

2. Release several model packs, for a price. Not just player model packs, but weapon replacement models, and zeds also. Make them accessible which you'd rather use in the options menu. Hell, for weapons, it could be set so that you could choose which model your purchase for the weapon at the trader.

Rough Outline-

Modern Weapon Pack 1
H&K USP/MK23 9mm (for 92FS)
H&K MP5A4 (for L22A1)
H&K G3/G3A3 (for SCAR.)
H&K FABARM FP6 (for M3 Super 90)
H&K AG36/69A1 (for M79)
Price: $2

Modern Weapon Pack 2
Glock 17 (for 92FS)
FN Five-seveN (for 92FS)
FN PS90 (for L22A1)
AN-94 Abakan (for Draco AK Carbine)
H&K CAWS (for AA-12)
H&K 417 (for SCAR)
Price: $2

Retro Weapon Pack
Browning Hi-Power (for 92FS)
Mini-Uzi (for MAC-10)
FN FAL (for M14 EBR)
Lee-Enfield (for Winchester)
Beretta Silver Pigeon (for Coach Gun)
Winchester Model 1897 (for M3 Super 90)
AR-10 (for Draco AK)
Taurus Raging Bull (for Desert Eagle)
Price: $3

STRONG LIKE RUSSIAN STEEL Pack
Makarov PMM (For 92FS)
AKM (For Draco AK)
Saiga-12 modified for full-auto (for AA-12)
Expanded Mag Mosin Nagant (for Winchester)
PTRD-41 (for Crossbow)
RPG-7 (for LAW)
VSS Vintorez (for M14EBR)
Price: $3

Melee Weapons Pack
New Knife Model
Crowbar (for Machete)
Sledgehammer (for Fireaxe)
Scimitar (for Katana)
Concrete Saw (for Chainsaw)
Price: $2

Heavy Weapons Pack
IED (for Pipe Bombs)
FIM-92A Stinger (for LAW)
AMT Automag (for Desert Eagle)
Steyr HS .50 (for Crossbow)
Brugger & Thommet GL-06 (for M79)
Pancor Jackhammer (for AA-12)
Arwen 37 (for M32 MGL)
RG-6 (for M32 MGL)
Price: $3

And to top it off a single character pack with a few different variants of the stock model provided (ie stealth, combat, demo variations etc.) at the standard price of the other model packs and a themed model pack that completely redoes all of the specimen models and maybe changes a few sounds and there would be some serious quality content for sale.

The weapons part may be a bit of overkill, but put a few of those weapon packs together with the full set of new models, and sell the game on steam for a 25% deal (or 50% for the complete pack with all models) and Tripwire could hopefully both extend the lifespan of the game and make some DOSH while requiring a minimum of resource/effort investment on their part.

And that's my proposal
Thoughts?
 

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HalfDemon

FNG / Fresh Meat
Apr 3, 2010
182
34
0
Well, hell - you've got a ton of ideas mate, I applaud you for that.

However, one of the many reasons why I play KF on a daily basis is due to its simplicity. Sometimes a basic game is superior to a more advanced game due to the fact the company has made their product best it can be within those limits - instead of putting tons of effort into new 'stuff' - TW have done the former exceptionally well, including their most recent balance update. Which made me play the game for many more hours.
 

Darkwave

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 4, 2010
458
158
0
25
Argentina
Please , don't try turn TWI into Infinity Award or EA.

I disagree with all of them , TWI gave us free weapons and maps for no price , the price of the DLC's is totally worth it and is by far the best purchase I've made in years.

Also , I don't see the point of making 6/7 weapons at $2, if the price is THAT low , give them for free.

Low price and good quality makes big money ( Not if you are Treyarch who won't even lower the price to %10 because all the COD fanboys will buy it anyway)
 
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nutterbutter

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 8, 2010
2,019
1,281
0
(Please pardon my naivette if this has been posted before)

The sad fact of the matter is that any professional developer needs a return on their investment. Now that Killing Floor is a few years old it's coming very close to the end of its development cycle.

To extend KF's lifespan and make the good folks at tripwire some well deserved DOSH I have a two-fold proposal. This took a few hours to type up so any feedback would be appreciated.

If you want new maps, chars, models, weapons, voiceovers, etc., etc., then you build it and give it to them. It is that simple.

