Criticism for TWI - useful for their next game

[Nimsky]

Some kind of easier way of getting the mods and custom maps to people would be nice too. But I guess that's more of a Steam thing. For example, you could rightclick on RO in Steam, open the "community addons" screen and see what's been released, and which version (new versions would replace the older ones). By simply clicking "download this addon", it would automatically download and install in the appropiate directory. This way you don't have to wade through countless of forum threads before you can finally play it, which I know keeps many people from keeping up with all of the custom content. And everybody would have the same version. That would be great.

 

[SgtH3nry3]

Don't get your hopes up too high, Red Orchestra: Ostfront 41-45 was an exceptional game, I don't think that the upcoming title is as good as you all think it's going to be.

And it's not the whole Unreal Engine 3.0-thing which would make a possible RO2 a better game, it's the experience that the developers grew through the years.
The key to make the next title even better is to make the game at least as modular as Ostfront was, so it can be improved as much as possible as time goes by.
They have made a very powerful statement with Ostfront 41-45, and I hope that title 2 (personally I'm still hoping for a RO2) will take the merits of it's predecessor.

And like Monstar said, public relations is the bottleneck of Tripwire Interactive.

 

[Zetsumei]

Some kind of easier way of getting the mods and custom maps to people would be nice too. But I guess that's more of a Steam thing. For example, you could rightclick on RO in Steam, open the "community addons" screen and see what's been released, and which version (new versions would replace the older ones). By simply clicking "download this addon", it would automatically download and install in the appropiate directory. This way you don't have to wade through countless of forum threads before you can finally play it, which I know keeps many people from keeping up with all of the custom content. And everybody would have the same version. That would be great.

Steam probably won't do that nor the devs because of possible copyright issues. What if a texture of a custom map or sound is actually from another game?

 

[Yoshiro]

Then we play the game "everybody gets sued!" But on that note, Valve is actually testing the release of mods over steam using 4 mods on HL 2 to test.

 

[Nimsky]

Hmmm. Well, if it's really impossible, there should be some kind of program for this. Basically the Steam of custom content. Open the program, select the game, select mod / map you want, and download. And when a mod team or a mapper releases a new version, you get a message asking if you want to download it. And everything gets put in the right directory.

 

[Yoshiro]

The problem is, who pays for all that bandwith and the upkeep of the system. I've seen a few attempts for it over the years but nothing has taken off (even though a few made it to release)

 

[the_TeuTon]

I have another suggestion:

One thing I love about RO is the idea of capturing objectives and such. There is one downside, however: the cap zones are too broad. In real life, if a unit was given an objective to secure, they had to secure the entire objective. If they were attacking a building, they couldn't just stay in one room or one floor and call the building secured (in Stalingrad there were many times when the Germans held one room in a house and the Russians another room). In RO, if enough people are in any place in the capture zone they can cap, even if the rest of the area is crawling with enemy units. A good example is the map Leningrad. You could have 10 Germans on one floor of the searchlight building and they would cap it, even if the other floors were still held by the Russians. I know this would make the game more complicated, but it would make it much more realistic. It would also force the players to learn to work together.

 

[I. Kant]

Don't you think it's okay with hueg capzones? Sure, you can have people bundled in one room, cap the objective, but you still have those hostiles in their part of the objective, so you're going to have to do something with that sooner or later.
I think it only becomes a problem with non-recapturable zones. More so with those that have insta-minefields. Well, maybe remove the capzone force proportions bar, so that people don't know if they are capping the zone or not - this may encourage people to actually clear the zone, or push slowly.

Well, there you have it, the huge zones - IMO - simulate areas where it's not so easy to tell who's gaining the upper hand and all you can do is slowly push the enemy out of the contested area. The small capzones woule, on the other hand, simulate the objectives where it's pretty clear who's controlling it.

 

[Britney Federline]

I've always thought that RO should have a bunch of small capzones that need to all be controlled simultaneously before they can get locked. It would look terrible on the overhead maps (at least as they are implemented now), but you could divide the floor of a building into individual rooms that each must be capped. When they're all capped at the same time, the floor is considered capped.

 

[I. Kant]

Sounds like an interesting alternative to look into, yes.

