The katana and AK feedback and questions thread.

[Krieg Jaeger]

Currently, I feel both are amazing additions. Very useful in their own right. The AK is not overpowered by any means in the hands of anyone less than a level 5 commando (in which case, it's power is equivalent to other level 5's with their weapons of choice, roughly speaking).

The katana is an amazing addition. Incredibly fast, very powerful, and with those two mixed together, along with it's weight, It's a virtual must have, if you can fit it in.

Ok, so now with the problems.

The weapons in themselves are perfect, but the effect they have on the rest of the arsenal is somewhat telling. At least, in the case of the katana.

I actually found that both AK and bullpup have their uses, AK being great for heavier beasties, and bullpup good as ever for popping off heads of weaker zeds. The problem, as I said, is the katana, imo.
The machete, questionable before in it's usefulness, is now virtually pointless. Imo, price in itself is not enough of a distinguishing factor, as even the cheapest gun, has it's own unique and useful properties (LaR).

The machete is now, for all intensive purposes, completely and absolutely useless in the face of the katana. Why spend money on a machete, when you could be saving for a katana?

The second problem, is the chainsaw and katana. The katana doesn't slow you down when it's out, hits about as hard, and pretty damn quick to boot. With their price being the same (for anyone but a zerker) and having a faster run speed, the chainsaw is once again eclipsed by the katana.

Is the katana too good? Not necessarily. I simply think that the machete and chainsaw need to be looked at in order to increase their usefulness.

 

[Riut]

Actually the chainsaw still has some real nice advantages over the Katana which make it a worthwhile buy. The main one being that the Chainsaw primary can hit constantly without any considerable delay, when it comes to most enemies, this will actually act to subdue their attacks, protecting you from any damage you may have recieved while trying to take them down. Another reason is that the chainsaw primary attack eliminates any need for timing so you're safe to just waste any small time enemy coming your way.

What I'm saying is, the chainsaw to me feels like a defensive weapon, designed for saving your *** when you're cornered by holding back the incoming enemies with damage and stopping enemies from dealing any damage to you. The katana to me feels a lot like an offensive weapon, the kind you'd use for hit and run tactics, but not really for holding a small area by yourself.

 

[Ben Carmine]

The two main problems with the katana are these:
1) A single primary strike stuns a scrake, even on hard. Just like the saw secondary, but FAR faster. Saw a guy solo 4 in a row with the japsword.
2) It's FAR too light for its power, even with a non-zerker. You can have one with an AK and handcannon on any perk, which is crazy considering how much you dish with it.

At least one of these needs to be fixed. As it stands, all other melee weapons are obsolete.

It's well executed besides those problem.
AK's perfect, though. Love the recoil.

 

[shaqism]

Scrakes are a joke anyways there not to be feared still :\

 

[Nanostrike]

Wow. The Katana's nearly non-existant weight makes it pretty much a must-have (Though an expensive one). The Machete is a joke now and the Chainsaw's ONLY redeeming factor is that it can perma-stun with the primary fire. With the horrid noise it makes, though, I tend to go with the Katana almost every time... I figure this will be balanced out in the next patch, though, as it's really ridiculous...

Agent Wilkes with a Katana looks like a freaking Cyber-Ninja, though...awesome to see in action!

I figured that the AK would eclipse the Bullpup, and it has, somewhat. In cases where damage is most important (Read: Almost all), it's the weapon to go to, hands down. In cases where accuracy and quick targeting is more important (Swarms of Crawlers and Stalkers), the Bullpup still has it, though, as the recoil on the AK is pretty rough.

What I don't like about the AK is how it changes the Commando's focus from Sweeper to Damage-Disher, seriously hedging in on Sharpshooter territory. Seriously, the AK firing single-shots or short bursts makes even a Sharpshooters Handcannons/Lever Action Rifle look weak. Now we have most Commandos ignoring crawlers/stalkers, their nemesis', and going after bigger stuff...something best left to other classes. Gak!

And, I'm hoping it's new-weapon syndrome but at the moment, I'm not seeing the Bullpup anymore. Period. NO ONE is using it when they can get the AK to fit...

BTW: Berserker with both Katana and AK is very, very close to unstoppable, BTW!

 

[Krieg Jaeger]

I hate to say "nerf"...as I rather things to be buffed to a standard, than anything lowered...but honestly, the katana is pretty bamf right now.

Buff or replace machete, maybe chainsaw (As spoken of above, it's constant sawing is great defensively) and katana needs to be looked at. I'd rather not nerfed, but it's either raise everything to a comparable standard, or lower the katana.

 

[Nanostrike]

Well...what we have is a secondary 'Final Tier Weapon' for the Berserker. That's all well and good, HOWEVER... with it's almost non-existent weight, it's WAY too compatible with other classes... Sharpshooters, Medics, Supports, Firebugs (Firebug with a Flamethrower and Katana is a VERY interesting class, though!), basically anyone with a spare 3 blocks and $1,000 can grab onto an 'Ultimate Melee Weapon'.

