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The Machine Gunner Class

Boz

Grizzled Veteran
Apr 1, 2006
72
1
Florida
I believe the machine gunner class is flawed in RO. It does not have the simulated effect on the battle field that its real life counterpart had. Understandably there is no suppression in a game unlike real life and that is one of the main effects of these types of weapons and this will be lost in any "game" environment. With no consequenses and a respawn, why not try to stand up and take out the MG? Something that would never happen with that many rounds pouring down on your position in real life.

So, IMO (just ideas folks take them or leave them)

1. On the class of MG'er the tracers need to go away. As cool as they are, the only purpose for them is to advertise exactly where your firing position is. This is fine for the tanks or fixed emplacements, but not for the MG Class. You see people use the '34 on single fire all the time now. I do too, and I seem to live a lot longer than using the 42.
2. The accuaracy of the deployed MG needs to be greatly improved so that this is a deadly weapon when used in this fasion. It is pretty deadly now, but it has the feeling of the most random gun in the game. I can't tell you how often I have fired and fired at a position with no effect only to be killed by the single bolt action soldier I was aiming at. In 9 out of 10 encounters, this is not going to happen in RL. If the initial aim was off, the MG'er just walks the bullets onto the target and the target is going to be VERY busy trying to get behind some cover, not taking aim and firing a shot.
3. Suppression. This is the most important part. Somehow this has to be replicated in game. Now since no one fears losing their life we have to find a way in game to simulate it. I think that there should be some kind of distortion like the Arty strikes if you are being fired on from an MG. So that if you are within a designated range of the landing bullets you will be effected and your screen and aim will be effected just like it is when you are near where arty is landing. We all know what it is like to try and fire your weapon during the arty strike.....impossible to get off good shots. This would keep the target from just popping up and taking aim at the source of the tracers and taking out the MG'er. Now, I know that to some extent this is already there as all nearby shots give an indication both with sound effect and a video effect, but I would want that magnified if you are being shot at with concentraited bursts from MG'ers. This in effect would simulate "Suppression"

I think that all hear can agree that the MG Class needs tweaking. The way it is now, I barely even want to play this class because it does not function like it should. Now I know that you can be successful using these guns in the game they way they are now, but I would like to see them be more realistic than they are. In RL the best options to take out an MG emplacment or an MG'er was to go around them, or flank them or as a last resort try to overpower it with mulitple charging men. (or if Air or Arty support is available call that in) I would like to see some things in game that make standing up under fire and shooting at the MG's NOT be the best option or even a possible option, which would encourage the going around and flanking etc.
 
When I remember correctly - and I really think I do - bullets already have this distortion effect.
Maybe it could be a bit more excessive, but not as strong as the arty ones.
I would agree to point number 2. A bit more accuracy would be nice. Especcially the MG42 can be devastating - when it hits, what can be really hard by shooting over greater distances(where the rifle guys can still place more precisive shots).
For the traces - I like them. Never had a problem with that.
Actually, I think being a MG gunner is more about finding a good place then shooting. Yesterday, I was able to lay more than five minutes at one and the same spot on K
 
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The suppression effects we have now are nice, but not sufficient. I almost weep for enemy MGers and how vulnerable they are to simple riflemen every time I just line up the poor guy in my sights and pop him off, while his tracers fly around me with no effect.

Yes, yes, there are some uber l33t h4x0rz RO players who have mad skills with machine-guns, but those are few and far between. Why would anyone new want to get better with the machine-gun, when using it is basically a death trap for grenade spam or a single rifleman who doesn't suck?
 
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From the poll I posted, it looks like half of us would use tracers all the time & half would rather not. I think we should be given the choice!!

It would work both ways really. Over range tracer only help german tankers due to their zoomed scope. So it would prevent machine gunners from dominating over ranges the human eye cant really see!

Most of the time though, like Odessa for example, MGers dont find any use for tracer rounds.
 
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You can suppress enough even now, but you have to watch every pixel on the screen to survive. I think we'll only have enough suppression when 3D aiming is introduced(Line up sights+aim) replacing the current 2D(only aim,weapon sights are already aligned). It's always harder to line them up for an accurate shot under fire with blur or not.

I'm fine with tracers, although IMO they're too big and move very slowly. I don't care about the explanation "Game FPS makes them look like that". They just don't feel right. In mod times, we had smaller and faster moving tracers and they actually worked without giving away your position much.
 
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I don'te really believe it has anything to do with aiming, 2D or 3D. I can aim and hit successfully with every other gun in the game. I never feel cheated like I do at times with the MG. An emplaced MG is a formidable obsticle in RL and it should be replicated in game. I just don't see that in RO current form....looking for more I guess.
 
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[...] I don't care about the explanation "Game FPS makes them look like that". They just don't feel right. In mod times, we had smaller and faster moving tracers and they actually worked without giving away your position much.
This explanation is not the whole truth anyway. Tracers move with half the speed of normal bullet rounds - the NoTracer mutator adds an option to let them (only infantry) move at 90% of normal bullet speed.
 
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I don'te really believe it has anything to do with aiming, 2D or 3D. I can aim and hit successfully with every other gun in the game. I never feel cheated like I do at times with the MG. An emplaced MG is a formidable obsticle in RL and it should be replicated in game. I just don't see that in RO current form....looking for more I guess.


You obviousely never played against Rak :p

People move out of objectives because of him ;)
 
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Im not so against tracers... But it would be nice to dim them down a bit, and have less tracers coming out.. It seems that every bullet is a tracer, and the tracer during the day is so god damn bright!

And besides if you wanted to be cheap about it, do what I do... use the MG-34 single shot... Im a main MG guy, and if you havent known about this... Its your fault..

The MG-34 has it all.... single and full auto, very very accurate, able to shoot no tracers at all, fast barrel change, you can hip it and it has more ammo overall.... Its a WIN, WIN situation... (you can also snipe accurately with it)

When your on a map and you need power in CQC, use the MG-42, that thing just rips through everything! :D
 
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I have faced many an MG'er, only rarely do I ever fear them or find one of them controlling a section of a map. This would not be an issue, I guess, if we all were as good as you with it Hyperion.

There will always someone hop in and tell you how "uber" they are with a MG, in near every situation.

But that all doesnt change the fact, that in some cases you just have no chance against a rifle-men, that is used, in leaning, compensating the supresion and aiming very acuratly at the flash from your firing gun, of course all after standing up, in less then 3 sec.

Without any penetration at all, the Mg will always loose some of its usefulness. I can rember, when I said to someoine, how nice it would be to have some realistic penetration for it, and he asked me If I would be insane, cause they would truly dominate the battlefield then. And hell yea ... thats what they should do, when you are that stupid to use a fence, pile of wood or even a car as cover ... sorry ...

ROO is a "pixel-war", with the bolt rifles, you can hit near everything on the greatest distance. But the Mgs have a "slight" disadvantage in that. I doubt someone you have under fire, even on long distance, will give a acurate shot in your head.
 
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MG34, MG42: every fourth bullet is a tracer
DP28: every third bullet is a tracer

Malking them half or quarter of the size and faster makes them close to invisble, I tried it myself.

If you want Penetration you have to ask TWI, they have the data (some native stuff) to implement it an adequate way, but they did not share it with Beppo or geogob as they implemented penetration with their INFPenetration mutator - that is one of the reasons why the INFPenetration mutator does not work perfectly. My personal guess is that the ballistic modell is not as "uber" as they did and then they did not want to share it with others, not even parts of it.
 
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