 

[Reddog]

I've always thought that RO should have a bunch of small capzones that need to all be controlled simultaneously before they can get locked. It would look terrible on the overhead maps (at least as they are implemented now), but you could divide the floor of a building into individual rooms that each must be capped. When they're all capped at the same time, the floor is considered capped.

I like and endorse this idea, it is made of win.

 

[Lt_Kettch]

I've always thought that RO should have a bunch of small capzones that need to all be controlled simultaneously before they can get locked. It would look terrible on the overhead maps (at least as they are implemented now), but you could divide the floor of a building into individual rooms that each must be capped. When they're all capped at the same time, the floor is considered capped.

That's already possible But nobody has done it because they have not thought of it or the editor is just too clumsy for this

 

[worluk]

That's already possible But nobody has done it because they have not thought of it or the editor is just too clumsy for this

Actually I even wrote an actor for that.

 

[Yoshiro]

IMO, you could even take that to a larger scale. To control a large area, you don't sit in the middle of it, you surround it.

 

[Nathan Bay]

I personally want more city levels with tanks in it. Kinds like how danzig was set up with the bridges and such, and have the tank cross over them.

 

[Fedorov]

One idea I had:

when selecting a tanker class, you also choose the tank you want to be in (with player slot limit for each tank of course), right now, the spawns in tank maps are chaotic, lots of iddle people, solo tankers, tkers, etc...

I say keep the posibility to get in or out of (your tank).
Then, if a tanker dies out of the tank, but the tank is not destroyed or stil has people inside, the respawn time should be longer for that tanker, but when he respawns he respawns inside of that same tank (to avoid the possible problem of multiple tank spawns).

also add the posibility to request change position inside the tank, for example, If I'm MG and I want to be commander, should I send the commander a request to switch positions instead of one having to get out for the other to switch and then get back in.

you may say, what if you get stucked with a n00b tanker... well, that happens already now already, and the choice is go with the n00b or stay in the spawn waiting for another tank. Just try to find another tank with a free slot in the character selection.

so the n00b problem is not solved with this system, but is not worsened either, right now there are a lot of n00bs who take the MG /Sniper / Commander positions or take over the IS2 for himself and there is nothing you can do about it.

but this system solves the already existing problem that when you are already with a good tank crew and for some reasons one of them die, and then a n00b takes his position, and steal your tank driving in circles just for the sake of ruining your fun.

 

[Colt .45 killer]

I see alot of good comments here that I am sure Tripwire will take to heart.

So please keep the lists coming.

In that case i Think it might be a good idea to steer this conversation in a different direction for a bit. Many people all post on what they want added to the game, but its very common for things people want removed to stay around mostly because they suggest new ideas, instead of refining what already exists. (no this is not a bash fest)

-- Limited run distance: The jog option should be a button you can hold down till the bleeding cows come home, perhaps a double tap of this would result in an all out run, which could still be maintained for a long time (I mean three minutes minimum) but would result in increased weapon sway for a time after. (Also using the full out run should decrease your mouse sensitivity as in BIA, that way you cant turn on a dime while running)

--Points oriented system: I described this somewhere else, but no matter how a point system is achieved, points results in point prostitution, the objective should be to WIN, minus all side objectives like point padding...

--Disapearing Meshes: This one is more anesthetics, but it would be very nice if destroyed tanks would turn into lower poly hulks, perhaps corpses could also stay (server side option, possibly somewhat user controlled). Its anesthetics, and somewhat an aspect of reality...

--Linear maps/F!@# repetitive: Has anayone else noticed how many of the stock maps look like they were all designed with the predisposed knowledge that team a will spawn here, team B over here, and they will attack this point. Then defenses are put in place in the form of trucks and other stuff to defend that point.
This could be fixed by either randomising the maps, either by making a puzzle system with chunks that fit together in different orders, or by more depth. Or by making one pristine map, and running a damage simulation which simulates some bombing/artillery/random crap damage before dropping the players into the map (really not indepth simulation here, just a few random craters, building x is rubble, and building y,z have holes in them, and are on fire).
(this one really applies to stock maps, many of them just felt too deliberate as opposed to customs like berenzinia, as a second side note, this also deals with on time nade spam, which results from people knowing the map)

