Another Beta opinion!

[Damo]

Hehe oh dear, some people actually are down-voting my OP

At least have the good grace to write a post telling me why you think I'm so wrong in my opinion that I deserve to gain negative rep on the forum!

I believe it has been said it is using Soft Collision, meaning you can push through players but will be slowly moved away if standing too close. Another thread about that somewhere...

Can't say I've noticed the 'soft collision' - I just seem to walk right through people, including the enemy.. which is fun

 

[dieterweber]

I was just playing a match where this bs happened. I was sitting behind a small wall watching a building, and out of the smoke a german dude SPRINTS out at me and is able to aim with no penalty and shoot me. I was shooting him at the same time, but nothing happened. This is very bad for tactical play. Everyone just sprints around.

 

[Damo]

I was just playing a match where this bs happened. I was sitting behind a small wall watching a building, and out of the smoke a german dude SPRINTS out at me and is able to aim with no penalty and shoot me. I was shooting him at the same time, but nothing happened. This is very bad for tactical play. Everyone just sprints around.

Are you totally sure it wasn't Chuck Norris

But no, I get your point - annoying isn't it!

 

[senrim]

Are you totally sure it wasn't Chuck Norris

But no, I get your point - annoying isn't it!

It can't be the chuck norris. Because he was there. http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197986517959/screenshot/594695543473647911

xD just kidding. To the topic .. i agree with you. if youre a bit lucky, you can still play it like cod ( almost)

 

[Samuraiii]

Nice post. I also aggree with most of your points.

I really hope that the maps become bigger for some distance fights maybe...
if this is given, the speed wouldnt be a big problem.

What I miss is that there isnt no resonance (yet), when you are under fire (except the colour of screen, which I begin to hate).
In my opinion this feature is the important reason, which makes the atmosphere in RO1 sooooo awesome...

 

[Damo]

Nice post. I also aggree with most of your points.

I really hope that the maps become bigger for some distance fights maybe...
if this is given, the speed wouldnt be a big problem.

What I miss is that there isnt no resonance (yet), when you are under fire (except the colour of screen, which I begin to hate).
In my opinion this feature is the important reason, which makes the atmosphere in RO1 sooooo awesome...

We'll definitely be getting bigger maps - as far as I'm aware, the Apartments map is one of, if not the smallest map in RO2 so you'll get your wish there.

 

[Kermudgeon]

Re: Another Beta Opinion

Re: Another Beta Opinion

Having just submitted a post congratulating TWI on a job well done, in which I offered opinions on most everything except game-play, I have to say I agree with the tone of much, if not all, of what you say, and the spirit in which it is expressed. I'd be willing to bet that the guys at TWI will give serious consideration to your concerns in the continuing pursuit of balancing realism and gameplay. A slower (not to be confused with awkward or clumsy) pace would increase immersion, while allowing more time to enyoy the visuals!

 

[swifta]

I had a longer post earlier but once I submitted it I was told that it had to be reviewed by a mod... weird...

I'll make this one quick, I agree 100% with the OP. It's guys like us that will stick around once all the COD junkies get bored... now to xross my fingers and hope this post shows up...heh

 

[Damo]

Having just submitted a post congratulating TWI on a job well done, in which I offered opinions on most everything except game-play, I have to say I agree with the tone of much, if not all, of what you say, and the spirit in which it is expressed. I'd be willing to bet that the guys at TWI will give serious consideration to your concerns in the continuing pursuit of balancing realism and gameplay. A slower (not to be confused with awkward or clumsy) pace would increase immersion, while allowing more time to enyoy the visuals!

Thanks for that, I do hope one or two of them have read through my ridiculously long post and at least understand some of my points.

They're a good bunch and their work is really commendable - maybe they'll consider tweaking a few things to keep us happy - failing that, they might tell us to piss off

 

[Flyynt]

Speaking as one of the mythical 'new players'...

I tend to agree with the OP.

I was not attracted to Red Orchestra 2 because I had heard it was more accessible, I was attracted to it because I was interested in a more considered and cerebral experience that what is currently on offer from other studios. This is not to say that I don't enjoy the frenetic action of Team Fortress 2 or the high energy of Bad Company 2 (that being said, I have never for the life of me understood the appeal of the later Call of Duty games). I have no need for another title that offers me that style of game play as I think both of those titles are exceptional in their own right at what they attempt to do.

Bear in mind that as it stands now, I do NOT see RO2 as being the same game as either of those titles. However, I am a bit disappointed that it is not what I was expecting in terms of pace. Of course this is still a beta and I have yet to play on any of the other maps (which may change the experience significantly). I am a bit disappointed to hear that realisim mode does not alter stamina at all as I was under the impression that it would (not that I was led to believe that, I just kind of assumed it).

Red Orchestra 2 is still very enjoyable, I was just hoping for something a bit more different from everything thing else out there. Though with stong mod support I suspect that the community will rectify these things eventually.

Be Seeing You...
-Flyynt

 

[Rumpullpus]

well written, hits just about every point i dont like. well excpt for the SMGs could use a little less accuacy at a distance.

speakin of things from RO1 has anyone seen a way to switch from full-auto to semi-auto?

 

[Banquo]

Whether you agree with Damo's opinions or not, his view has been put across in a thoughtful and objective fashion and I hope others will be able to give their own thoughts in a smilar vien. After all, what is a beta for if not to get good constructive feedback.Thanks for that Damo.