For us 'zerkers, it adds the option to forgo the Chainsaw's "Barrier Effect" for more effective kit setups that have more mobility and versitility, such as:
-Katana + Shotgun
-Katana + Crossbow
-Katana + AK
-Katana + AK + Dual Handcannons

And lemmie tell ya, that last one is pretty deadly... Honestly, I think the Chainsaw is pretty upstaged now, though... The damage is pretty much the same. Factor in the Chainsaw's speed reduction and noise...and the Katana is almost the obvious choice...

 

[widowmaker]

Wow. The Katana's nearly non-existant weight makes it pretty much a must-have (Though an expensive one). The Machete is a joke now and the Chainsaw's ONLY redeeming factor is that it can perma-stun with the primary fire. With the horrid noise it makes, though, I tend to go with the Katana almost every time... I figure this will be balanced out in the next patch, though, as it's really ridiculous...

Agent Wilkes with a Katana looks like a freaking Cyber-Ninja, though...awesome to see in action!

I figured that the AK would eclipse the Bullpup, and it has, somewhat. In cases where damage is most important (Read: Almost all), it's the weapon to go to, hands down. In cases where accuracy and quick targeting is more important (Swarms of Crawlers and Stalkers), the Bullpup still has it, though, as the recoil on the AK is pretty rough.

What I don't like about the AK is how it changes the Commando's focus from Sweeper to Damage-Disher, seriously hedging in on Sharpshooter territory. Seriously, the AK firing single-shots or short bursts makes even a Sharpshooters Handcannons/Lever Action Rifle look weak. Now we have most Commandos ignoring crawlers/stalkers, their nemesis', and going after bigger stuff...something best left to other classes. Gak!

And, I'm hoping it's new-weapon syndrome but at the moment, I'm not seeing the Bullpup anymore. Period. NO ONE is using it when they can get the AK to fit...

BTW: Berserker with both Katana and AK is very, very close to unstoppable, BTW!

I gotta agree with you. I like playing berserker and I still think it's overpowered. One major advantage the katana has over the chainsaw is its range. The trader shows it as zero range like the chainsaw, but in reality it reaches out much farther. The speed benefit is obvious too. I just solo'd a fleshpound today with nothing but the katana and primary fire and didn't get hit once. I didn't use the beheading trick either. Just mad slashing.

Currently my favorite setup is: level 5 berserker, katana, AK, and dual desert eagles. In the end I still switch to support for the Patriarch.

I also love the new flashlight and Samurai Agent Wilkes ftw.

 

[Monolithos]

Katana - great backup weapon (for all perks) due to it's low weight. But for a primary melee weapon (for berserkers) IMO chainsaw > katana (but the katana is a strong rival).

As a berserker you can have both though I guess. Katana when you are out on the run and drive-by-killing stuff (instead of the knife). Chainsaw when you hold your ground. (but that leave you at 12/15kg which is not enough for a ranged weapon such as bullpup, AK47, LAR or handcannon(s) to deal with crawlers and sirens).

I don't feel that Katana complement the Chainsaw. Katana is a replacement. You either use chainsaw or you use Katana - not both.

If you use it as a primary weapon (as berserker that is) you are only at 4/15kg. This actually let you pack a xbow (that let you one-shot sirens even behind enemies, one-shot several crawlers in a shot even if they are behind enemies and will be a great combo against the patriarch too - xbow for range and katana if he decide to come up close and personal).

I think the two strong berserker combos are Chainsaw+a ranged weapon (handcannon(s), LAR, bullpup or AK47)) or Katana + xbow


AK47 - Nice gun

Compared to dual handcannons it deal less damage per bullet, have twice as many bullets per clip, reload faster, have about the same high recoil, have about the same rate of fire, weight 50% more. Overall I think you deal about the same damage per second with the two weapons (without perks).

Compared to bullpup it deal more damage per bullet, have only 75% the amount of bullets total and per clip, reload about the same (or?), have a much higher recoil, have about the same rate of fire, weight the same. Overall it deal more damage per second (which make it a good pray and spray gun on bigger targets such as the scrake and the patriarch) but with less accuracy after the first bullet (which make it less suited for small burtst decapitations).

I feel the AK47 complement the bullpup rather than replacing it.

I think AK47 will be a great candidate for the rapid fire using the alt-fire semi-fire-mode to soft up targets that are on longer rage (scrake, siren, flshpound, patriarch) and full-auto-mode for bigger targets and when they get closer (scrake, siren, fleshpound, patriarch) or if you really have to make a path through a swarm of zombies.

