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The Weakest Perk

What perk do you think is the weakest?

  • Gunslinger

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Commando

    Votes: 1 7.7%
  • SWAT

    Votes: 4 30.8%
  • Berserker

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Support

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Firebug

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Sharpshooter

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Survivalist

    Votes: 8 61.5%
  • Demolitionist

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Medic

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    13
  • Poll closed .
In my opinion, is not really a matter of being weak and more of a problem of being ineffective or not fun to play.

The Sharpshooter is a killing machine, nobody will deny that. Someone with a crackshot will be able to deal with pretty much anything. But the skills of the perk that forces you to stand still or crouch are just killjoys. His kit is basically what kills the perk for me... Even though he's actually pretty efficient.

Similarly, I think the medic needs a rework but for the exact opposite reason : he's way too good. He's the real survivalist. He has a gun for every situation, he can heals himself nearly all the time and can go battle medic if the player is feeling selfish enough. I believe he shouldn't be so binary, and his weapons shouldn't be able to blast off big zeds so easily.

IMO the true weakest link would be the survivalist, but again : mostly because he doesn't do his job nearly as great as he should. Of course the main idea is "jack-of-all-trades, master of none", but rather than using "all trades" (or most of them), he often has to resort to only one due to its skills not really promoting versatility. So if I had to vote, it would be that perk.
 
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But the skills of the perk that forces you to stand still or crouch are just killjoys.
Annoys me too
he often has to resort to only one due to its skills not really promoting versatility
True
I'm really confused between Survivalist and SWAT, they're both weak and need some modifications. I do like the idea of armor regen and movement speed for SWAT tbh. That way, the commando has higher damage but slower, while SWAT has armor regen but faster
 
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In my opinion, is not really a matter of being weak and more of a problem of being ineffective or not fun to play.

The Sharpshooter is a killing machine, nobody will deny that. Someone with a crackshot will be able to deal with pretty much anything. But the skills of the perk that forces you to stand still or crouch are just killjoys. His kit is basically what kills the perk for me... Even though he's actually pretty efficient.

Similarly, I think the medic needs a rework but for the exact opposite reason : he's way too good. He's the real survivalist. He has a gun for every situation, he can heals himself nearly all the time and can go battle medic if the player is feeling selfish enough. I believe he shouldn't be so binary, and his weapons shouldn't be able to blast off big zeds so easily.

IMO the true weakest link would be the survivalist, but again : mostly because he doesn't do his job nearly as great as he should. Of course the main idea is "jack-of-all-trades, master of none", but rather than using "all trades" (or most of them), he often has to resort to only one due to its skills not really promoting versatility. So if I had to vote, it would be that perk.
Yeah its a shame about the SS skills since I adore the weapons it has, they are fantastic to use and feel satisfying af to use. I think the real danger with a rework is to not make it too similar to GS.

Also get ready for a Field Medic and SV prototype in the works from moi.
 
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I
Yeah its a shame about the SS skills since I adore the weapons it has, they are fantastic to use and feel satisfying af to use. I think the real danger with a rework is to not make it too similar to GS.

Also get ready for a Field Medic and SV prototype in the works from moi.
Feel like Gunslinger *needs* to get headshots, but has deep ammo reserves, and fast movement to make that possible.

Sharpshooter feels like the fact that it *can* get headshots is totally extra time wasted when a chest shot kills anything short of a skrake or flesh pound.

I wish Sharpshooter could get access to damage like that while mobile. It would still reman distinct from gunslinger by ammo pool alone. I think as a rule... Gunslinger should be 'the headshot perk'. Sharpshooter should be the 'one shot kill perk'. (meaning that skrake and flesh pounds still require headshots to quickly remove.) it sort of already is that way... Just... That sharpshooter gets badly nerfed if he has to run... Dodge a husk shot... Pickup ammo or grenades from the team.... Ya know, play the game?

And don't get me wrong, I say this while the Mosin Nagant is my favorite weapon right now. I love sharpshooter and survivalist just cause I get to use it. I'm just saying....
 
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I say this while the Mosin Nagant is my favorite weapon right now.
Mosin Nagant is a good weapon but it's not the best. The SS is made to kill large zeds with a single hit (solo) or 3 hits on coop.
Railgun, AMR and Compound Bow are good for this job.

