Developer Question: Squad Leader Spawning

[TOPMO3]

Hello,

First off, congratulations on an amazing game. With all of the patching and buggy game-play, I still am having more fun than I have in a while playing a WW2 shooter. Keep up the great work!

I have a question about the Squad Leader Spawn mechanic. I play a squad leader almost exclusively, and I like to be in the front lines, setting up good places for my squad mates to spawn in order to take objectives. Right now, my problem is with the inconsistency of spawns. I have friends on Ventrilo who say they are selecting to spawn on me, and get spawned in the default Spawn 1, Spawn 2 locations, even when my character is wide open in neutral ground. I have had cases when my whole squad can spawn on me, and I'm capping an enemy point.

I have found that there are more spawn fails when I am prone, and surrounded by complex geometry, and debris, or am in close quarter spaces such as rooms/basements/staircases. I have found that I have more successful spawns when I am out in the open. I feel like this mechanic is trying to analyse the surrounding geometry around the squad leader, and if it passes some sort of "check", the spawn will happen. More often than not though, the spawn fails, and I have no idea why.

My question to the developers is simple. Is this feature currently working as designed?

If not, I am absolutely fine with it, and I will continue to play the game while patiently waiting for your fix. If you feel it is currently working as designed, can I please have a brief explanation of the mechanic, so I can play my favorite class more effectively, and better position myself in order to help my squad/team mates. What areas are good to spawn in, what areas I should avoid, in order for the engine to resolve the spawns better.

Thanks for your time, I know you're a busy bunch.
TOPMO3

 

[TOPMO3]

Bumping. Any devs care to answer this legitimate question about this game mechanic?

 

[Gaizokubanou]

I think it's buggy atm but yes I would also like to know if there is something we are just missing on or if it is indeed a bug.

 

[pii_smith]

IMO it should just display (gray out the option) that you can't spawn on the squad leader. If you choose to spawn on a SL but he moves into some position where no legal place for you to spawn can be found it should be on the point where you decided to take that option.
Spawning back in one (You can't even choose which!) spawn point without any notice is just the worst possible solution.

 

[TOPMO3]

IMO it should just display (gray out the option) that you can't spawn on the squad leader. If you choose to spawn on a SL but he moves into some position where no legal place for you to spawn can be found it should be on the point where you decided to take that option.
Spawning back in one (You can't even choose which!) spawn point without any notice is just the worst possible solution.

This is pretty much exactly what I'm trying to find out from the devs. If they tell me it's supposed to work anywhere, regardless of location, but the feature is currently broken, I will happily accept that answer, and wait for a fix. If they tell me it works, but only in outdoor areas, or only outside of enemy zones, I will also accept that as an answer.

I simply want to know IF and HOW this feature is supposed to work. What it was designed to function like. So I can adjust my playing style accordingly. I don't want to sit by a cap point for 10 minutes with no one spawning on me because I'm in some sort of "spawn restriction" zone, or because I'm on a slope, or in a stairwell.

 

[Dread_Moose]

i heard that it doesnt work when SL is in a capping zone, whether defending or attacking.

Which after hearing that, i have found that i have been able to spawn on him according to those rules.

 

[TOPMO3]

When you say capping zone, do you mean a zone that is currently contested, or a zone that has been capped? I have found that both have worked. At the beginning of Red October Factory, when the allies run up to A, and hug the wall to begin capping, I have had squad mates spawn right next to me to help cap. I have done similar things in enemy camps on other maps. Then sometimes for no reason, they select to spawn on me, and they get sent to Spawn 1 instead.

Maybe there is a mechanic that only lets you spawn on SL every OTHER spawn, or something to that effect. I just want an explanation from the devs. Even if it's "it's bugged, we're working on it".

 

[BOTA:16]

Been meaning to start a thread on this, so kudos to the OP.

Same here, it doesn't seem to have a rhyme or reason as to when it does work and doesn't. Other than when the SL dies.

Wish I knew some kind of "rules" as to which the "Spawn on SL" mechanic works from. It would make for better SL's. There have been many times I will be an area that is very open and people on vent tell me they select "spawn on SL" and it still puts them back at points 1/2. Then there are other times when I am trying to hold a building, they will spawn out on the street right in the middle of a fire fight.

 

[Dread_Moose]

When you say capping zone, do you mean a zone that is currently contested, or a zone that has been capped? I have found that both have worked. At the beginning of Red October Factory, when the allies run up to A, and hug the wall to begin capping, I have had squad mates spawn right next to me to help cap. I have done similar things in enemy camps on other maps. Then sometimes for no reason, they select to spawn on me, and they get sent to Spawn 1 instead.

Maybe there is a mechanic that only lets you spawn on SL every OTHER spawn, or something to that effect. I just want an explanation from the devs. Even if it's "it's bugged, we're working on it".

anything inside the blue or red boxes, not what is shown on the map screen, they are bigger than the real cap zones shown on the minimap.

This is just what i was told on a server, when i asked about the problem. Perhaps its a radius around the SL. If he is on the edge of the cap, you still have room to spawn outside of it. Dunno. Just saying what i was told, whether it is correct or not, i have no idea. But since then i have only tried to spawn on SL when he isnt in those zones, and it seems to be working fine for me.