Edit: one more thing, im not sure what, but please do something about the cap points, seeing as being around a cleared cap point is the same as being inside.
(hrmm perhaps the defenders cap points would always slowly slide towards the enemy team, forcing the defending team to always be around or inside it, while if the defending team could clear them out and stop them from getting it they would cap it without being inside..., just a thought)

 

[Pastel]

Good list, and I have a suggestion that might improve these two problems. As I see it, part of the problem is that people arrive to the battlefield one or two guys at the time due to respawn system. This effectively breaks down all squad tactics because people are not going to wait other guys to spawn and then move out as a squad. To remedy this, I'm suggesting that reinforcements for infantry would arrive in batches of maybe 7 or so (this should be carefully tested, too large number means too slow reinforcements and too small ruins the idea). So you don't respawn after 20 seconds but after six other infantry players have been killed. When these seven fighters arrive to the spawn area simultaneously it will automatically enhance team play and IMO is also a bit more realistic. IRL combatants probably moved to the combat zone in squads (~12 men?) or teams (>~4) at least and not individually.

Also, on open field maps, they should spawn directly in transports. It's really annoying to have to either run for 3 minutes or wait a long time until a new vehicle spawns because someone is using the current one as a machine gun.

 

[Mormegil]

-- Limited run distance: The jog option should be a button you can hold down till the bleeding cows come home, perhaps a double tap of this would result in an all out run, which could still be maintained for a long time (I mean three minutes minimum) but would result in increased weapon sway for a time after. (Also using the full out run should decrease your mouse sensitivity as in BIA, that way you cant turn on a dime while running)

I think the current run/sprint system is fine. What a lot of people fail to realize is the usual moving speed is already a jog. It's not often you walk in a battle, so jog is the default speed.

The sprint button is exactly that - an all out sprint/run. You can't sprint forever. So no need for that double tap as any faster would be unrealistic.

Great suggestions for the rest, I think.

 

[Domingo_Chavez]

Hey guys, I just bought the game today and gave it a try.

The main problem Ive seen so far how to encourage players to play as a team.
Project Reality (A BF2 Mod) does it by squads. Every person joins a squad and they can communicate with that squad. The squad leader in turn can communicate with other squad leaders and the commander.

This encourages players to stick together as the squad leader can put down a "rally point" or spawn point, with him and 2 other squad members present.

I think for realism games like this to truly work, something like this has to be implemented. Not only this but I think that there should be over bonuses for sticking near squad leaders and teammates.

Maybe something like:

-Longer sprint times
-Better accuracy
-Less suppression syndrome (w/e happens when enemy fire comes near you)
-Being able to plant a spawn point.

These things all help players feel like that are actually part of a team working towards an objective. Also I think that the defending and attacking teams should have 1-2 minutes before each round to plan out an attack. The defense team should be allowed to enter the field immediately and begin setting up and the attacking team should be allowed to form squads and look at a map of objectives and talk about how to plan. Also another idea I have been thinking about is to allow the commander (or whoever drops arty) to be able to view the battlefield from the air for several seconds, several times during the match, either by capturing a certain strategic sector, or a elevated point on the map, this would allow him to accurately and efficiently, direct ground troops and tanks.

The squads should be as diverse as possible, so that each man compliments the others, several rifleman, a BAR, thompson, sniper, w.e. just enough so that each squad could possibly survive on its own. Maybe even a medic?

Also perhaps in addition to rewarding players who stick together, there should be something that hinders players who dont? Something like,

-Line of site decrease
-Fear of being alone, which makes you slower, more cautious and less effective.

I think that this is the only way to fully take advantage of this great game and mod.
Also some kind of wiki page explaining how the game works that is easily accessible will encourage new players to join and learn how to play fast. Running to get back in the action and then just getting blasted isnt always because of poor tactics, its because of bad leadership, and bad teammate communication. I think the map and objective feature needs a little help so that squads and teammates can easily see where they need to go to help out.

Also the fluidity of the weapons is rather troublesome sometimes. Its a pain to get killed because your weapon doesnt come out right, or w.e. maybe its just being new but I feel like the weapons handle very odd.

Anyway thats my take on it sorry about the long post. I'd love to help in w/e way I can.

Thoughts?