You can play as a marksman to get 10% speed movement bonus, which helps mostly on solo.
Or if you're playing on coop you could use the sniper skill, but you really have to trust your team on this one. Because if the map is filled with trash and you're crouching then you might not be able to survive (grenades help but to an extent).

Sharpshooter is made as a sniper perk, you don't expect a sniper to be moving around much, I understand that and that's why I consider it a risky option to choose. Especially since the medic can do the same thing with an incision, The Demo with the RPG and the support with the doomstick.
The only difference between all these three and the sharpshooter is that the sharpshooter can't kill trash as easy as they can.
(Demo - HRG Kaboomstick or the HX25, Support - Dragonsbreath or the Medic Shotgun, Medic - SMG, Rifle)

I think the sharpshooter needs a weapon that kills trash quicker than it does. maybe buff the spitfire weapon? because it's kind of weak.
 
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I think we should keep the basic idea of having a marksman that is nimble and more in the firefight (the gunslinger) and another that is more static but packing a stronger punch (the sharpie). I just believe that we shouldn't go to either extremes however.

The main issue is that the SS is a (nearly) immobile perk in a very fast-paced game. What worked in the slower-paced KF1 doesn't nearly as well in KF2 (you could often find one of the best spot on the map and just sit there all game). Now, camping is still possible, but waaay harder. As such, the sharpshooter skills promote not only an unrewarding and unfun gameplay, but one that is rarely encouraged by the game itself.

I believe, as a result, that what should be done first would be to give him skills that doesn't affect his already mediocre mobility. Not giving him any mobility skills or passives is already kind of a disadvantage compared to the gunslinger (and other faster perks like the medic or zerk). Secondly, I would say that not crossperking any of their weapons would be a better way to differentiate them (and I'm saying so as someone who LOVES using the Centerfire as a gunslinger... and the .500 never leaves my loadout as a sharp). Bringing them other, unique weapons with similar roles would be the smartest way to prevent players from feeling nostalgic... and from both perks to step on each other too much.

Because yes, as Breadsticks mentioned : the guns themselves are great ! The LAR is still the king of the first tier, dealing very decent damages for its tier. The Railgun (and M99) is a killing machine for big targets. The M14 deals short work of anything, including big zeds if you manage to score a few headshots. It's definitely not the arsenal's problem.

I do have to nuance what Wytchphyre said, as I believe that scoring headshots is still the best way to reliably kill as a Sharpshooter. Less damaging weapons like the LAR and M14 truly needs that to deal with anything but trash zeds... Meanwhile, you'd be wise not to waste a costly shot of Railgun/M99, so aiming for the head is the best thing to do to quickly deal with an impending threat. I don't feel like "spray'n'pray" is a very valid strategy for the perk, unless you use the M14 against a swarm of trash zeds.

He however said it best : the sharpshooter is one of the two "nukers" from the game (along with the demo). The gunslinger is more in a harassing role. Oh sure, he can also dish out loads of damage very quickly, but you need a snappy aim ! Along with the zerk, he's excelling at "hit'n'run" strategies.

My last two points would be :

Sure, he's the "de facto" sniper of the roster. But I would say that it's mostly by default. He's actually more of a marksman really. A class that fires a few carefully landed shots, then move back to reload and bring the pain once more. He's definitely the perk that stands in the back the most... But that doesn't mean that he shouldn't move. He's like a "mobile" sniper rather than a "camping" sniper (enough references to FPS games, I promise)

The Mosin-Nagant, to me, is more or less an in-between gun. He has more raw power than the M14 but less ammo loaded and fires slower. Meanwhile, the Mosin is less damaging than the Railgun, but can load five rounds and fire slightly faster... It's really a nice middle-ground. But as the saying goes : "jack-of-all-trades, master of none". One would go towards the Railgun or the M14 depending on its playstyle, assuming he doesn't want to be a weird hybrid. And to me... That's definitely okay! Similar to how you can go for hitscan weaponry as a firebug or towards more "DPS" affairs. As a sharpie, you can either go for a middle-ranged sniper of some sort, that can adapt and retaliate more easily but dishing out less damage per shot (with weapons such as the Centerfire, M14, Mosin...) or on the flip side : a pure nuker of a class that will struggle in most situation but excel at one job : taking out important targets even before they become a problem.
 
