End of Empires Mod - RO2/RS conversion to 1949.

[Orgrim Doomhammer]

The point of this mod is to provide a framework for advancing the game period from 1942, to 1949, while changing some of the game mechanics, for a minimum amount of editing time. For this, we want to recycle as many weapon's models as possible, while also significantly changing game-play.

We utilize stock RO2/RS maps, but with the capacity to select factions at the start of the map. These factions have team related perks that don't require significant model editing, just changes to the game mechanics, along with utilization of already existing weapons. This can be expanded, but the point here is to greatly reduce the amount of programming and modeling time by using pre-stocked things.

In this mod, we have a scenario where all the countries present are powerful, with unique traits that determine how a game is played, with technology that exists in each at that time period. These countries are

U.S.A.
Germany
Britain
France
Soviet Union
Japan
People's republic of China

The perks i'd like to give each team are.

USA: Air Dominance and Body Armor; Faster recon plane recharges and greatly reduced torso damage from all weapons (effective body armor was *just* invented at this time).
Germany: Discipline and Conditioning; Suppression effects reduced by 50%, stamina increased by 100%, movement speed by 10%
Britain: Intelligence Coup; Invisible to recon planes.
France: Counterinsurgency and elastic defense; all enemies within 40m are visible to player on radar, 10% reduction in number of people in capzone (9 players are even with 10 enemies in a capzone)
Soviet Union: Fire support and last stand; artillery recharge time reduced by 25%, spawn protections don't apply when defending or attacking.
China: Human Wave + Battle hardened: +50% reinforcements, no recon, +10% movement speed, + 50% stamina, -50% suppression.
Japan: Uses the preexisting special traits (banzai, booby traps, suicide kills) from rising storm.

In the next post, I will describe weaponry for the teams, with the intent to recycle as much from RO2 as possible, while greatly reducing the number of gun modeling.

 

[Orgrim Doomhammer]

Weapon's

Weapon's

For all intents and purposes, the primary work here will be in gun modeling, as the traits require solely slight game engine tweaks. Here, there will be as much recycling from RO2 wherever possible.

Modeling tanks would be excessive amounts of work, and can be done later if desired. This will be followed in the next post.

German:

Riflemen: G41 (G43 is functionally equivalent)
Assault: MkB 42 (STG 45 is functionally equivalent)
Engineer: Mp40, G41
Sl: Mp40, G41
MG: MG 42 (Could modify the MG 34 to increase its rate of fire)
AT: next post
Tank: next post
Tl: MkB 42

Soviets:

Riflemen: SKS (will need to model)
Assault: Ak-47 (Will need to model)
Engineer: Sks/Pps/Ppsh
MG: RPD-46 (will need to model)
Sl: Pps/Ppsh/SVT-40
Tl: Ak-47/SVT-40

France:

Only 3 weapons are needed. Pistol is equivalent of Colt.
Riflemen: Mas 49/56 (Semiautomatic rifle that behaves like SVT-40, but world's first underbarrel grenade launcher)
Engineer: MAT 49 SMG (Pretty much same ballistics as MP-40)
MG: FM-24/29
Sniper: Springfield
Sl: Mas49/56 MAT-49
Tl: MAS-49/56 MAT-49

Britain: Only 3 weapons needed (Use american models with British helmet)

Riflemen: EM-2 Assault rifle (basically a reverse engineered FG-42 that was almost mass produced)
Engineer: Sten/Thompson/Trench Shotgun
MG: Bren
Sniper: Springfield
Sl: EM-2/Sten/Thompson
Tl: EM-2

Americans: Mostly modifying existing weapons

Riflemen: Garand with fixed (i.e. hollowed out front sights)
Engineer: M2 Carbine/Shotgun (Carbine gets fixed sights)
MG: Stays the same
Sniper: Stays the same
Sl: M2 Carbine/Thompson
Tl: M2 Carbine/Thompson

The key difference between the M1 carbine and M2 carbine is that the M2 is the assault rifle variant with fully automatic fire and a 30 round magazine.

Japan: Two weapons are needed; Bolt action rifles are replaced by japanese garand.

Riflemen: Type 4 rifle; Copy of M1 Garand with 10 round box for 7.7 nambu
Engineer: Get submachine guns/shotgun
Assault: Stays the same
Light Mortar: Type 4 rifle, remains the same.
MG: Type 99 or Type 62, a belt fed weapon.
Sniper: Remains the same
Sl: Type 100 or Type 4 rifle
Tl: Type 100 or Type 4 rifle

China: Uses Soviet character models with Japanese faces.

Riflemen: Kar98k
Assault: Thompson/Sten
Engineer: Shotgun/Kar98k
Sniper: Scoped Kar98k
MG: MG 34
Sl: SVT-40/PPs
Tl: SVT-40/PPs

 

[Orgrim Doomhammer]

Vehicles and AT

Vehicles and AT

If this successfully gets off the ground, I would like to add Anti Tank weapons as well. Because tanks take excessive amounts of time to model, it might be prudent just to modify the tank armor on the existing Panzer IV and T-34's to simulate what the more modern AT weapons would do against a more modern tank. The British, American, German, and French team spawn with a Panzer IV on combined arms maps, while the Chinese, Soviets, and Japanese spawn with a T-34, demonstrating superior western designs versus Soviets as an interim measure.

