So...you want to fire a liquid gel from something that fires shells. Lol, at least try to keep it realistic, in terms of ammo.
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A whole new concept for the flaregun
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So...you want to fire a liquid gel from something that fires shells. Lol, at least try to keep it realistic, in terms of ammo.
This is sounding exactly like one of those ideas that someone wants because they think it would be "cool" as opposed to any legitimate gameplay reason.
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Incendiary ammo would be retarded. You probably got the idea from the incendiary grenades and thought you could just add more FB equipment by taking a different perk weapon and simply adding it fire (you probably also thought you could get away by adding explosive ammo to the demo). My point is, say you add incendiary ammo to the scar, then who would use the scar? commando or FB? They would get completely different bonuses on the gun, basically creating two different weapons rather than allowing the player to completely master the scar, as perks were intended in the first place. Also it would mix up the perks since the FB would still count with the scar's sights and firepower to spray and headshot medium/heavy ZEDs, and ability the FB should not have. Other than that, while spraying incendiary ammo would be totally awesome, i'm pretty sure it would unbalance the whole combat.
I'm sure not THAT powerful, specially considering it's not a combat crossbow (I'm not sure if those don't even exist) but merely a RECREATIVE HUNTING CROSSBOW made to kill/wound a deer maybe, not making A ROW OF SKULLS EXPLODE.
I know nobody would use the flare gun if it was worse than 9mm (duh), that's why it shouldn't be. 9mm (in suicidal) is not very effective except for sharp because of the insane headshot bonus. Trying to blast a siren with 9mm for the FB can be very annoying, while for the new flaregun it would only take a body shot and say 4 secs or so (not unbalanced at all considering that EBR with little aiming can do the same in one round, and it has 20 on the mag).
As I said before, I don't think a flare attaching to a body and burning it is that far fetched ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flare_gun#Use_as_weapons ), like it said some flare guns were designed to be able to fire some grenades, perhaps the one in kf would fire a slightly altered round to make it more effective.
The balancing is the real issue. I'm not very familiar to the damage/hp numbers or any of the kf values so I don't know how it should be, maybe it's not possible to make it balanced but I think the developers should at least give it a shot, no pun intended.
I'm sure not THAT powerful, specially considering it's not a combat crossbow (I'm not sure if those don't even exist) but merely a RECREATIVE HUNTING CROSSBOW made to kill/wound a deer maybe, not making A ROW OF SKULLS EXPLODE.
I know nobody would use the flare gun if it was worse than 9mm (duh), that's why it shouldn't be. 9mm (in suicidal) is not very effective except for sharp because of the insane headshot bonus. Trying to blast a siren with 9mm for the FB can be very annoying, while for the new flaregun it would only take a body shot and say 4 secs or so (not unbalanced at all considering that EBR with little aiming can do the same in one round, and it has 20 on the mag).
As I said before, I don't think a flare attaching to a body and burning it is that far fetched ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flare_gun#Use_as_weapons ), like it said some flare guns were designed to be able to fire some grenades, perhaps the one in kf would fire a slightly altered round to make it more effective.
The balancing is the real issue. I'm not very familiar to the damage/hp numbers or any of the kf values so I don't know how it should be, maybe it's not possible to make it balanced but I think the developers should at least give it a shot, no pun intended.
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Wait what?
We (members against the flare-gun idea) never suggested incendiary ammo for the Scar or any other weapons in this thread.
Crossbows can kill a deer, why wouldnt it be able to kill a lot of weaker zeds? And once again, dont underestimate the modern crossbows.
Now you just said that it would take like 4 seconds to bring the siren down... the 9mm can kill the siren in less than 4 seconds.
I dont see any references near the part where it says that it can shoot grenades. And yes you are right, the balancing is the real issue, but TWI wont waste their time to make a weapon that is not even matching the force of the 9mm.
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Nobody suggested incendiary ammo this on this thread, but you did mention it so I wanted to dismiss it before some else even considered it.