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I dont know who can be so stupid to call survivalist the weakest class. Its the 3rd from top after zerk and med. The weakest one is sharpshooter.
The sharpshooter is pretty much the only one who can nuke both fleshpounds AND scrakes. The **** are you on about?

Its gameplay is not very fun, that's for sure. But he's very far from weak.

Meanwhile, although it is precisely the aim of the perk, being a jack-of-all-trade/master-of-none is exactly why the Survivalist is (among the) weakest perks. Everything he does, another perk can simply do it better.
 
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The only one who can nuke both fleshpounds AND scrakes.
Well, playing as a demo with an RPG-7 can deal with both FPs and scrakes since scrakes have an x4 RPG-7 impact
And yes, Sharpshooter is a perk made to deal with large zeds especially. I would be interested to see it having something better to kill small zeds but it's extremely effective with large zeds.
And if you're good enough, you could play as a marksman that can deal with both with some limitations. (MBR + REU)
 
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Well, playing as a demo with an RPG-7 can deal with both FPs and scrakes since scrakes have an x4 RPG-7 impact
And yes, Sharpshooter is a perk made to deal with large zeds especially. I would be interested to see it having something better to kill small zeds but it's extremely effective with large zeds.
And if you're good enough, you could play as a marksman that can deal with both with some limitations. (MBR + REU)
That's... Very true. I totally forgot about it for some reason. Which is weird considering how ubiquitous the RPG-7 is to any demo loadout. Anyway, my point was that the sharpie was definitely one of the strongest perk per raw damage alone.

I personally think the sharpshooter is also great at dealing with trash zeds, even if you don't choose the "hybrid" path (with the Centerfire or M14 for example). I mean... I personally always take a .500 along with the Railgun/M99, and while it has a low ammo count, it's often more than enough to deal with whatever crawler or stalker your team might have missed.

It's not a crowd control perk, that's for sure. But that's not the goal of the perk either. I wouldn't even say that the sharpshooter is a "nuker", it's more of a "priority target cleaner" ! What I mean by that is that you could definitely pop the cap of a Bloat/Husk/Siren and still help the team immensely. Your goal is not only to get rid of the big zeds. But I guess you already knew that ;-]

All in all, I just wanted to make it clear that the SS is certainly not a bad perk. Just one that should get more enjoyable skills.
 
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That's... Very true. I totally forgot about it for some reason. Which is weird considering how ubiquitous the RPG-7 is to any demo loadout. Anyway, my point was that the sharpie was definitely one of the strongest perk per raw damage alone.

I personally think the sharpshooter is also great at dealing with trash zeds, even if you don't choose the "hybrid" path (with the Centerfire or M14 for example). I mean... I personally always take a .500 along with the Railgun/M99, and while it has a low ammo count, it's often more than enough to deal with whatever crawler or stalker your team might have missed.

It's not a crowd control perk, that's for sure. But that's not the goal of the perk either. I wouldn't even say that the sharpshooter is a "nuker", it's more of a "priority target cleaner" ! What I mean by that is that you could definitely pop the cap of a Bloat/Husk/Siren and still help the team immensely. Your goal is not only to get rid of the big zeds. But I guess you already knew that ;-]

All in all, I just wanted to make it clear that the SS is certainly not a bad perk. Just one that should get more enjoyable skills.
Yes, I agree.. sharpshooter is good. I'm totally accepting the idea of a sharpshooter having heavy arsenal and struggling with trash.
If you have a good team then you're fine. It would struggle on maps like The Catacombs though (solo). But it's a great addition to any team.
It's enjoyable more for me as a marksman than a sniper because I like the movement speed it offers along with the high fire rate.
I wouldn't mind a new HRG weapon for it though
 
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Yes, I agree.. sharpshooter is good. I'm totally accepting the idea of a sharpshooter having heavy arsenal and struggling with trash.
If you have a good team then you're fine. It would struggle on maps like The Catacombs though (solo). But it's a great addition to any team.
It's enjoyable more for me as a marksman than a sniper because I like the movement speed it offers along with the high fire rate.
I wouldn't mind a new HRG weapon for it though
Oh I'm also more of a marksman than a purebred sniper. But I've always been : in Team Fortress 2, I'm definitely a huntsman addict. In Call of Duty, I often choose either the marksman rifles or a semi-auto sniper. And so on, and so on...

But it's just because I suck ass at aiming lol.

