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Apology needed I'm afraid...

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How on earth can that be possible, I get 15 fps on medium with my rig that was built a year ago...

That's because it has nothing to do with the rig and everything to do with optimizing graphics properly.

Unreal 3 was bad enough.....this takes it to a whole another reason.

It's sad cause you get COD2 like graphics that choppy on latest/greatest rig with over 30fps.
 
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In regards to the performance issues - it seems for me that the performance got worst and worst with each beta patch. The initial beta build ran great! It's a shame as well because the latest beta build ran pretty poorly and it seems like that is the build used in this final release.

SPECS:
i5 2500k
GTX 570 SC
8GB DDR3

As you can see, my pc isn't the best in the world but relatively decent and quite new. EVERY other game I have runs max fine (incl. Crysis 2 with high res tex. and dx11 patch). It's disappointing, but I have faith in TWI to fix some of this. They are good developers, but the game was just a little rushed I think - possibly due to the pushiness of a lot of the community.
 
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As a supported of mods including day of defeat on hl and later RO, I have a major problem, but it is not necessarily the game I am most disappointed in. I have been looking at many many threads where people have performance issues, and the members of the 'dev team' or the people employed to do forum PR seem to come out with nothing except one of the following:


'you need a better computer...'

'it's hard work try making a game yourself...'

This ignores the fact that many people with performance issues have either top end systems, or can play graphically superior games at a consistently good fps etc etc.

I truly do believe that if TWI admitted to a rushed, flawed game, the community would have sympathy to some extent, am certainly more respect from the gamers struggling at present.

I believe the childish 'bashing' is unnecessary but something must be done.

Nothing needs to be done.... you don't deserve an apology, in fact nobody does.

You need a better computer is indeed true.

Anybody remember when UT2004 came out? I bought it the moment it came out.... my computer was top notch at the time, yet I couldn't max out my video settings and I had to wait a year or two later before I could upgrade and max my settings out, simply because it was too much for my system.

Most games that come out do this. They are released at a time where the average computer can run it on medium settings and rarely on max settings. It gives the game a bit of longevity as it gets older compared to newer released games. In a year or two, most computers are better and more powerful and while newer games are released with better graphics, you can now increase your video quality to be about par to the newer games so they don't seem as dated.

If the game was possible for everyone to max out the graphics on the very first day with their average computers and average video graphics, in about a year all those people would be complaining that the graphics are dated.

^ And if that was the case that maxing out your graphics was possible for everybody on day one of the release, then there wouldn't be any need for video settings in the first place would there?

As it goes for other games being "Graphically Superior"....... that's subjective to the individual. Someone in another thread said that Medal of Honor: Airborne looked better than RO2 and supplied an example image....... sorry but to me I wasn't impressed and didn't look as good.

Thus, Subjective.

And as it has been said countless times already, for those people trying to compare RO2 to other games that run the U3 engine and work just fine on their systems, remember that RO2 is using a modified version of the U3 Engine (dubbed the U3.5) and thus, is more intensive and requires more resources than your average U3 engine game.

^ For those who can, think back to when Half-Life 1 came out. It ran on the Quake I Engine but was heavily modified. While my system at the time could handle Quake I and run very smoothly, HL1 sucked the crap out of my system and I had to lower my settings a lot just to make it run smooth until a few years later when I got a new video card and more RAM.

Tripwire doesn't have to apologize for something every other game developer has done in the past and will keep doing in the future..... and they don't have to admit a single thing if those things never were true.

You're assuming what was done behind the scenes, nothing more.

Added:

By the way, how many patches did Valve release for Half-Life & its mods over the last 10 years it was popular?

Do any of you remember how buggy and glitchy that game was when it was first released?

I imagine some in here remember, but I'd suspect most in here don't as they were probably still playing with alphabet blocks with a pacifier in their mouths during that time.

And also keep in mind that when Valve released Half-Life 1.... they were a small indie company too.