KF is fun to play because it has good gameplay. Do I want new maps, chars, models, weapons, voiceovers, etc., etc.? Sure. Do I expect TWI to lose money by providing these? Nope.

The bottom line is that everyone is willing to suggest new maps, chars, models, weapons, voiceovers, etc., etc. but the people who actually build these things are the ones who make a difference.
 

Lacedaemonius

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 16, 2011
1,078
324
0
You all make solid points, and perhaps my proposal is a bit too far-fetched.

If nothing else though, I remain of the firm conviction that Tripwire should be (or at least looking into) offering alternate skins for weapons, and not just players. I would more than definitely pay a few quid to replace the fugly M14 skin with a FAL, or even just change things up a bit by turning my M3 into a Mossy 590. If they'll sell us player models, why not weapons to?
 

Lucidius134

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 8, 2011
405
168
0
1) No, the premise of KF's current DLC is that that it goes to supporting the devs. It doesn't give you any unfair advantages opposed to those who don't pay. MICROTRANSACTIONS ARE RUINING MODERN GAMES.

1 Weight Block per extra-weapon is quite a bit, especially with Support. The current weights are the way they are for balancing so knocking a block or two off would give people the ability to carry stuff others won't.

2) I'de buy some of those if they were cosmetic and sound only, and functioned the exact same. But the thing is, that right there is a list of around 39 models, alot of which would need to be re-animated, created from scratch which involves modeling and texturing, and all in all that work isn't cheap, nor quick. They could be using that time to making something else which would easily give them more DOSH.

In short, it'de take away TOO much time for them to be doing something more important. The only reason most of those _other_ games do this is because they just cut intended content they've already made and then sell it to you to make some more money or over charge for singular things, like the TERRIBLE TERRIBLE armor in ME2, some of the ****ty weapon packs for Kane and Lynch 2, etc.
 
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C_Gibby

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 18, 2010
7,282
2,720
0
This could be alright if the advantage to using these weapons were almost nonexistant. Treat 'em like a skin or something.
 

timur

FNG / Fresh Meat
The thing is, how easy would it be to do this? New models, animations, and skins can be pretty difficult, albeit this doesn't require balancing.

In any case, pretty nifty idea, but I must say 2 things: 1) KF already has returned to its community with tons of new weapons and maps, even a new zed and xmas zeds...all in free updates. Now if that isn't return, what is? :p
2)As cool as this would be, it is physically impossible until TWI finishes what its doing at the moment.....making an entirely new game, which hopes to rack in so much Dosh, they'll have trouble grabbin' it while its hot!
 

YoYoBatty

FNG / Fresh Meat
Dec 17, 2009
3,468
2,503
0
Canada
I've seen this suggested before many times, also could you please give some more statistics of the weapons and how you can balance them?
 
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Lucidius134

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 8, 2011
405
168
0
Oh, I also forgot to mention that, there are already a bunch of COMMUNITY made maps that have been included with the game aswell as a slew white listed.

I think you're late for the map compitition B& wagon.
 

Fail-o-wisp

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 1, 2011
78
19
0
West London. No, seriously.
(Please pardon my naivette if this has been posted before)

The sad fact of the matter is that any professional developer needs a return on their investment. Now that Killing Floor is a few years old it's coming very close to the end of its development cycle.

To extend KF's lifespan and make the good folks at tripwire some well deserved DOSH I have a two-fold proposal. This took a few hours to type up so any feedback would be appreciated.

1. A new content pack under a theme of OPERATORS OPERATING.
While this may sound like a very tall order, I propose saving much time and effort while still greatly adding to the replay value of the game by reusing much content that has already been produced. (Edit: since this seems to be turning into tl:dr, I'll but all the important text in bold)

First off, creating TACTICOOL lightweight variants of several of the weapons.

Example: a short-barrel variation of the Winchester Model 94 with skeleton stock. Offer the weapon as a lighter-weight alternative to the regular Winchester at the cost of decreased accuracy and magazine capacity. Maybe even add a laser-sight or 2x mini-scope etc. By doing this the devs could save a lot work by not having to design a completely new weapon from scratch. Change a few of the values on the stats of the 94, make a few modifications to the model, and do a little balancing and we could potentially have a brand new and unique weapon for a minimum of effort.

Example 2: Bring in a full size L85A2 for the commandos. Once again a minimum of company resources would be required to scale up the weapon. The current L22A1 model is already surprisingly similar And it would be a hell of a lot of fun to use a full-auto AR with a nice SUSAT scope.

