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as costumer asking for an opinion to the devs

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#81
Fight intense battles on 13 authentic Eastern Front combat environments
can you figth in 13 maps? yes you can

Crew 14 fully realized vehicles with highly detailed exterior and interior models
there is nothing about "exact copy of their reallife counterparts", its "detailed"

Choose from 28 authentic infantry weapons
modeled wrong? in what way? given the trianglelimits in game engines.


Full 32 player online Multiplayer Support
-Stimmt!

Unique Setting. The only FPS to focus on the WWII Russian Front
"focus" is the keyword my friend.

Engage enemy tanks at 800 metres and more with the Simulation-level armored vehicle combat
all you link to is about consequences, nothing about a definition of "simulation level", sorry, you fail at proving this point wrong.
Something that might be simulation-level (not even talking about that "simulation-level" doesnt mean its a simulation) for you might be different for someone else.

Fight the full range of combined arms infantry and vehicle combat in detailed environments based on
real-world data, from city-centre to deeply rural settings
I dont see any word that states how far the detail level goes.

Realistic bullet and projectile ballistics will make you duck for cover
-Stimmt!

Coordinate strategies with your team-mates via Voice Over IP
it works for most, problems that might occur reside mostly in the underlying APIs and are not something TW is responsible for

Authentic Immersive Sound FX and 3d Positional Sound System
- STimmt!

3d ?Iron Sights? and unique 3d scope system
Which game had 3d scopes the way RO does it before RO?
Cant comment on that, but fact is that "unique" can be interpreted in so many ways that you will fail terribly in front of any court to prove them wrong.

True weapon deployment system including resting rifles on support
Can you rest your weapon or not?

Historically accurate artillery system
Cant comment on that, but im quite sure that Alan along with several others can prove you easily wrong.

Distance-based sound system dynamically creates the battle ambiance
-Stimmt!

Advanced player movement system featuring diving over obstacles and leaning
-Stimmt!

Custom 8 way animation system for highly realistic player animations
There are 8 seperate animations for the several directions, which try to resemble the real human movement. Whats wrong?



Sorry, you give no proof that something is wrong, all you state is opinion. You might want to have a look at the (unfortunatly) looked conspiracy thread in the podium. There are several examples what a fact and what opinion is.
I really hope for you that you dont go about juristical problems the same way, you will get yourself into deep trouble.

"Meinungen sind wie Arschl
Click to expand...
 
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#83
Wow just WOW... LOL Tanks do need alot of improvement though but RO aint claiming to be a WW2 Tank Sim but ya I'd love it to be a Tank Sim. The product we got now is fine with me well worth the price I paid for it so I'm not going to demand anything from devs just hope they notice that some things need to improve to attract new players and or keep existing *****ing players.
 
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#86
Switchblade said:
k

I have been following this thread over the last days and I do not like where it is going.

Stop the personal attacks now!
The first to take a swing at another after this post will have a nice long vacation, and will get this thread locked and deleted :mad:
Click to expand...

thx you for that. It should keep it clean. I apreciate that.

Jokerman said:
Just wait for the upcoming patch before you start such an emotinal thread.
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well, thats what I and many others did the last half jear "waiting" for patches ... they did a great job so far with many fixes, like the machine guns and removing errors like FPS drops and lags etc.. But the tanks are still the major problem of the game. No doubt.

worluk said:
Sorry, you give no proof that something is wrong, all you state is opinion. You might want to have a look at the (unfortunatly) looked conspiracy thread in the podium. There are several examples what a fact and what opinion is.
I really hope for you that you dont go about juristical problems the same way, you will get yourself into deep trouble.
Click to expand...

My target with the laws, was only to show you, that I HAVE rights. I never aimed with to make some trouble for 39 euros. That would not be worth the fight. And as I often enough stated, the game makes in many other parts a very good job. But doesnt mean that I do not have the rights as costumer and can not use them. I studied it long enough. And gradiuation of 4 years in german business (School for economies) are enough. Just check the laws. I havn't read yet that threat with the conspiracies. And i seriously dont know what you mean with it. But I also do not care about what for conspiracies spook around in the forum. I dont believe in any conspiracy. The tanks are in both ways not working right. If it is a german or russian tank. They all have strange behaviour. I just asked some questions, and hoped for a answer. If i dont get them. It is MY problem. I try to stay as uncomitted as possible. But even I am just a human and are controled by my feelings. This here is not a personal flame war against developers or parts of the community. Seems hard today to get answers on just a few questions ...

Anyway.

worluk said:
Sorry, you give no proof that something is wrong, all you state is opinion(...)
Click to expand...
yes ... sorry, forgive me. Youre of course right. Its just about opinion. But ... here, some clips of the opinions.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhJtcWwDJxg
The perfect simulation ... yet not even "simulation - level". If this hapens on 5 m. It happens also on 800.


http://gunpics.net/movies/movies.html
(great page!)

http://gunpics.net/movies/g43a.AVI
http://gunpics.net/movies/g43b.AVI

http://gunpics.net/movies/svt40a.AVI
http://gunpics.net/movies/svt40b.AVI

compare the reload/shoting of this G43/Svt40 rifles with the curent rifles in game. With shooting the last remaining bullet inside, the bolt stays open! Yet no need to cycle it except manualy. Also the DP28 and MG42 have some minor "details" in its exterior that do not fitt to the real weapons, but are just minor issues. Though the G43 and SVT40 can here not called authentic.