To the OP:

I am in the IT field. I was a member of an IT Help Desk for approx 7 years, and when my friends found out I worked on computers they started hounding me with their issues as well. This is what I've learned from my experiences.........most people shouldn't be allowed to own a computer. A couple of easy questions to weed out the idiots.

1. Do you have anti-virus software installed, is it updated at least weekly, and does it do a weekly scan of your entire system?

2. Do you do routine maintenance, like cleaning up uneeded files and registry entries, using a program like CCleaner?

3. How many tool bars are installed in your web browser? IE Yahoo toolbar, Google toolbar, Bing etc? The list goes on and on, but the answer should be "None!"

4. Do you actually read before you click "OK" to installing something that just happens to popup when you're in the middle of doing something else?

5. Do you run Windows updates on your computer when they are available? Is your computer even configured to automatically download updates?

I could go on, but the people who are in tune with my line of thought know where I'm going. I'd be willing to bet that at least 50% of what people are calling bugs, are not bugs at all but configuration issues with their own computers. Chances are the people that report they have very little issues with the game are the ones that answered all the above questions correctly.

See I do all of that and more.... I have AVG Anti Virus, Registry Mechanic and Ad-Aware running on my system..... and everything tells me that my system is as healthy as a horse, clean, defragged, updated and smooth.

Most in here have mocked my GeForce 210 4GB video card I'm using, yet I can still run the game with no crashing while still having most of my settings set to Ultra.... the price I have to pay is having to drop my resolution down a bit.... but it runs smooth, very few glitches and I enjoy it without any crashing.

Most of the problems I have been having during the beta were related to issues on my end of things, not the game itself.... and most of the issues relating to the game were fixed in patches, so I have little to complain about.
 
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Nothing needs to be done.... you don't deserve an apology, in fact nobody does.

You need a better computer is indeed true.

Anybody remember when UT2004 came out? I bought it the moment it came out.... my computer was top notch at the time, yet I couldn't max out my video settings and I had to wait a year or two later before I could upgrade and max my settings out, simply because it was too much for my system.

Most games that come out do this. They are released at a time where the average computer can run it on medium settings and rarely on max settings. It gives the game a bit of longevity as it gets older compared to newer released games. In a year or two, most computers are better and more powerful and while newer games are released with better graphics, you can now increase your video quality to be about par to the newer games so they don't seem as dated.

If the game was possible for everyone to max out the graphics on the very first day with their average computers and average video graphics, in about a year all those people would be complaining that the graphics are dated.

^ And if that was the case that maxing out your graphics was possible for everybody on day one of the release, then there wouldn't be any need for video settings in the first place would there?

As it goes for other games being "Graphically Superior"....... that's subjective to the individual. Someone in another thread said that Medal of Honor: Airborne looked better than RO2 and supplied an example image....... sorry but to me I wasn't impressed and didn't look as good.

Thus, Subjective.

And as it has been said countless times already, for those people trying to compare RO2 to other games that run the U3 engine and work just fine on their systems, remember that RO2 is using a modified version of the U3 Engine (dubbed the U3.5) and thus, is more intensive and requires more resources than your average U3 engine game.

^ For those who can, think back to when Half-Life 1 came out. It ran on the Quake I Engine but was heavily modified. While my system at the time could handle Quake I and run very smoothly, HL1 sucked the crap out of my system and I had to lower my settings a lot just to make it run smooth until a few years later when I got a new video card and more RAM.

Tripwire doesn't have to apologize for something every other game developer has done in the past and will keep doing in the future..... and they don't have to admit a single thing if those things never were true.

You're assuming what was done behind the scenes, nothing more.

Added:

By the way, how many patches did Valve release for Half-Life & its mods over the last 10 years it was popular?

Do any of you remember how buggy and glitchy that game was when it was first released?

I imagine some in here remember, but I'd suspect most in here don't as they were probably still playing with alphabet blocks with a pacifier in their mouths during that time.

And also keep in mind that when Valve released Half-Life 1.... they were a small indie company too.