I think bullpup (with its lower recoil and bigger clip) still will be the better gun for taking down the swarm (crawler, stalker, bloats and clots). But I also think that with the combined clips of the AK47 you can now spray and pray more even with the bullpup...

Two strong commando combos i see are Bullpup + AK47 and Bullpup + Katana.

As for other perks mostly only berserkers used bullpup as backup. AK47 does pack more damage per bullet so it might be more useful at taking down crawlers (but you still need more than one bullet so if you want a one-shot kill handcannon(s) might still be the better option) and if you rapid fire the gun in semi-auto-mode you can also take down sirens at a distance with it pretty easy.

I do not think the commando using AK47 will rival the damage output of support spec using hunter shotgun+xbow or sharpshooter using xbow+handcannons on the patriarch...

 

[Templarion]

I never understood why they added katana. It is damn hard to balance five different melee weapons in a game like this.

 

[grex413]

Scrakes are a joke anyways there not to be feared still :\

lol gonna have to disagree with you on that, ever since the new update and the scrakes have smoke coming from their chainsaw try being in a match were its on hard and ur in the middle of no where and you see theses things coming at you and all u see is smoke behind them lol

 

[Sammers]

With everyone pimping it up with their AKs and paying attention to the increased damage, has anyone noticed that the Bullpup actually has a higher range? (At least that's what the trader menu tells us)

As for the Katana, it's rather OP. On a Hard game with 4 players, we all went beserker for the Patriarch and swarmed him with katanas and got a straight rush in about 4 seconds, though I guess our beserker levels were nearly all 4 or 5. Balancing it would be rather simple, either make it cost the same as a LAW, or bump the weight up to 5 blocks(same as the axe). The single most annoying thing about the axe is it's weight. Nearly all the weapons in the game have an even number of blocks. This means, you can create many decent combinations and have a completely full inventory. In the case of the Machete and Katana, they might as well be 4 blocks large, because usually they are bought to fill a 4 block space(I know they do in my case at least). Now, the Axe weighs 5 blocks and is the only weapon larger than 4 blocks of weight to have an odd number. That said, it's IMPOSSIBLE to completely fill your inventory if you have an axe. Same with Machete and Katana, but y'know, they're small enough to contain within a small weapon space and don't make that much of an impact. If the Katana was bumped up to 5 blocks of space, it would have the same goddamn annoying problem as the axe, though I feel that this makes to be just the kind of sacrifice you should make for a weapon of such power. The only way I found to completely fill your Inventory with the axe is to be a less-than-level-4 Support and simply not level it up any further.

That said; the update was amazing.

 

[Krieg Jaeger]

I still would have preferred a halberd =/. Same weight as the chainsaw, good reach, damage, slower speed. Make it a choice of multiple enemies and offensive, or single enemies and defensive.

 

[HunnyPot]

I've been reading these forums for a few months, and I've finally decided to register and post something...=)

Lastnight, I had so much fun running around with the katana as a lev 5 zerker. All I used was the katana, and I only bought armor up until it was time for the Pat wave at which time I switched to a lev 5 sharpie. I felt so free!!! Running around being able to kill anything with the katana while just holding down primary fire. HAHA! It was so fun and so exilharating!!! But of course I was only playing on Normal...

 

[Jmb301530]

I actually think the AK should do a TINY bit more damage...

I actually think the AK should do a TINY bit more damage...

I think the AK should do a tiny bit more damage...because its just annoying to shoot a crawler 1 time on normal and have it have like 5% HP left (with level 5 commando btw). I'd like it to do x2 dmg of the bullpup, just to make it more convienent, and to make it alot more playable for suicidal...and Katana...well I have to say, seeing ALOT more zerkers now...

 

[thrash242]

for all intensive purposes

It's "intents and purposes". You notice how "intensive purposes" makes no sense? That's because it's a nonsense malapropism started by people that didn't hear the phrase correctly, which is then copied by people who don't know any better.

Again, the correct phrase is "intents and purposes".

I normally try not to correct people on forums, since it's largely pointless, but I can't stand when people mis-hear a common phrase and turn it into something nonsensical which becomes more common than the correct phrase.

Anyway, I agree that the machete is largely pointless.

Also, in before "I don't care about grammer or correct phrases u know wut I mean!" If you're going to reply to that effect, don't bother. I've heard it before.

 

[Wolfdust]

Yeah, they're both pretty awesome. They're about perfect.

What I don't like about the AK is how it changes the Commando's focus from Sweeper to Damage-Disher, seriously hedging in on Sharpshooter territory. Seriously, the AK firing single-shots or short bursts makes even a Sharpshooters Handcannons/Lever Action Rifle look weak. Now we have most Commandos ignoring crawlers/stalkers, their nemesis', and going after bigger stuff...something best left to other classes. Gak!