Why do you keep insisting with the xbow being realistic? Really you don't see the difference between fatally wounding a deer AND PENETRATING UNLIMITED SKULLS WITH ONE SINGLE BOLT???? Do you even understand the momentum such wide projectile has to acquire to go through both sides of the skull without drastically losing speed or even slightly changing direction? Now take that and multiply it by 25 (the amount of ZED's you can penetrate with a bolt on some maps, although I don't think there's a limit). I doubt a recreative hunting crossbow mechanism can accomplish such feat, it sounds more like a job for a ****ing military rail gun. And even if it did have such power, according to basic physics, immediately after firing a bolt the crossbow should fly straight out of your hands ripping your finger placed on the trigger and possibly breaking your arm. But hey, don't underestimate modern crossbows, right? Really just let this one go.
Now, back to the subject. When I say it would help the FB kill/weaken ZEDs I mean from AFAR (for medium/close range you would use the FT duh). Killing a siren in 4 secs on 2-3 man suicidal from long or medium range with 9mm is not easy at all, not to mention that you would't be able to focus on closer threats. Instead you could just set it on fire and switch to FT and continue spraying.
And you should also take in account that you could stuck 2 of them or more into scrakes/FPs before they charge, so they would suffer extra DoT as they approach you.
Taking that last point into account, it should clearly be more effective for the FB than the Handcannon due to perk buff. Think about it: Although FB would still be crap against big specimens, it would be more helpful to teammates taking them out.
Why do you keep insisting with the xbow being realistic? Really you don't see the difference between fatally wounding a deer AND PENETRATING UNLIMITED SKULLS WITH ONE SINGLE BOLT???? Do you even understand the momentum such wide projectile has to acquire to go through both sides of the skull without drastically losing speed or even slightly changing direction? Now take that and multiply it by 25 (the amount of ZED's you can penetrate with a bolt on some maps, although I don't think there's a limit). I doubt a recreative hunting crossbow mechanism can accomplish such feat, it sounds more like a job for a ****ing military rail gun. And even if it did have such power, according to basic physics, immediately after firing a bolt the crossbow should fly straight out of your hands ripping your finger placed on the trigger and possibly breaking your arm. But hey, don't underestimate modern crossbows, right? Really just let this one go.
Now, back to the subject. When I say it would help the FB kill/weaken ZEDs I mean from AFAR (for medium/close range you would use the FT duh). Killing a siren in 4 secs on 2-3 man suicidal from long or medium range with 9mm is not easy at all, not to mention that you would't be able to focus on closer threats. Instead you could just set it on fire and switch to FT and continue spraying.
And you should also take in account that you could stuck 2 of them or more into scrakes/FPs before they charge, so they would suffer extra DoT as they approach you.
Taking that last point into account, it should clearly be more effective for the FB than the Handcannon due to perk buff. Think about it: Although FB would still be crap against big specimens, it would be more helpful to teammates taking them out.
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I didnt mentioned it, Swanky did.
Man do you know what to do when a Scrake or a FP pop's out? Because according to you, you shoot him with any weapons until he dies. But enraging one of those zeds is the worst idea. And seriously, your teammates will kill that siren with their weapons anyway. The FB is for crowd control, not for lonely zeds.
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wwwaaaaaiiiitttttt...
holy crud guy, this is fantastic
also, why make it a damage dealing weapon anyway? (have a feeling someones gonna reply to that) or not a main one, anyway. make it real light, and have it so that the firebug can "tag" bulkier enemies for the team to focus on, instead of attacking burning ones. the ammo will be limited, so it's not wasted just shooting weaker targets. It'd have to be bright or not-orange-red so it pops out against the burning enemies. The reason for no/low damage would be so that the firebug can tag an FP or Scrake without enraging it.
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And you must've thought of how many people actually care to look up to the sky during a frantic wave full of things trying to kill you, how utterly useless it is indoors, how unprecise such a waypoint marker actually is or how unneeded it is if you have the trader location to meet up at right there in front of your face at any given time.