This could be repeated endlessly for countless new and unique weapons. Shrink the mag on the AA12, lighten it up a little bit, semi-auto only, and rip and mod the M3 Super 90 model and suddenly you have a SPAS-12! Pick a weapon and add a few tactical rails, change some config values, mount an underbarrel flashlight and you have a brand new ______.

Oh god, no. The last thing this game needs is more pointless tweaked weapons. One of the reasons I considered L4D2 to be inferior to its prequel was because the game was so cluttered with the same weapons with different stats.(for e.g. Auto shotgun and SPAS-12, UZI and Silenced SMG)

I honestly don't see why we need 10 different weapons with only the slightest difference instead of just one.


Next, new voice recordings would do everyone well. Include plenty of SAS operator sounding quotes by some new voice actors (in the comically thick British accents, naturally).


Make a new player model from scratch in keeping with the theme. Keep it minimalist for reasons to be explained later. A simple BDU (maybe London PD blue? Mute grey? etc.) with a kevlar vest and balaclava to be included free.

Erm, Tripwire does release character packs. And yeah, new voices would be cool although it would be most unlikely.

Map Pack! With some creativity there are a million things that could be done with this theme while keeping tongue firmly in cheek. However, mapping is a considerable amount of work, and we want to keep this nice & lean. Put maps last on the list. (Maybe turn it into some kind of contest for community mappers?)

They don't do map packs and I hate map packs. But they do reward community mappers.


Many other small additions could be made to help give it a fresh new feel, such as the option for a new UI, or different boot sounds when running with the OPERATOR model.

This leads to the business end of the plan, where Tripwire could really make DOSH.

2. Release several model packs, for a price. Not just player model packs, but weapon replacement models, and zeds also. Make them accessible which you'd rather use in the options menu. Hell, for weapons, it could be set so that you could choose which model your purchase for the weapon at the trader.

Rough Outline-

Modern Weapon Pack 1
H&K USP/MK23 9mm (for 92FS)
H&K MP5A4 (for L22A1)
H&K G3/G3A3 (for SCAR.)
H&K FABARM FP6 (for M3 Super 90)
H&K AG36/69A1 (for M79)
Price: $2

Modern Weapon Pack 2
Glock 17 (for 92FS)
FN Five-seveN (for 92FS)
FN PS90 (for L22A1)
AN-94 Abakan (for Draco AK Carbine)
H&K CAWS (for AA-12)
H&K 417 (for SCAR)
Price: $2

Retro Weapon Pack
Browning Hi-Power (for 92FS)
Mini-Uzi (for MAC-10)
FN FAL (for M14 EBR)
Lee-Enfield (for Winchester)
Beretta Silver Pigeon (for Coach Gun)
Winchester Model 1897 (for M3 Super 90)
AR-10 (for Draco AK)
Taurus Raging Bull (for Desert Eagle)
Price: $3

STRONG LIKE RUSSIAN STEEL Pack
Makarov PMM (For 92FS)
AKM (For Draco AK)
Saiga-12 modified for full-auto (for AA-12)
Expanded Mag Mosin Nagant (for Winchester)
PTRD-41 (for Crossbow)
RPG-7 (for LAW)
VSS Vintorez (for M14EBR)
Price: $3

Melee Weapons Pack
New Knife Model
Crowbar (for Machete)
Sledgehammer (for Fireaxe)
Scimitar (for Katana)
Concrete Saw (for Chainsaw)
Price: $2

Heavy Weapons Pack
IED (for Pipe Bombs)
FIM-92A Stinger (for LAW)
AMT Automag (for Desert Eagle)
Steyr HS .50 (for Crossbow)
Brugger & Thommet GL-06 (for M79)
Pancor Jackhammer (for AA-12)
Arwen 37 (for M32 MGL)
RG-6 (for M32 MGL)
Price: $3

And to top it off a single character pack with a few different variants of the stock model provided (ie stealth, combat, demo variations etc.) at the standard price of the other model packs and a themed model pack that completely redoes all of the specimen models and maybe changes a few sounds and there would be some serious quality content for sale.

The weapons part may be a bit of overkill, but put a few of those weapon packs together with the full set of new models, and sell the game on steam for a 25% deal (or 50% for the complete pack with all models) and Tripwire could hopefully both extend the lifespan of the game and make some DOSH while requiring a minimum of resource/effort investment on their part.