See I do all of that and more.... I have AVG Anti Virus, Registry Mechanic and Ad-Aware running on my system..... and everything tells me that my system is as healthy as a horse, clean, defragged, updated and smooth.

Most in here have mocked my GeForce 210 4GB video card I'm using, yet I can still run the game with no crashing while still having most of my settings set to Ultra.... the price I have to pay is having to drop my resolution down a bit.... but it runs smooth, very few glitches and I enjoy it without any crashing.

Most of the problems I have been having during the beta were related to issues on my end of things, not the game itself.... and most of the issues relating to the game were fixed in patches, so I have little to complain about.


A couple things to note here...It's not completely in TWI's hands, in a lot of cases it takes a patch from the VGA vendor (nvidia, ati) to fix graphical glitches or performance problems.

However, I disagree with your assessment regarding performance issues being the consumers problem and not the developers. A video game is essentially just an application that uses libraries in order to draw on a users screen. Games, just as application can often be riddled with performance bugs due to overlooked memory leaks or just plain inefficient coding.

There are a good amount of programs that people dislike because they run slowly or consume more resources than they should be, prime example for a recent game is ARMA 2...the game runs a hell of a lot better than it did when it released...lot's of code was optimized in patches.

Coding games is not all about implementing cool shiny graphics, it's about optimizing the **** out of it to find a happy medium between great graphics and great performance. There is a ton of things developers do that is essentially smoke and mirrors to make your game run super fast yet still look really awesome.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, most people expect polished games when they come out...consumers are entitled to this, don't compare TWI to other game companies...that's not how you do business. However, I would document any problems you have in a bug and let the developers do their job, complaining is only going to stress these devs out even more.

Cheers
 
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You didn't play Arma 1 or 2 at launch I'm guessing :)

Seen plenty of posts with pc specs similar to mine having issues (i7 870, 8gb ram, had 2 x 4890 but have just upgraded to 6970, win7 x64), I run everything maxed out at 1920x1080 on 27" monitor, except for shadows at high, bloom off, and PP at high. I have never seen my FPS below 50.

To be honest it wouldn't surprise me if a good percentage of problems are caused by insufficient PSU lol.

I do weekly maintenance on my PC (CC cleaner, virus scan, adware/spyware scan, defrag etc) I install all windows updates every week, all drivers are latest official ones. I use Firefox with Add Block Plus and have no tool bars.

Major Johnson is pretty close to the mark, a lot of it is unoptimized pcs.

Apology not needed.



Edit: "I imagine some in here remember, but I'd suspect most in here don't as they were probably still playing with alphabet blocks with a pacifier in their mouths during that time." ROFL so true CPT-PRAXIUS
 
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How about some perspective?

I bought Bad Company 2 for PC. That game cannot run for more than about 15 minutes before it hard locks my rather impressive computer. There is a 265 page thread discussing the problem on the EA forums that as been completely ignored. [url]http://forum.ea.com/eaforum/posts/list/3960/380660.page[/URL]

Grr.. that makes me so mad. I paid twice as much for BC2 as RO2, and I STILL can't get to play SP at all, and MP for half an hour or less.

Even if TWI did THAT, they at least have an excuse, because they are so small and have so few resources to spend on it.
 
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Apologize for this beautifully executed depiction of the brutallity of the ostfront?
You must be mad!

By the way I have some issues still with framerates and I do everything that was stated above. I always hate it when I get on someone's computer and it runs like s*** because the person has no idea what there doing with it.

But I don't sit around and whine and expect to be breastfed, I do my best to help. These guys are Indies playing on the big field, daring to impose themselves on the big scene. They have my upmost respect and have always treated me with respect.
 
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Not a single person on the moderation team nor the dev team have ever said anything along the lines of what you're describing in your post. What you seem to be talking about are regular forum members and that is it. Their opinions are their own and say nothing on TWI's behalf, much like the moderators here are not spokespersons for TWI either.
 
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Chances are the people that report they have very little issues with the game are the ones that answered all the above questions correctly.