If the flaregun is nothing but a fancy flashlight, why would anyone ever want to waste weightblocks on it?
You have a flashlight on something that weighs 0 blocks, costs nothing and can actually hurt enemies by default you know.
If you want to make it nothing but an useless gimmick, you might as well not make it at all.
But I guess you already know this because of how imaginative you must be since you talk down on others about it.
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Tag an enemy???!!! Really? I'm now starting to realize my idea was pretty bad to begin with but it's sad the whole thread has turned into this.
WHY? why would you need to tag a FP? It has already a bright yellow light on his body! And scrake, it already makes noise with the chainsaw, now to mention a cloud of smoke around him visible even in the dark. Really you need to attach a flare so you can spot them and realize the danger? Doesn't the fact they are 3 meters tall and wielding a chainsaw/****ing blender hands give you a hint?
A flare-gun weapon would be stupid and kinda useless, a flare gun to tag enemies is just plain retarded.
And I second 9_6 about the also useless signal/illumination feature, although is not nearly as stupid as the tagging one.
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Right, because you're never by yourself with no specimens around, correct? Since KF's AI is so advanced there are no situations where some players have all the aggro and a couple of them are left alone...
Have you ever, you know, played Killing Floor? There are lulls in the action you know.
Refer to my idea.
Shoot one to get attention, shoot as second to pinpoint location. If you have at least a double-digit IQ it's not difficult to at least estimate where someone is by a flare. How the hell do you think people do it in real life?
There is always the very slight (read: extremely likely) chance that you're surrounded by specimens, can't make it to the trader because of this, and are in need of assistance. It's those kinds of emergencies flare guns are, ya know, designed for.
Right, because there are absolutely no ways to mitigate those problems at all, amirite? Clearly you've thought of all alternatives.
Refer to my idea for the flaregun:
- Regenerates ammo like the welder/syringe
- Default inventory (like knife, pistol, welder, syringe)
- Weighs nothing.
- Primary fire shoots 1 flare and uses 50 "ammo", allowing two flares to be shot before "recharging". For brief area illumination/signaling where you are.
- Secondary fire drops a road flare to provide area illumination and to mark out locations. Uses 100 "ammo".
But yeah, it's easier to abort a prenatal idea than to try and think of ways to improve it.
Granted there are some really thick ideas that show up in this forum that need the coathanger treatment from the get-go (Gunslinger perk, most weapon suggestions) but this one actually has potential if executed properly.
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And by "executed properly" you mean "made your way".
Because you know how to do it properly and everyone else is stupid and probably also smells funny anyway.
There always are specimens around.
Have YOU ever played the game?
They can literally spawn right behind you.
If there are no specimens around, that either means it's trader time (in which case you don't need a marker to mark a point) or that there will be specimens around at any second.
If you're not deeply constricted into your camping spot, you usually move towards the trader anyway if there's fewer enemies around.
You know, there has never been a clone-zombie apocalypse in real life.
If there is one, I'll let you know how it works. In real life.
I don't want anything that doesn't hurt enemies on a weapon-key and the welder-syringe combo on 5 is more than enough to juggle around already, thank you very much.
Because you know how to do it properly and everyone else is stupid and probably also smells funny anyway.
How adorable.
There always are specimens around.
Have YOU ever played the game?
They can literally spawn right behind you.
If there are no specimens around, that either means it's trader time (in which case you don't need a marker to mark a point) or that there will be specimens around at any second.
If you're not deeply constricted into your camping spot, you usually move towards the trader anyway if there's fewer enemies around.
I don't know how people do it in real life.
You know, there has never been a clone-zombie apocalypse in real life.
If there is one, I'll let you know how it works. In real life.
I don't want anything that doesn't hurt enemies on a weapon-key and the welder-syringe combo on 5 is more than enough to juggle around already, thank you very much.