And that's my proposal
Thoughts?

Sorry, I mean nothing personal, but I just dislike most of your ideas.
 

Nanostrike

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 19, 2009
2,027
250
0
Just seeing that many H&K weapons on the list is enough to turn me off of this idea.

Let alone the fact that you're trying to turn this into Killing of Floor Duty: Modern Warfare
 

Undedd Jester

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 31, 2009
3,071
881
0
Sheffield, England
I've always been a fan of simply reskinning current weapons and selling it as a weapon pack.

Most obvious candidates being reskinning the Ak-47 into a M16, 9mm into a USP, Pipe Bombs into Claymore Mines, etc, etc. I'd avoid things like new scopes and attachements, the idea in my mind should be to just give an alternative looking weapon if people want to use something different. Otherwise clip, damage, fire rate, price, etc etc would all be exactly the same.

When buying them in the Trader you could simply have it so that there is a little arrow in the weapons window that if you click, it shifts along to the newly skinned weapon instead. Having it so that other people can see your and hear your new weapons as well would give a feeling of individuality, as you can pick the weapons you like most.

I'd definately buy it.
 

Lucidius134

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 8, 2011
405
168
0
Just seeing that many H&K weapons on the list is enough to turn me off of this idea.

This, as long as they make good weapon choices to go with TWI's resources. I don't wanna see a whole H&K armoury being put into KF (of course, I'd welcome a few H&K choices).

This, a billion times.

I've always been a fan of simply reskinning current weapons and selling it as a weapon pack.

I'm all for it if it supports the devs, the KF DLC is DLC done right.

Most obvious candidates being reskinning the Ak-47 into a M16,
nopenopenopenopenopenope

I'd avoid things like new scopes and attachements, the idea in my mind should be to just give an alternative looking weapon if people want to use something different. Otherwise clip, damage, fire rate, price, etc etc would all be exactly the same.

Agreed, everything should be the same. If it's an AK replacement, it should use crude iron sights, if it's a bullpup it should use a reflex or red dot, so on and so forth.

All functional attachments should be roughly the same. No cosmetic M203's or anything like that, though a vert grip may be fine.

When buying them in the Trader you could simply have it so that there is a little arrow in the weapons window that if you click, it shifts along to the newly skinned weapon instead. Having it so that other people can see your and hear your new weapons as well would give a feeling of individuality, as you can pick the weapons you like most.

I'd definately buy it.

This, that's how I thought of how it'de work in the trader menu. Simply a button next to the current one, or even chopping off a piee of the current button's area to add a smaller one. Clicking it will cycle the alternative weapons. If it's too much to ask for to have it check to see whcih DLC you have, make it cycle all DLC and only let you buy what you can, much like the Player DLC being blocked from purchase.

Do avoid making it bring up the DLC page if you try to buy it though, that'de cause people to lose time.
 

Lacedaemonius

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 16, 2011
1,078
324
0
Alright, it's pretty obvious now that this was a bad idea for a new content pack. However, I still think that a few points stand.

1. New weapons. Firearms (and for berserkers, katanas) are our primary way of interacting with the environment. Adding more weapons would always be a + because that allows us to have more & deeper interactions with our environment. My suggestion was just what I thought would lessen the workload for Tripwire. The last thing I want is for this to become COWADOOTY (the game that is ruining the industry).

2. New weapon models. To be clear, NO advantages over the regular weapons (aside from reskinned iron sights, which could be better or worse than stock). You can't deny that a lot of the weapons just start to feel old after a while. When I played Counter-Strike I would regularly DL new model and sound replacements, which really helped to keep the game feeling fresh and fun (a tall order considering that the weapon list is pretty much just AKM, M4A1, AWM, and DEAGLE BRAND DEAGLE WITH BANANA CLIP)
Besides, we buy and greatly enjoy new player models, which we can't even see until we die. What's wrong with livening up the gameplay a bit?

3. New voice recordings
If you need me to justify this one, you don't deserve to play KF.
 

Lucidius134

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 8, 2011
405
168
0
I loved the artwork - where'd it come from?

> Google Image Search
> "Killing Floor Dosh"
> First and Second picture on funnyjunk.com

That's how I got mine. It's probably been posted on 4chan a buncha times, that's how I got a few other KF pics of mine.

Edit: Laughing hard @ first one even though i've had it for months.
 

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