Exactly. When I first installed the beta, it would crash on startup and not run at all. By the time I got all the windows updates I had been ignoring, and updated my drivers, it would run but crash every now and then. Then I tweaked a few settings to get around known bugs and the game just about never crashed.

It looks and runs a lot better on my computer than I was expecting, actually, after my BFBC2 experience on the exact same system.
 
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If it was the game at fault then it wouldn't work for ANYONE! It's your PC at fault.

Well yes, and no. Yes, it's likely an issue to do with the hardware configuration on people's machines. But that does not mean TWI doesn't have to fix it.

There are so many possible combinations of hardware, software and usage (wear and tear and so on) that being able to get the game to run on every computer without testing EVERY computer, is a pipe dream. It's just not going to happen.

What devs do is try to make it work for the most people at release, then identify and fix the unique issues as they arise. Your particular system might have a quirk that totally kills RO2's performance, but that doesn't mean TWI doesn't have to fix it (or at least refund the money if they are decent people - and they seem to be.)

It is just that it is totally unfair and unreasonable to expect let alone demand that TWI do what no other company, regardless of size, does. They simply can not test every piece of hardware, and every piece of software, and every possible combination of the two.

Not even EA has the resources to do that.
 
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To the OP:

I am in the IT field. I was a member of an IT Help Desk for approx 7 years, and when my friends found out I worked on computers they started hounding me with their issues as well. This is what I've learned from my experiences.........most people shouldn't be allowed to own a computer. A couple of easy questions to weed out the idiots.

1. Do you have anti-virus software installed, is it updated at least weekly, and does it do a weekly scan of your entire system?

2. Do you do routine maintenance, like cleaning up uneeded files and registry entries, using a program like CCleaner?

3. How many tool bars are installed in your web browser? IE Yahoo toolbar, Google toolbar, Bing etc? The list goes on and on, but the answer should be "None!"

4. Do you actually read before you click "OK" to installing something that just happens to popup when you're in the middle of doing something else?

5. Do you run Windows updates on your computer when they are available? Is your computer even configured to automatically download updates?

I could go on, but the people who are in tune with my line of thought know where I'm going. I'd be willing to bet that at least 50% of what people are calling bugs, are not bugs at all but configuration issues with their own computers. Chances are the people that report they have very little issues with the game are the ones that answered all the above questions correctly.

No. Just No.

The people that are posting the bleeding edge system specs are obviously not support desk idiot cases.

There is a problem with the game, and this post is insulting to the intelligence of those with the problems.
 
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Nothing needs to be done.... you don't deserve an apology, in fact nobody does.

You need a better computer is indeed true.

Anybody remember when UT2004 came out? I bought it the moment it came out.... my computer was top notch at the time, yet I couldn't max out my video settings and I had to wait a year or two later before I could upgrade and max my settings out, simply because it was too much for my system.

Most games that come out do this. They are released at a time where the average computer can run it on medium settings and rarely on max settings. It gives the game a bit of longevity as it gets older compared to newer released games. In a year or two, most computers are better and more powerful and while newer games are released with better graphics, you can now increase your video quality to be about par to the newer games so they don't seem as dated.

If the game was possible for everyone to max out the graphics on the very first day with their average computers and average video graphics, in about a year all those people would be complaining that the graphics are dated.

^ And if that was the case that maxing out your graphics was possible for everybody on day one of the release, then there wouldn't be any need for video settings in the first place would there?

As it goes for other games being "Graphically Superior"....... that's subjective to the individual. Someone in another thread said that Medal of Honor: Airborne looked better than RO2 and supplied an example image....... sorry but to me I wasn't impressed and didn't look as good.

Thus, Subjective.

And as it has been said countless times already, for those people trying to compare RO2 to other games that run the U3 engine and work just fine on their systems, remember that RO2 is using a modified version of the U3 Engine (dubbed the U3.5) and thus, is more intensive and requires more resources than your average U3 engine game.