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Ok you have something there that would be at least interesting to see, but the way things are in killing floor I'm not sure how useful it would be. Closed maps would not allow the signals and in open ones you can always chat or talk on mic (everyone playing KF should have a mic) to give your location. There are some maps more prone to get lost into, specially if you haven't played them as much, but I'm not sure if people would even notice the flares if the map is big, or know how to get there if it's maze like. About the illumination part, there aren't that many dark maps, but maybe if it was implemented developers would create more of them. Still I think adding more flashlights would be better.
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Actually if there's no SS or demo with pipes, throwing nades before he rages and then shooting it with the most powerful weapons is the way to go. How else would you kill him without enraging him?
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Yes, and they're not powerful enough to shoot through 6 heads and make them explode with a single bolt.
Even if they were, it certainly wouldn't be constructed in the way that the KF crossbow is.
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What does that even mean? We were arguing about the Xbow on KF being unrealistic how does the fact that KF is fictional altogether relates to the conversation?
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If you want a balanced flare gun, that doesn't mimic something in-game already... it's simple. Go with thermite or white phosphorus. Thermite would probably be the better of the 2, but if anyone deems it too OP, go with the white phosphorus.
Anyway, works like this. Fires a flare just like a real flare gun, similar arc, quick single shot load, but instead of normal flares, these flares have a pressure sensitive magnesium fuse attached to a lump of thermite. Similar to the rotational switch in a grenade launcher shot, only there is no up close "rotational" protection. Upon hitting something, thermite ignites, and the target is splashed with mega hot thermite.
Of course, they'll also be ignited just like if they were hit with a grenade or flamethrower, but that's not the main source of damage. The target covered with thermite will receive a much higher much faster primary damage over time from the thermite quickly incinerating them at the wound site. This also gives the opportunity for slight headshot bonuses (thermite on the head would do more damage).
This would effectively give the firebug a higher range weapon that lacks a bit in accuracy but does spike DoT to a single target (not counting if the inflamed target sets others nearby on fire from touching them). They wouldn't be able to solo a FP very easily, but it'd be possible via multiple hits from afar or backpedaling/retreating.
Like the other post, it'd be a tier 2 weapon, but in the hands of other classes wouldn't be as effective as other tier 2 due to inaccuracy, reload, and the potential problem of heavily burning yourself if you shoot something point blank (thermite splash). But in a Firebug's hands, they'd get an accuracy bonus, price drop, and their fire damage bonus/resistance. However, firebug fire resistance shouldn't 100% negate any point blank damage they receive from it. Thermite is hot.
Yes?
Anyway, works like this. Fires a flare just like a real flare gun, similar arc, quick single shot load, but instead of normal flares, these flares have a pressure sensitive magnesium fuse attached to a lump of thermite. Similar to the rotational switch in a grenade launcher shot, only there is no up close "rotational" protection. Upon hitting something, thermite ignites, and the target is splashed with mega hot thermite.
Of course, they'll also be ignited just like if they were hit with a grenade or flamethrower, but that's not the main source of damage. The target covered with thermite will receive a much higher much faster primary damage over time from the thermite quickly incinerating them at the wound site. This also gives the opportunity for slight headshot bonuses (thermite on the head would do more damage).
This would effectively give the firebug a higher range weapon that lacks a bit in accuracy but does spike DoT to a single target (not counting if the inflamed target sets others nearby on fire from touching them). They wouldn't be able to solo a FP very easily, but it'd be possible via multiple hits from afar or backpedaling/retreating.
Like the other post, it'd be a tier 2 weapon, but in the hands of other classes wouldn't be as effective as other tier 2 due to inaccuracy, reload, and the potential problem of heavily burning yourself if you shoot something point blank (thermite splash). But in a Firebug's hands, they'd get an accuracy bonus, price drop, and their fire damage bonus/resistance. However, firebug fire resistance shouldn't 100% negate any point blank damage they receive from it. Thermite is hot.
Yes?
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