Actually, both classes have flexible roles. The Commando can be the sweeper, but so can the Sharpie. The 9mm is a vastly underestimated weapon, especially in the hands of a Sharpie. Doing more damage per shot than a bullpup, combined with both the BASE boost to damage, Sharp gives it AND the increased headshot damage, a Sharp with even a single 9mm can rip apart hordes of Clots, crawlers, stalkers, Gorefasts, etc.

A Sharp who runs around with dual 9mms, dual handcannons and a lever action could be viewed a s crowd-control specced Sharp, while the more common Crossbow and Deagles damage-dealer could be viewed as the heavy-hitting Spec.

 

[Lance]

I played with the ak47 and it was very realistic and the recoil is pretty good =) plus i love you can get both the bullpup and also this (often takes awhile to have enough for both in early waves) but it still gives you a decent edge when your being attacked by many zombies and there was no time to reload. =)

The katana well, my opinion is it is ok as it is, i am not sure why people say its overpower and stuff, a katana is more sharper than a everyday sword you know =X (again my opinion) I do not think they added it without giving these 2 weapons any research into it. I practiced kendo and less abit about whats the big different between any sword other countries made to the katana and a katana was really smartly made cause the figured that the everyday forging method made the blade less shart and can be broken while the katana was now made with a method intended to keep its sharpness and durability of not being broken so easily and finally to be able to cut through someones flesh with great ease so your katana wouldnt get stuck into your opponents body when more enemies are charging at you still. Its pretty good weapon if you are a zerker =/ i tried the katana in other perk groups and they were pretty weak, one hit on a clot, 2-3 on a gorefast (all aimed for a head decap so it should be give abit more damage) Always find myself going back to zerker cause any other job it was good for it except if u just wanted to buy it to handle scrakes, i dunno why some ppl say they dont get hurt fighting a fp with it, im still a lv 2 zerker and it took a big chunk of me after each encounter with the fp (when i attacked it) but i agree that i too notice that once in awhile the fp would miss and not hit me, but isnt a zerker speed meant for that sorta thing? unless you meant be walking and standing in front of it and hacking at it like that then i prolly would know =X

(a basic intro in how a katana is made and why it was made and intended)


The authentic Japanese sword is made from a specialized Japanese steel called "Tamahagane"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katana#cite_note-.E9.89.84.E3.81.AE.E6.9C.AC-3 which consist of combinations of hard, high carbon steel and tough, low carbon steelhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katana#cite_note-4. There are advantages and setbacks to both types of steel. Having a lot of carbon within the steel allows the blade to hold a sharp edge but can be too brittle and may break in combat. Having a small amount of carbon will allow the steel to be more malleable, making it able to absorb impacts without breaking but becoming blunt in the process. The makers of a katana would use the best attributes of both kinds of steel by placing the high carbon steel in the front of the blade for a sharp edge while placing the low carbon steel in the back where it can absorb most of the impact.
The katana gets its gentle curve from quenching during forging, as it is straight prior to quenching. A process of differential tempering causes martensite to form predominantly in the edge of the blade rather than the back; as the spine has lower retained lattice strain, it cools and contracts, and the blade takes on a gently curved shape.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katana#cite_note-5
A coating of clay mixed with ashes and a small portion of rust is applied to every surface but the edge of the blade during hardening. This provides heat insulation so that only the blade's edge will be hardened with quenching. This process also creates the distinct swerving line down the center of the blade called the hamon which can only be seen after it is polished, a katana forger's signature.
The hardening of steel involves altering the molecular structure (steel does not actually have a "molecular structure", but rather a microstructure or crystalline structure, as defined in metallurgical terminology) of that material through quenching it from a heat above 800

 

[shaqism]

lol gonna have to disagree with you on that, ever since the new update and the scrakes have smoke coming from their chainsaw try being in a match were its on hard and ur in the middle of no where and you see theses things coming at you and all u see is smoke behind them lol

I was playing on foundry yesterday and the scrakes still have that stun bug when there hit by a power swing by a katana. Hence why they shouldn't kill anyone :\

 

[Nanostrike]

I was playing on foundry yesterday and the scrakes still have that stun bug when there hit by a power swing by a katana. Hence why they shouldn't kill anyone :\

First off, there are a LOT more of them now. Later waves (Particularly on hard!) seem to spawn groups of 4-5 of them AT ONCE. Non-Zerkers will have trouble stunning every single one of them at the same time, let alone finish them all while KEEPING them stunned. Factor in other specimens getting involved that require IMMEDIATE attention (Crawlers, Sirens) and stunning them may not be an option, period.

Second, unless you're a berserker OR have $1,000 to spare on a Katana, you don't even have the ability to pull off the stun without lugging that Fire Axe around...

So Skrakes are still pretty formidable opponents, perhaps not so much alone, but as part of a group, they're lethal. A few hits, even if they're just "Oh crap, I got unlucky" is the end of them...