^ For those who can, think back to when Half-Life 1 came out. It ran on the Quake I Engine but was heavily modified. While my system at the time could handle Quake I and run very smoothly, HL1 sucked the crap out of my system and I had to lower my settings a lot just to make it run smooth until a few years later when I got a new video card and more RAM.

Tripwire doesn't have to apologize for something every other game developer has done in the past and will keep doing in the future..... and they don't have to admit a single thing if those things never were true.

You're assuming what was done behind the scenes, nothing more.

Added:

By the way, how many patches did Valve release for Half-Life & its mods over the last 10 years it was popular?

Do any of you remember how buggy and glitchy that game was when it was first released?

I imagine some in here remember, but I'd suspect most in here don't as they were probably still playing with alphabet blocks with a pacifier in their mouths during that time.

And also keep in mind that when Valve released Half-Life 1.... they were a small indie company too.



See I do all of that and more.... I have AVG Anti Virus, Registry Mechanic and Ad-Aware running on my system..... and everything tells me that my system is as healthy as a horse, clean, defragged, updated and smooth.

Most in here have mocked my GeForce 210 4GB video card I'm using, yet I can still run the game with no crashing while still having most of my settings set to Ultra.... the price I have to pay is having to drop my resolution down a bit.... but it runs smooth, very few glitches and I enjoy it without any crashing.

Most of the problems I have been having during the beta were related to issues on my end of things, not the game itself.... and most of the issues relating to the game were fixed in patches, so I have little to complain about.

So what you are saying is that TWI designed a game that is unplayable now, and will be until our PC's have 20 Core Processors and Quad GPU Cards?

Not to be an ***, but get real. They wouldn't design a game that couldn't be played with "Ultra Settings" And if they did, then they should say so now.
 
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When you buy something, you expect it to work. Period. No arguments about software and small budget, or about every sloppy release out there (you never hear about good releases, because that's what everyone expect, it's only noted when it doesn't).

From tractors to ballpoint pens, it's perfectly reasonable to expect them to work as presented on the manual,box,etc.
If a thing doesn't work, you return it to the store.

YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO A WORKING PRODUCT.

I didn't bought a promise to a working game in the coming months, i bought a software and expected it to work. If i was told about the mess the game was on the store page, i wouldn't have bought it. That's where the apology comes in.

Tripwire should recognize the current state of the software, and give real expectations of what you're getting when you buy their game. I'm talking about the average joe. Not the power-user, forum dweller, fanboy or smartass who thinks he knows everything about computers.

Be honest and transparent, don't make empty promises. The damage is done, and it's time to rethink. Take a firm position and stick to it. Just don't underestimate my intelligence as a customer and player.
 
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So what you are saying is that TWI designed a game that is unplayable now, and will be until our PC's have 20 Core Processors and Quad GPU Cards?

Not to be an ***, but get real.

Not to be an ***, but that's not what I was saying & you need to learn how to read what is exactly being said.

Most games that are made and released are designed in such a way that most people's PC's at that time can not run the game on maximum settings and usually have to resort back to medium or lower quality settings, unless they like crashing to the desktop all the time. This isn't the first game I've played that crashed my system when I tried to make it run things my system couldn't run and it's not something unique to RO2.

The game is perfectly playable and runs just fine for me and many others who lower their settings to something their system can handle.... and just because you can't be bothered to suck it up and accept that your system is not up to par with running this game maxed out, doesn't mean TWI should have to bend over backwards with spoon feeding you and making the game run decently for your limited PC.

My Specs:
Intel Core i5-2300 CPU @ 2.80GHz
8GB of RAM
Windows 7 64-Bit Operating System
Nvidia GeForce 210 - 4GB of RAM


Works just fine for me. It crashes when I try to crank things up, so I don't.... what's your excuse?

They wouldn't design a game that couldn't be played with "Ultra Settings" And if they did, then they should say so now.

All my settings are set to Ultra, I just had to drop my resolution down a bit...... I can play it just fine.... again, what's your excuse?
 
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