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RELEASE: Armored Beasts Beta 2.0

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#181
I will verify if the 2.01 version link/file is valid and work ok, if you have problems with it, and will post link once again. Give me half an hour.

edit:

http://www.amizaur.za.pl/files/ArmoredBeasts2_Lite_Beta2_CodeOnly.rar

Works for me in practice mode. I just verified that 2.01 from the link (downloaded it and played) works OK for me.

Will not work online if the server uses 2.0 of course. (edit: this is not true, I was mistaken, it will work without problems as the filename of both versions is different).

This problem with two versions, make me think that I should NOT release those two versions of mod (with reduced speed and normal speed) under the same filename, as this would cause just the same kind of problems. Have to modify them so they have different filename and both can co-exist in system folder. This way always correct version will be used when entering online game.
But I can't change mod name for each version update... Just alkl servers should run latest version, older is no longer used and problem ceases to exist.

My only question is: Why do all the shots bounce off regardless of whether they penetrate or not? Is this a error in the mod, or intentional for some reason that I'm not aware of?
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Do you mean - game playing ricochet sound, even when there was penetration ? Sure it's not intentional, don't know why it happens. Probably it was in stock game too, only hard to notice as ricochet and penetration sounds were quite similar. I can remove ricochet sounds from mod )I mean revert them to stock ones), and leave only new penetration sounds, and we'll see. I doubt it's because of projectile speed, but we'll see too when I release two versions, one with reduced speed and second with true speed, we can compare them working then and know for sure if it's a problem or not. My bet is, that it's not, but I'm curious too.

P.S. Just noticed one more bug, or incompatibility of the mod. Generally, I projected it to be compatible with not modded non-standard vehicles (like german T-34) in the way, that old (like in normal RO) penetration calculations are called if modded tank fires at non-modded one or vice versa. They should both act like in stock RO then. It was this way early in the mod, but later somwhere before release I made a change in the code that disabled this compatibility and didn't notice that. So no old routines are called if you shoot at non-standard tank and it is probably indestructable (always ricochets). Someone reported this to me, I would check it sooner of course but have my GFX card in service and can't play online very much or even can't run some maps in practice mode. Today I noticed this thing in code and reminded the report of problems with German T-34. Sorry, my fault. I will revert this partial compatibility in next update.

Anyway, the mod was not "officialy" compatible with maps using non-standard vehicles. It should improve in the future as I'm in contact with ViVid already (you will get next version as soon as I finish it), other map makers can contact me too to make mod-compatble maps or versions of maps. I have to got your non-standard vehicles to make mod versions of them, or I can to give you base tank code so you can make AB versions by yourself.
 
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#182
Quietus said:
I'll restate what I said in a previous post: Yes I'm using the 2.0 version but I have yet to test 2.1 because I can't get it to work. In the future inform people that things such as the front hull armor of a tank hasn't been modified so players don't start thinking there is a conspiracy against the Russians when the IS2 bounces rounds @ 100 meters from its hull.


Maybe, maybe not. The Tiger1 is touted as having ultra high grade quality armor but that doesn't automatically mean other German tanks armor was as "high end" as the Tigers. They could've used lesser grades of armor and probably did seeing as STUGs & PzIV(H) were made in huge numbers compared to the tiger.


There's nothing wrong that sounds about right and fair to me BUT I'm using 2.0 version and can't try 2.1 to test if things are fixed. In 2.0 SU76 can't penetrate STUG even at 100 meters frontally and T34(76) KV-1 only at 100 meters, so that's what had me enraged.


I know SU76 weren't designed as dedicated tank killers like the STUG (not to mention their armor is no where as thick as STUG). If TW would've chose the correct tanks from the begining the tank combat of RO would be alot more realistic & representitive of actual tank face offs but what's done is done and all we can do now is hope for modders and or TW to listen to tankers about what good choices for tanks in the future would be.

From the begining TW should've made these:

SU-152
SU-100
KV-1
T34/76(they did)
T-34/85(they did)
T-70
IS2(they did)

These would've been the optimum choices that I can think of for providing the widest array of good useful Russian tanks from 1941 till 1945.

German tanks have the same problem but not as severe: (PzIV (f2) instead of the way more common and better armored PzIV(H) is the immediate one that I can think of.
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I battle these things out on the battlefront forums with "grogs" people that live life huddled over a books and papers from ww2 24/7. You find a lot of your answer to these question there.