My personal opinion is that I do find the running speed and stamina points extremely valid.

Having said that I have only played a few hours so far and those that have played RO1 need to adjust to the change - after all , change is never naturally welcome.

On the whole RO2 has been great so far. With a few tweaks it will be greater still.

 

[Hoak]

Speed. It's what is for me, spoiling my experience thus far in RO2. Running around like an athlete with full kit until absolutely shattered with heavy breathing, but then being able to bring up very steady ironsights with slow and relaxed breathing is a fine example of what I'm getting at. The rate at which you can raise your weapon after sprinting is almost instantaneous and encourages rushing at any opportunity without the need to think too much.

Summery of OT post (sans the @ss kissing banter fragile Tripwire & FanPet egos sadly seem to require to respond to anything constructively) is on the money; literally in this case as there are squadron of ArmA II purchase decisions hinging how seriously this sort of thing is taken in the default RO2 game design.

Add to this the fact that the game is portraying a front where most were starving to the point where they weighed less then the gear they were wearing and hauling, and the COD:RO's olympic sprint speed takes on an added dimension of ridiculous arcade/fantasy in the context of very finite maps...

:IS2:

 

[Homuth]

Good post OP, sums up the major things which I think need some attention from dev's too. I truly miss the 'clumsiness' of Ro1 in some degree.

 

[Tweek]

Well thought out post OP.

I agree with most everything there. The speed is definiety the biggest issue. An average game at apartments is still faster than the fastest games in RO1. I'm not sure if it's map design or gameplay mechanics that cause it. The iron sights seem to sway realistically at first, but it should increase much more with time and exhaustion.

The only thing I disagree with is the zoom, it is arguably realistic. I would however get rid of it if it effects gameplay too much.

 

[jackastronaut]

Amen. The map makes me vomit with confusion.

 

[Damo]

The only thing I disagree with is the zoom, it is arguably realistic. I would however get rid of it if it effects gameplay too much.

I actually like the zoom in iron-sight mode, it's more realistic than not having it at all as your real eyes can see far greater detail than what we can see in-game. I did say I wasn't one of the players who didn't like it

That said, I wouldn't mind at all if they ditched the extra zoom when you hold shift.

 

[babokitty]

The problem with this ranting is that you guys have no idea about *GAME BALANCE*.

Let's say RO:OST had the perfect balance between weapons handling, player speed, etc.

Now introduce zoom:
--> makes hitting targets x100 easier
--> must increase player speed and turning speed to compensate
--> with the need for more sprinting around, stamina penalties must be reduced.
--> to maintain the ability to return fire against a zoomed in enemy, ironsight ready time must be reduced.

As seen above, the introduction of zoom has many follow-on requirements.

What about the introduction of norecoil:
--> norecoil favors smg over rifles
--> more sway favors smgs over rifles
--> thus less sway is needed to balance rifles with smgs

I don't think TWI will revisit the zoom and norecoil at this late stage of development. Thus, the follow-on changes must remain also.

 

[Damo]

The problem with this ranting is that you guys have no idea about *GAME BALANCE*.

Let's say RO:OST had the perfect balance between weapons handling, player speed, etc.

Now introduce zoom:
--> makes hitting targets x100 easier
--> must increase player speed and turning speed to compensate
--> with the need for more sprinting around, stamina penalties must be reduced.
--> to maintain the ability to return fire against a zoomed in enemy, ironsight ready time must be reduced.

As seen above, the introduction of zoom has many follow-on requirements.

What about the introduction of norecoil:
--> norecoil favors smg over rifles
--> more sway favors smgs over rifles
--> thus less sway is needed to balance rifles with smgs

I don't think TWI will revisit the zoom and norecoil at this late stage of development. Thus, the follow-on changes must remain also.

Ok, first of all my OP is not a rant - it is constructive criticism put in the best way I possibly could.

Secondly, have you played Darkest Hour?

Edit: Let me simplify it.

Go play the Darkest Hour mod and then tell me if it's anything like RO2's gameplay because they introduced iron-sight zoom.

 

[babokitty]

Ok, first of all my OP is not a rant - it is constructive criticism put in the best way I possibly could.

Secondly, have you played Darkest Hour? I'm sure you must have given you've been a member here since '08. The mod has iron-sight zoom. Does this make it 100x easier to kill people? No. Did they need to readdress everything else in an attempt to balance the gameplay? No. Based on that one simple fact your logic is flawed, game development simply doesn't happen the way you've just explained.

They don't add one thing at a time and then decide to add another, or simply continue to balance absolutely everything because they added one small feature. The brief is where ideas are put together, and the brief is what developers follow.

And no recoil? You mean reduced, more realistic recoil - read my OP again properly and see the part where I state that the weapons are an improvement over RO1 and offer a much more realistic experience.

No, because you can't introduce features into a game without adversely affecting other balances. Seriously, if they only introduced the zoom and "reduced" recoil into Danzig, the map would be unplayable, noone would dare leave spawn. Hence you have the other changes to balance things out.

I for one am against the zoom, I think it's a crutch and shifts the balance between attacker and defender way over to the defender's side. But what can you do? The features have been put in place. At least the devs took a top-down approach in their design choices instead of haphazardly sticking those features on. Might as well live with all the new things that came along for the ride.