 

[PUTZ]

It has nothing to do with whether or not you are in a capzone. The only checks are a) if someone on the other team is looking in your direction and b) there is a nearby playerstart (they're everywhere).

It's entirely possible that someone is almost always looking in your direction.

 

[Nowotny]

It has nothing to do with whether or not you are in a capzone. The only checks are a) if someone on the other team is looking in your direction and b) there is a nearby playerstart (they're everywhere).

It's entirely possible that someone is almost always looking in your direction.

"Looking in your direction"

God I hope you are joking.

 

[TOPMO3]

It has nothing to do with whether or not you are in a capzone. The only checks are a) if someone on the other team is looking in your direction and b) there is a nearby playerstart (they're everywhere).

It's entirely possible that someone is almost always looking in your direction.

When you say looking in my direction, does that mean he is seeing my character, or he is just happening to be facing towards my general direction, even if I'm behind a wall and he can't see me?

If I can only spawn players on me when I cannot be seen by an enemy camera, that makes sense (reminds me of L4D infected spawning), but it doesn't explain why my team mates can't spawn on me if I'm hiding in a room of an enemy building.

 

[Dread_Moose]

It has nothing to do with whether or not you are in a capzone. The only checks are a) if someone on the other team is looking in your direction and b) there is a nearby playerstart (they're everywhere).

It's entirely possible that someone is almost always looking in your direction.

i am assuming that LOS is also determined, so a guy looking in your direction, but has a house blocking his LOS will still allow a spawn?

 

[SasQuatch]

"Looking in your direction"

God I hope you are joking.

As in 'enemy has a straight line of sight to SQL'. So the enemy is actually looking at you. That prevents a team mate from spawning on you because it is a clear indication that you are in a danger zone.

So if you want to be a good Squadleader to spawn on, you should:

-try to stay alive as long as possible and spend as little time possible waiting in the spawn cue. So for squadleaders playing sensible and defensive agressive is more key then to any other class.
-try to be well in cover most of the time, only popping out to peek or shoot, throw smoke, set artytargets for commander etc...

Squadleaders are not the rambo's of the squad, that role is for the assault class.

 

[|716ID| Hptm.Popov]

Stop being crazy, it's just bugged ... like all the rest.

We have to wait some months, maybe it will works on day.

 

[Sickerthansars]

As in 'enemy has a straight line of sight to SQL'. So the enemy is actually looking at you. That prevents a team mate from spawning on you because it is a clear indication that you are in a danger zone.

So if you want to be a good Squadleader to spawn on, you should:

-try to stay alive as long as possible and spend as little time possible waiting in the spawn cue. So for sqaudleaders playing sensible and defensive agressive is more key then to any other class.
-try to be well in cover most of the time, only popping out to peek or shoot

Squadleaders are not the rambo's of the squad, that role is for the assault class.

THANK YOU X1000000000 for this feature.

I cant stand playing bad company 2, picking a squad member to spawn on only to instantly die again because they were in the open with a guy already in the process of shooting at them, or about to get shot and then ending up taking the bullet for them.

 

[TOPMO3]

As in 'enemy has a straight line of sight to SQL'. So the enemy is actually looking at you. That prevents a team mate from spawning on you because it is a clear indication that you are in a danger zone.

So if you want to be a good Squadleader to spawn on, you should:

-try to stay alive as long as possible and spend as little time possible waiting in the spawn cue. So for sqaudleaders playing sensible and defensive agressive is more key then to any other class.
-try to be well in cover most of the time, only popping out to peek or shoot

Squadleaders are not the rambo's of the squad, that role is for the assault class.

Thanks for this explanation SasQuatch! This helps clear things up greatly. Putz also mentioned you can't be near a playerstart when attempting to spawn team-mates. Am I right in assuming he is talking about the enemy's Spawn 1 / 2?

 

[pii_smith]

As in 'enemy has a straight line of sight to SQL'. So the enemy is actually looking at you. That prevents a team mate from spawning on you because it is a clear indication that you are in a danger zone.

So if you want to be a good Squadleader to spawn on, you should:

-try to stay alive as long as possible and spend as little time possible waiting in the spawn cue. So for squadleaders playing sensible and defensive agressive is more key then to any other class.
-try to be well in cover most of the time, only popping out to peek or shoot, throw smoke, set artytargets for commander etc...

Squadleaders are not the rambo's of the squad, that role is for the assault class.

So it can be blocked if someone has a line of sight to the squad leader. But why not make this circumstance visible and keep you from choosing that option?

 

[pii_smith]

THANK YOU X1000000000 for this feature.

I cant stand playing bad company 2, picking a squad member to spawn on only to instantly die again because they were in the open with a guy already in the process of shooting at them, or about to get shot and then ending up taking the bullet for them.

Oh it happened to me that I was instantly shot after spawning. The enemy might not have seen the squad leader, but for sure he was able to see me.

 

[SasQuatch]

Thanks for this explanation SasQuatch! This helps clear things up greatly. Putz also mentioned you can't be near a playerstart when attempting to spawn team-mates. Am I right in assuming he is talking about the enemy's Spawn 1 / 2?

Nah actually he said you must be near a playerstart, but thats just tech stuff. You can ignore that because like he said, playerstarts for squadleader spawning are everywhere.