With the scope youre probably true, since i can not rember for now a game with that feature. But i could swear i have seen that already somwhere else ... anyway. Youre probably right.

and for the artilery, you can every time go to the axis history forum and ask people there that have the books at home. Or also go and get documentions/bvooks about artillery use in WW2. Such powerfull weapons was never given to commanders on such low level ... particularly not during a close fire fight! Most of the sergants have not even be really trained in correct tactical use of it! There is thx to better technology and way more accurate artillery and rocket based support ways to give such powerfull weapons to even small squads. But not back in 1940's
 
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#87
Fun > Realism

I like arty, on Basovka it makes the map pretty intense.
Do you honestly want to play Konigs without arty?

If realism was really all that great we'd being playing the AB mutator with 20 t34's against 5 german tanks. And everyone would be boycotting until the StuG with the stupid mg was mounted on the cupola.

The tanks are wrong but it generally, not frustrating. Honestly, for $20 RO has now what; 50 or so maps, quite a few tanks and armoured vehicles, and the most realistic infantry combat of any game out. Soon there will be 3~4 mods coming out, even more tanks, workable mortars, and anti-tank guns etc.

In general, I have to say although there are a few things that annoy me (clipping, online Nazi's) RO is really quite fun to play. After all, that's what it really boils down to.

Not one of the things you've mentioned, esssentially break the game.

Well and may have to do with the fact that I think tanks are lame. I don't really bother playing with them often.
 
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#90
jedinstven-o crni Wuk said:
Also the next generation engines are just aroun the courner. Unreal 3, Cry-tech(?) engine etc. with also new physcis and possibilties. So no doubt. Uneral2 is outdated in many ways. Doesnt mean its a bad engine.
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Its not the unrealengine 2, its the unrealengine 2.5, an updated version of the engine. New features are, for example, the 8-way animation system, the blurring (the blur in the mod-version was just a hack), the Blooming, and various optimisations.
The engine was in no way "outdated" when the game was released (and only that date counts). Just because a few "uber-engines" are "around the corner" right now, doesn't mean that they were usable when the game was released (and you have to go a few months back from there, because the game wasn't summoned by Rammj
 
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#92
me as a mapper i couldn't be happyer with the choice of the engine, mapping and modding ease for RO is lightyears ahead of many other games.
i used to map for Call of duty, so dont tell me about user-unfriendly engines.
the cod engine is like a MS-dos game, you have to know exactly where to type what, you miss a comma and it will crash.
 
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#93
Murphy said:
stuff
Click to expand...
You are forgetting the likes of Battlefield 2 etc... there's more than just source, quake and unreal when it comes to engines... ESPECIALLY if they incorporate vehicle combat.

The unreal2.5 engine was a BAD choice for a game like RO, it was merely the best choice given the limited options available at that time to even get TW into the gaming scene (MSU contest basically was the birth hour of TW). But that was 2003-4. By 2006 the game was, simple as, that outdated, especially the clumsy animations, but other things aswell. All the bending has led to the whole engine being seriously overstretched, giving worse performance than many better looking games... and producing some serious bugs.

It's been one year now, and patch after patch, the tank combat is still a mess.

And that's still DF2 not Landwarrior ;)
 
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#94
KrazyKraut said:
By 2006 the game was, simple as, that outdated, especially the clumsy animations, but other things aswell. All the bending has led to the whole engine being seriously overstretched, giving worse performance than many better looking games... and producing some serious bugs.
Click to expand...
Just try to imagine what would happen to the Battlefield engine or any other overly stiff specialized engine if they would have "overstretched" it as much as the unrealengine 2.5.

Besides, Battlefield 2 is a gfx-card-whore and RO is a cpu whore. The performance can hardly be compared, because a computer that could never even start Battlefield 2 (e.g. one with a GeForce3) can run RO just fine with the right cpu while a computer that can't run RO properly (e.g. one with an awesome gfx-card but with only 1.7GHz) can run BF 2 just fine.

And the "clumsy animations", of which I only remember the walking animations which were fixed iirc, aren't a problem of the engine. People often mistake artwork for engine. Maybe that's why the source engine is so popular (besides the physics, which are again another story).

And don't forget that the SDK (aka UnrealEd 3.0) is still one of the best, if not THE best SDK out there (apart from the UnrealEd 4.0 of course)! And an SDK is as important for the longevity of a game as the game itself.