The AT weapons i'd like to see

Super-Bazooka: USA, France
Panzerfaust 100: German's, Japanese
British: PIAT
Soviets: RPG-2, RPG-6 AT grenade
Chinese: M18 Recoiless rifle, RPG-6 AT grenade.

 

[Orgrim Doomhammer]

As can be expected, each team, when combined with its available weapons and team perks, has a slightly different play style.

The French, with their semi-automatic rifles combined with a less powerful Type 89, along with their ability to hold caps with less players than enemies, make for excellent defensive fighters. This is offset by a fairly weak SMG and over-powered and less handy semi-automatic rifles.

The British, with their assault rifles and invisibility to radar, make for the most powerful all-around infantry force in the game. This is offset by a weaker AT capacity than the rest of the factions.

The Chinese, with much greater tickets, lower spawn times, and fast movers, are capable of expending huge numbers of lives and quickly swarming objectives. This is offset by the weakest guns in the game.

The German's have a very powerful infantry force, when combined with fast movement, allows them to dominate the battlefield. This is offset by other teams perks.

The Japanese maintain their perks from rising storm, with the addition of every infantry now having the equivalent of an SVT-40. This can be utilized to great effect as now they are on a much leveler playing field when it comes to weapons.

The Soviets also have extremely strong infantry weapons, which, combined with the ability to infiltrate enemy areas and greater volumes of artillery, can quickly dominate the battlefield. This is offset by an AT weapon comparable to the british and still having to rely on AT grenades for guaranteed kills.

Lastly, the American's are physically harder to kill than the other factions, while its weapons have been updated to stay on par with the rest of the factions, along with greater situational awareness due to recon being available far sooner than other teams.

I'm currently learning to model, but I think this can be done by a medium sized team fairly quickly, as the only changes are to the game mechanics and about 8 weapons needing to be created, 11 if AT are included.

I do think this has potential.

 

[Drecks]

I'm currently learning to model, but I think this can be done by a medium sized team fairly quickly, as the only changes are to the game mechanics and about 8 weapons needing to be created, 11 if AT are included.

I do think this has potential.

I'm known for my bottomless pit of optimism I always see the glass half full.

So I have this one question.

Did you, before you posted this thread, checked the current state of all the announced RO 2 mods ?

 

[Orgrim Doomhammer]

I'm known for my bottomless pit of optimism I always see the glass half full.

So I have this one question.

Did you, before you posted this thread, checked the current state of all the announced RO 2 mods ?

I'm aware that the AK-47 and SKS are being created by the In Country group.

I'm aware of the Garand sight mods that are available, that i'd like to use.

I'm not so sure about the modified carbine to assault rifle level.

I'm not sure of the status on the MG 42.

I know for certain those french weapons haven't been created, the British either, and the Japanese Garand is not present.

It looks like a fairly significant amount of work is based upon modifying the engine to make servers, at the beginning of each map, have players select Axis or Allies, then vote for a faction they want to play with. Then the server rules and some game code need to have modifiers for the factions (i.e. set reinforcements to 1.5x if china is picked, recon unavailable; set damage to torso to 30% for american's).

 

[AussiePariah]

Too many mods have died. I suggest start small and concentrate on Germany vs Russia and build up once that is done

 

[Orgrim Doomhammer]

Too many mods have died. I suggest start small and concentrate on Germany vs Russia and build up once that is done

The beauty is that through recycling large amounts of content that is functionally equivalent (i.e. guns [G41 versus G43]) its not too large a project to begin with.

 

[Drecks]

Too many mods have died.

This is what I pointed too......

 

[Siegertyp]

The British, with their assault rifles and invisibility to radar, make for the most powerful all-around infantry force in the game.

The British with their reverse engineered FG42s are supposed to be more powerful than the Germans with the original FG42s and the mass produced StG44?

And why the invisibility to radar? Radar did not affect recon planes in any way, radar was used by the Germans to spot bombers and ships, not to spot troops from the air.

I'm currently learning to model, but I think this can be done by a medium sized team fairly quickly, as the only changes are to the game mechanics and about 8 weapons needing to be created, 11 if AT are included.

The finnish mod team with lots of mod experience have not released their winter war mod after two years, and their scenario was much more manageable than a multiparty 42/48 scenario.

I don't want to generally discourage you, but you should perhaps look for a more realistic project - like bringing ONE of the mentioned armies (perhaps the British or French) into the game and its existing timeframe.

 

[Catalavos]

With all the work on that list it looks like it'll be ready right about the time RO3 comes out.

"I'm currently learning to model, but I think this can be done by a medium sized team fairly quickly, as the only changes are to the game mechanics and about 8 weapons needing to be created"

I'm currently learning how to model too. I've been playing with 3DS MAX for almost 2 years and barely have 1 properly functioning static mesh working in-game.