As for Catacombs well... It was kinda the same in the first Killing Floor really. Some maps are so damn open that a berserker or support will have to run all the time in the hope of killing something. And some others are so cramped that a sharpshooter will have to fire blindly, while the demo is damn near unplayable.

Again, that's a common trope in gaming. The best maps would obviously be the ones that allow you to play with EVERY perk, but for the sake of versatility... It almost NEVER happen.
 
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3 years later and the SWAT and Survivalist are still the worst classes in the game. SWAT in general is just a weaksauce class that's only compensated by being tanky and maybe able to run out of situations at level 25. While Survivalist isn't the "jack of all trades, master of none" class. It's more the "master of none, but has some body armour and reload speed" class. Which the more I think about it, Survivalist and SWAT are actually kind of similar. Where Survivalist can run too if it's holding a meelee weapon.
 
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3 years later and the SWAT and Survivalist are still the worst classes in the game. SWAT in general is just a weaksauce class that's only compensated by being tanky and maybe able to run out of situations at level 25. While Survivalist isn't the "jack of all trades, master of none" class. It's more the "master of none, but has some body armour and reload speed" class. Which the more I think about it, Survivalist and SWAT are actually kind of similar. Where Survivalist can run too if it's holding a meelee weapon.
Eh... While I would agree that the SWAT isn't exactly a game-winner by itself, it still has a few tricks up its sleeve. Trash cleaning ain't exactly the sexiest role you could have, but it's helpful nonetheless, and SWAT is quite talented at doing that. It mostly stems from the issue that many other perks are just too good at doing EVERYTHING, namely Firebug, Demo and Medic. If perks all kept a more locked role, I believe SWAT's capabilities would shine a tad more.

It's also sort of the game's third tank in a way. No as much as the Zerk with its skills or the Medic and it's boosted healing... But still fairly strong with its added armor. Although it mostly comes into play during the first wave truth be told.

Lastly, he also has some insane CC capabilities, among the best in the game. He can stagger zeds, but also throw flashbangs. Pretty helpful to either buy some time or make quick work of some targets.

As for the Survivalist... Have we played the same class? He went from an underwhelming jack-of-all-trades to a very competent all-rounders, definitely helped by its own selection of weapons. The perk clearly doesn't shine as much as others (as it should), but you can definitely hold your own very well with it.
 
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Eh... While I would agree that the SWAT isn't exactly a game-winner by itself, it still has a few tricks up its sleeve. Trash cleaning ain't exactly the sexiest role you could have, but it's helpful nonetheless, and SWAT is quite talented at doing that. It mostly stems from the issue that many other perks are just too good at doing EVERYTHING, namely Firebug, Demo and Medic. If perks all kept a more locked role, I believe SWAT's capabilities would shine a tad more.

It's also sort of the game's third tank in a way. No as much as the Zerk with its skills or the Medic and it's boosted healing... But still fairly strong with its added armor. Although it mostly comes into play during the first wave truth be told.

Lastly, he also has some insane CC capabilities, among the best in the game. He can stagger zeds, but also throw flashbangs. Pretty helpful to either buy some time or make quick work of some targets.

As for the Survivalist... Have we played the same class? He went from an underwhelming jack-of-all-trades to a very competent all-rounders, definitely helped by its own selection of weapons. The perk clearly doesn't shine as much as others (as it should), but you can definitely hold your own very well with it.

Literally every class not named, maybe Sharphshooter, excels at clearing trash. That's like saying SWAT can throw money at you when you're low and that's an important job... no it's not. You're just trying to make the loser in the classroom look needed.Lastly, he also has some insane CC capabilities, among the best in the game.

Lastly, he also has some insane CC capabilities, among the best in the game. He can stagger zeds,

Again, no he doesn't. The SWAT's Suppression Rounds skill is just a weaker version of the Commando's Impact Round skills, and both are so damn weak, I didn't even notice the skill was on because the stumble power of their weapons are so pathetic, they might as well be trying to stumble zeds by throwing paper airplanes at them.

The flashbangs are pretty much the only thing they contribute to the team outside of being a distraction.

The only difference between any other class using a off perk weapon and the Survivalist doing it is that the Survivalist gains XP for doing it. Outside that, the SWAT might as well use off perks weapons. It will feel more or less the same thing combat wise.
 
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