Quietus you questions on the stug are not specific, the many variants of the Stug came with 80mm frontal plating and then also 50/30mm frontal plating the first type of spacial armour. Also every variant had different releases so a Stug IIIG made in April may not be made exactly the same in November even though they have the same designation.

Russian rounds up to 1943 from all 76mm guns were prone to shattering and the were less qualitier also you got to be more deatil on the type of rounds the russian love to talk about the rounds penetrations from their famous tungsten rounds but these rounds were so rare that you would only have 2 or 3 per tank.

Also on the RussianBattlefield site there is a story about a AT-Gunner and they were given 2 tungsten rounds and treated them like gold.

A lot of these discussions have been thrashed out in the Battlefront forums for years now, one thing that has come out is the stug is too historical strong in cmbb but in the standard RO it is so weak that it is ridiculas.

The T-70 can be made from the T-60 model they are exactly the same ok you would need a 45mm gun butyour pushing symantecs.

Also the KV-1S which is in RO you could make the KV-1 which was the standard KV-1 and thousand times more deadly. Also remember the T-34/76 gun is eaxctly the same as the KV-1 Gun

CMBB includes armour quality values and the difference between a Tiger armour quality and a PIV is minimal, in production terms they were treated no differently. Put that down to the natural german instinct to aim for perfection.

Another little tipfor guys is the Panther was face hardened, so the first round that hit the panther sometimes cracked the armour plating making round that hit it frontally later possibly penetrate.

But I suggest any armour comments to visit the www.battlefront.com site in the forums and do a search, you will find much more info their with links to factual data to build a case.

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As for map makers I would personally like to see collabration with this fine mod, if we can have a standard of a .u file and its this mod it would mean it being very easy to add these new tanks or variants inot the maps without conflict.

I am behind this project 100% and the finished version of Narva will have this mod imbedded I hope rather then a mutator.
 
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#184
Quietus said:
2.01 still won't work. It shows up in the mutator menu, I activate it but it doesn't work. 2.0 works fine. Eh, I don't know...
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What exactly happens ? What does it mean "don't work" ? It shows an error, plays like normal RO (no exit from turret to top of the tank) or what ?

Just tried Black Day July and German T-34. It is indestructable when hit from AB tank, but it's shells can destroy modded vehicles. Have to fix it.
 
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#186
Quietus said:
I'll restate what I said in a previous post: Yes I'm using the 2.0 version but I have yet to test 2.1 because I can't get it to work. In the future inform people that things such as the front hull armor of a tank hasn't been modified (..)
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Check the post #18 from the first page of this thread. Yes I really forgot that I changed Panther's hull armor between 2.0 and 2.01, but before forgetting this I in fact mentioned it in list of changes of 2.01 and it is still there. You would know that Panther armor was modified if you read the description above link to 2.01 file. Don't have time to answer the rest now, maybe in the evening. 2.01 works for others, so most likely the cause is not in the mod but rather in your RO/mod install.

edit: you say it is in mutator list, and plays like normal RO. But is the mut CHOSEN ? Is it in the right window of active muts and still plays like normal RO ?
 
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#188
Make sure, you have the mod soundpack in Sounds directory. I get this result (mut showing and activated, but not working in game) only when I delete ArmoredBeastsSoundsLite.uax from Sounds directory. Make sure you have it there.
If you have correct ArmoredBeastsSoundsLite.uax soundpack in RO Sounds, and 2.01 files (ArmoredBeasts2Lite.u and .ucl) in RO System, and it still doesn't work, then I have no idea why.

P.S. Tell me maybe, as I'm curious, in your opinion from what range should T-34/76 be able to kill a Stug-IIIF/8 frontally in 1943 ? :)

And contrary to what I wrote few posts ago, AB versions 2.0 and 2.01 CAN co-exist on one RO installation without problems - you don't have to delete manually one to play the other online.
I forget that I myslef CHANGED MUT NAME in 2.01 so it's a different file and can't make version conflict. You can have both versions if you like, or if you need. Sorry for misleading in this, seem I had no sleep for too long today...
 