KrazyKraut said:
And that's still DF2 not Landwarrior ;)
Click to expand...
My bad. I just never played DF2 and Landwarrior has the same scopes.:D
 
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#95
Satisfaction... It's an individual term. It varies from person to person, sometimes drastically. Some are pleased with little, some are eager to pursue perfection to inhuman proportions. I'm pretty positive that devs were satisfied (note the individual differences here) overall with their game. Sadly, the developers definition of satisfaction isn't enough for some. Some are willing to spend hours and hours of their time to demand answers/fixes/features to the game until they can be satisfied with it. And somehow I think that even if they had their all wishes come true, would they still stop? No. Note that this wasn't directed to anyone particular, just to all the peeps at the suggestions forum demanding king tiger, soviet mine dogs, soldier pubic hair, medics, etc. While I do agree that something in RO needs to be improved, I also realise that devs are human with human resources, human needs to sleep, eat and drink, human needs to have life outside work (if you haven't noticed, this is their WORK, not their life). For me, the promise of devs supporting this game till the end of 07/ early 08 is enough to keep me from demanding things which I see are wrong. I respect the devs' vision of the game and their skill to prioritise updates and fixes. I respect it so much that I leave them to work in peace. I would be annoyed if I had dozens of people around me telling me what to do, when to do and how to do my work. Still, I'm glad that devs have the ideas and suggestions forum which they even bother to answer, despite the continuous whining.

If someone in this thread felt offended by my words, I am sorry. It wasn't intentional. Just wanted to express how I feel about this.
 
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#96
finally a somewhat mature conversation.

Yes. Its the Unreal 2.5 engine! True. I forgot about that. But still it is in its use somewhere limited, or they could spend the rest ofthe live expanding the engine. What I meant with "next" generation engines, is for example the ability to alow a much higher base of players in game then the curent 32 players for example. As how its now, RO:O is already with 32 people somewhat on its limit. It can be played with 44 and even somewhat smoth. But you need a server with the right muscles also.

Anyway. It is not the matter how much the game cost, how old it is etc. Iam just very curious about what makes the tanks compared to infantry so complicated.

To give a example. When we got the MG42 the programmers managed it to give its real and not faked ROF, unlike many others games (old DoD, cod etc.) that just give it a either higher damage or something else to compensate. So we have a gun that really spits out as much bullets as it does. Such things mean stress for the server and a lot of coding. What would it effort to have tanks with some armor that works on a simulation level? What is it here that counts, code-whise? And what would make the bigest trouble? As we seen, tiger shells richochet from a BA-car, the developers said, that for this case there is even not a code in the game. Anyway it happenend (before some patches) somewhat frequently. I am just curious .... cause it helps me when i play the game. "alright ... my panther shoot bounced of forthe 5 time from an impossible angle (BEHIND the IS2) ... but hey, it happens cause a "real" penetration is to much stress for low servers/or it means to much time coding" etc.

its not like, i would start to cry, when TW tells me, that it is a very complicated thing to code (compared to other parts of the game, like the infantry etc.). I have patience. But i also just want informations. I mean. Where is that demanded to much?
 
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#97
Good grief... I saw this briefly while I was at GDC - now it seems to have got entirely out of hand.

I'm not going to try and answer all the individual questions, nor am I even going to read through all the posts in the thread. And I am not going to indulge in an ongoing debate either - far too much work to do :)

The quick answer: we are a small team, trying to achieve a LOT of things. We built the game on a very small budget, in a very sort time. No-one ever said it was "perfect". As to "fixing" everything - we will work on stuff as we have the time and the budget to do so. We will mix what WE see as improvements to the systems with adding new content. And we haven't charged you for any of it! Now try getting EA, Ubisoft or Activision to behave like that :)

And if that means we don't manage to pick on the pieces that every single customer wants "fixed" - well, sorry, we just don't have the bandwidth to please everyone! After all, we are a studio trying to stay in business - trying to support our first title, at a level far beyond most companies' efforts, while also moving on to produce our next title.
 
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#99
As with any game, you have people unhappy and bossy about what they are "owed". Its the new generation of the "entitlement" minded. I read page 1 and 5. Here's the bottom line from my perspective.

You have three choices.
1. Play the game as it is and accept that the team can't possibly make every aspect the way every player wants.
2. Stop playing the game and rant about it all you want.
3. Join a mod group or learn how to mod the aspects you don't like and setup a server or find a server community that thinks like you do. If you create a nice alternative mod and it becomes popular, you win along with all the other guys who agree with you.

Otherwise, after pointing out the issues which have been raised and fairly obviously answered over the last year, you are wasting time and just pissing people off. This game is far from perfect, but it is MUCH more complete than most any other you will find in this genre and you will be very hard pressed to find a group of developers that spend more time WITH the community on forums and in the servers. These guys have more than earned your $20 odd dollars.
 
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#100
maybe TWI should stop supporting all these contests and giving away free stuff as prizes :D

The truth is, as a fan of RO and TWI for over 2 years now I started to respect the devs, they made something amazing in a short time and with little money. They give patches and updates for free. Maybe it's just the waiting for the next patch that is causing all the restlessnes but we should all chill out and think of the things TWI did for us all.


I think I bored myself with writing this :D
 
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