Good luck, brother. You might want to start small, like with the British helmet. See how long it takes to get that working in-game and then adjust your hopes and dreams from there.

 

[Coin-goD]

There is a rough road from an idea to an implementaion. Just will say that 1 man, cannot do this. Specially if you lack experience and skills.

 

[Orgrim Doomhammer]

With all the work on that list it looks like it'll be ready right about the time RO3 comes out.

"I'm currently learning to model, but I think this can be done by a medium sized team fairly quickly, as the only changes are to the game mechanics and about 8 weapons needing to be created"

I'm currently learning how to model too. I've been playing with 3DS MAX for almost 2 years and barely have 1 properly functioning static mesh working in-game.

Good luck, brother. You might want to start small, like with the British helmet. See how long it takes to get that working in-game and then adjust your hopes and dreams from there.

Okay, maybe i'll readjust it to working with the teams already present, that way, I'll get the SKS and AK-47 from In Country, and the only weapon needing to be created from scratch would be the Japanese garand. Even that, is a copy of the Garand with a bit of magazine sticking out the bottom and an SVT-40 type of loading system.

Then, only the carbine needs to be modified to give it fully automatic capability and a 30 round magazine.

I think you overestimate the team perks programming hurdle. All of it is adjustable using server settings (i.e. set Axis team stamina and run speed higher, lower recharge rate on artillery for Soviets), and only the body armor issue (i.e. set damage to torso to 30% from rifle and intermediate cartridge rounds, impervious to pistol and buckshot, explosive damage reduced by 60%) involves some modification of the base code.

To get the classes to be different, i.e. spawn with a Type 4 rifle versus a type 38 or Type 99, mostly is some notebook editing.

 

[Drecks]

The point is that some people are trying to tell you that your idea is nice but its loads loads loads of work. I guess you also want new maps for this and I did read about tanks and antitanks weapons.

With previous Mod announcements you see these kind of replies like "Cool", "Great".
Isn't it a sign that you did not seen one of these ?

Still I wish you lots of succes.

 

[Orgrim Doomhammer]

The point is that some people are trying to tell you that your idea is nice but its loads loads loads of work. I guess you also want new maps for this and I did read about tanks and antitanks weapons.

With previous Mod announcements you see these kind of replies like "Cool", "Great".
Isn't it a sign that you did not seen one of these ?

Still I wish you lots of succes.

The whole point is to use stock maps and provide greater variation of game play. I for one, would love to see the Japanese attack the American's, with stronger guns, on a map like Spartanovka or Commisars house.

Its intended to keep actual time consuming work to a minimum.

To make the Japanese garand, I was planning on taking the original Garand and sutchering on an SVT-40 magazine with that style of reloading.

To fix the Garand and Carbine, use the mods already given to fix the sights and increase the magazine length.

If I were a skilled developer, I could probably crank this out with only ~40 hours of work. The problem is attaining that level of skill.

 

[Catalavos]

"If I were a skilled developer, I could probably crank this out with only ~40 hours of work."

 

[Orgrim Doomhammer]

"If I were a skilled developer, I could probably crank this out with only ~40 hours of work."

Well, i'm not really doing any modeling at all, just manipulating some UT3 code and switching the magazine and animations of the garand with the SVT-40.

Also, why is everyone so pessimistic and angry on this forum?

The combined angst here reminds me of high school.

 

[=GG= Mr Moe]

Realism does not equal pessimism. I think people here are just urging you to be realistic, and that way are more likely to follow thru on your work when the going gets tough.

I think they want you to avoid being so optimistic that when it most likely proves to take longer and be harder, you don't quit out of frustration.

 

[Catalavos]

What Moe said. I don't want to be the voice of doom any more than anyone else but dude, it really doesn't seem like you know what you're getting yourself into. Manipulating these game elements is not nearly as easy as you think.

Take adding a magazine to the Garand for instance. This would require a new model, animation sequence, 1st person art, 3rd person art, coding, etc. You can't just cut-and-paste these things in all willy-nilly. Like I said before, I've been messing with 3d modeling for a few hours every day for almost 2 years. I've watched dozens of hours worth of tutorials, read tons of forums and STILL don't have anything good to show for it. Granted, I'm half an idiot but still.

Look at the vehicle mod team. They have a bunch of guys with tons of knowledge and talent (and help from TWI with coding). They have been working very hard for over a year yet have but a beta version of 1 vehicle available in-game.

I think what we're all trying to do is talk some darn sense into you so you don't run off and get yourself hurt.

 

[Vapid]

Quite frankly, this game is unmoddable to people like us. You need to have a large, dedicated team with ample time and resources.

You're better off either learning to enjoy vanilla or volunteering your efforts in some small way to one of the larger, existing mod teams. No offence, but what other posters have said is pretty accurate.

TWI really messed up with their choice of engine, and that is evident in terms of the amount of substantive modding content available for this game despite it being a couple of years old now. It's just not worth the effort.