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#191
Amizaur said:
Make sure, you have the mod soundpack in Sounds directory. I get this result (mut showing and activated, but not working in game) only when I delete ArmoredBeastsSoundsLite.uax from Sounds directory. Make sure you have it there.
If you have correct ArmoredBeastsSoundsLite.uax soundpack in RO Sounds, and 2.01 files (ArmoredBeasts2Lite.u and .ucl) in RO System, and it still doesn't work, then I have no idea why.
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I have everything where it should go, still won't work.

Amizaur said:
P.S. Tell me maybe, as I'm curious, in your opinion from what range should T-34/76 be able to kill a Stug-IIIF/8 frontally in 1943 ? :)
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The TW Stug is not really the "G" model but the F8 right? I did some research and the STUG III F/8 is probably immune frontally in most spots to the T34/76. The gun mantlet however is 50mm thick at zero (or 90degree/ whatever, it's flat no angle) so the T34/76 gun could probably penetrate the manlet at 1000 meters (even a little more). So T34 would have to hit manlet for any chance frontally. I don't know if you can model that or not.
 
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#192
We shouldn't be modeling the F/8 because there was only 338 were actually made, we should be modelling the Stug IIIG that was by far the most included in the war. Some 7,893 of these units were made.

The actual model difference between the two as far as appearance is minimal. Or if you do model the F/8, please made a G factory as well.
 
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#193
overall a great mut!
dont know if its a bug but the t34 allways dies when u hit the hull even when u only hit it with the 75 mm KwK 40 L/48 of the pz4h the other way around the pz4 is very hard to oneshot even with the more powerfull 85mm canon. this is just not realistic .
i also wonder if u changed something with the ammoboxes, because they seem to be bigger now.

EDIT: would it be possible to handle the herounds like the atrounds and give them rangespecific penetration. it would be great if you could kill small tanks and especially apcs with herounds.
in reallity tankcrews were told to use he against lightarmored vehicels because they are more effective then atrounds. in my opinion a spw, a brencarrier, a ba or even a t60 should not allways be dead after one ap because it is very likely that the round just passes through the vehicle without detonating and there is nearly no spall inside the vehicle because it has nearly no armor. a few kg tnt of a heround are more effective.
the herounds we have now are a bad joke. even a 122mm he round cant kill a apc in one shot.

hope to see you soon on a populated ABserver!
 
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#194
arnold said:
overall a great mut!
dont know if its a bug but the t34 allways dies when u hit the hull even when u only hit it with the 75 mm KwK 40 L/48 of the pz4h the other way around the pz4 is very hard to oneshot even with the more powerfull 85mm canon. this is just not realistic .
i also wonder if u changed something with the ammoboxes, because they seem to be bigger now.
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Its not a bug the T-34 (76-85) only had 45mm of armor (which was sevearly overmatched by the 75mm) the 75 Kwk 40 L/48 could penetrate up to: 64mm of armor at 2000 meters (30 degrees from vertical).

Great job on this mod guys!

Any chance of smoke candles and /or smoke rounds being implemented in the future?
 
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#196
sorry tt33 you dint get the point.
when the pz4 allways oneshots the t34 then in should be the same the other way around, at least if its the t3485. its gun had no probs penetratin the pz4 at any ranges. the problem that i have with the situation right now is that the pz4 is very hard to oneshot. i have seen some 122mm shells penetrating and the pz4 was still allive. but the t34 allways dies when it is penetrated in the hull.

why should a penetrating 75mm shell be so much more devestating than a penetrating 85mm round?
 
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#200
Are you guys working on a 2.02 version because I still can't get 2.01 to work.

Also some ideas: What version is the KV-1 now? Is it KV-1, KV-1e, KV-1b, KV-1c? Because there are alot of possibilities for good variation of it. The b, e and c versions had applique armor (bolted on slabs to increase thickness). You could distinguish standard KV-1 from applique versions simply by modifying the tanks texture a different color + alter it to look like applique armor (add bolts on the turret etc). Also what are the plans for APCR & HEAT for Russian tanks? I realize they were very limited & rare (maybe 2 rounds per tank) but they should be included if the Germans get APCR and or HEAT (not sure if Germans had HEAT rounds). Also if you do add APCR and or HEAT make sure to give them a different sound when they hit so people know what they were hit with and there is no confusion/accusations.
 
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