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Recoil..

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#22
In my opinion, when it is easier to full auto than to burst, there is something wrong.
And this is the case for me in RO1. Hold the trigger, pull down and keep it there with hardship. When I burst it keeps flying upwards no matter how you pull down (much harder to time).

This discussion makes me longing for the bolt-only servers:rolleyes:
 
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#23
Schreq said:
Well that is you saying that and that is only your opinion.

RO always has been the best mix of realism and unrealistic decisions for good gameplay. It isn't trying to be a simulator like arma does for example. And that is a good thing!
Click to expand...

The weapons are a core part Red Orchestra. The developers have explained they wanted them to be as close to realistic as possible so artificial balancing mechanisms that are not historically based do not work with this philosophy. His opinion is closer to the RO philosophy than yours.

And your invitation to "play against good clan smg'ers" is part of what's wrong with gaming today. There doesn't and shouldn't be anything in a game designed to cater to an elite core of gamers that use their supposed skill in a game to feel good and to pretend their opinions on game design matter more than other people's. This is the kind of mentality that plagues games like Call of Duty and Starcraft and it's tiring.
 
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#24
RO tend to be a "realistic" game, but not a true simulation like Arma.

In RO1, ppsh were good for cqc and rifles good for long range (even if skill and/or luck could help you to clean buildings with a rifle for instance). Now, with less recoil, smg's may become to powerful ... even if it's a realistic game, each gun must have convenients and inconvenients. Like in Ostfront.

But we don't have play the game, so we'll see that in the beta :p
 
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#26
Kipper said:
The weapons are a core part Red Orchestra. The developers have explained they wanted them to be as close to realistic as possible so artificial balancing mechanisms that are not historically based do not work with this philosophy. His opinion is closer to the RO philosophy than yours.

And your invitation to "play against good clan smg'ers" is part of what's wrong with gaming today. There doesn't and shouldn't be anything in a game designed to cater to an elite core of gamers that use their supposed skill in a game to feel good and to pretend their opinions on game design matter more than other people's. This is the kind of mentality that plagues games like Call of Duty and Starcraft and it's tiring.
Click to expand...

Wrong, for example they are still making exceptions for balancing purposes, like giving the papash only clips first, instead of the drum mags. Not very realistic. I was talking about exceptions in general, not only in regards of weapon handling.

The thing you don't understand is that a game should cater to all it's customers. No clanplayer is trying to force the game into a direction which only suits one party.
It's even the other way around imo. The people who argue in this thread are for changes which would cater to the people who play the game because of fanaticism in regards of realism, while I'd say the core of players play it because the best mix of realism with yet fast and good gameplay. Also keep in mind that hardly any clan players are posting here... except zetsumei :p

"This is the kind of mentality that plagues games like Call of Duty and Starcraft and it's tiring."
lol. Some people enjoy competition in their local football club, some people enjoy winning a tennis match against a friend, some people enjoy clanmatches in games, and some people just don't like anythng of those. I don't see a problem there. What exactly makes you so bitter?
 
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#28
Schreq said:
Wrong, for example they are still making exceptions for balancing purposes, like giving the papash only clips first, instead of the drum mags. Not very realistic. I was talking about exceptions in general, not only in regards of weapon handling.

The thing you don't understand is that a game should cater to all it's customers. No clanplayer is trying to force the game into a direction which only suits one party.
It's even the other way around imo. The people who argue in this thread are for changes which would cater to the people who play the game because of fanaticism in regards of realism, while I'd say the core of players play it because the best mix of realism with yet fast and good gameplay. Also keep in mind that hardly any clan players are posting here... except zetsumei :p

"This is the kind of mentality that plagues games like Call of Duty and Starcraft and it's tiring."
lol. Some people enjoy competition in their local football club, some people enjoy winning a tennis match against a friend, some people enjoy clanmatches in games, and some people just don't like anythng of those. I don't see a problem there. What exactly makes you so bitter?
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they do that just to maintain the realistic recoil of ppsh.........they said that with a drum mag it would have been a too powerful smg........;)
 
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#29
Kipper said:
The weapons are a core part Red Orchestra. The developers have explained they wanted them to be as close to realistic as possible so artificial balancing mechanisms that are not historically based do not work with this philosophy. His opinion is closer to the RO philosophy than yours.
Click to expand...

This is nonsense, artificial balancing is necessary to make the game fun to play. The developers have stated many times that it's a game and not a simulation so there will be compromises on the realism in order to have good gameplay.

Kipper said:
And your invitation to "play against good clan smg'ers" is part of what's wrong with gaming today. There doesn't and shouldn't be anything in a game designed to cater to an elite core of gamers that use their supposed skill in a game to feel good and to pretend their opinions on game design matter more than other people's. This is the kind of mentality that plagues games like Call of Duty and Starcraft and it's tiring.
Click to expand...

Could you please elaborate on why this is what's wrong with gaming today? It appears as though the point of the invitation to play vs good clan SMG players was simply to prove that there is a degree of depth to SMG gameplay and it's not just a spray-and-pray weapon as is often thought.

I also don't see why you think that a game shouldn't have anything to cater towards "elite gamers" as I think a game should ideally cater to all skill levels. I'm not entirely sure what the point of that section of your post is, but an experienced clan players opinion on game design probably does matter more for certain aspects of the game than that of the average casual gamer because they're generally more dedicated and experienced with the underlying gameplay mechanics. Finally, while you're unleashing your hatred upon clans in RO2 then please remember to thank them for kindly hosting the servers, providing developer feedback and attempting to sustain and grow the community. :D
 
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#33
It's actually really simple.

They want each gun to fire exactly as their real life counterparts do. That's why they dropped the excessive recoil.
Since they felt that the papasha was too powerful, they gave the 71 drum as an unlockable. The important thing is the following.
The guns still handle as the exact counterparts, and that's what the goal of the game was ( and I think still is).
When you have the recoil raised in RO1, it might be balanced, but then it would essentially be another weapon (Mosin 71 drum mag?).
Also the box magazine is still realistic since it existed, so not really a nerf of the weapon imho.

So yeah like the bayo it is not realistic to have it an unlock, but the weapon will handle realistic as intended.
So it wil still own the short to medium ranges, like it did!
 
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#35
Actin said:
It's actually really simple.

They want each gun to fire exactly as their real life counterparts do. That's why they dropped the excessive recoil.
Since they felt that the papasha was too powerful, they gave the 71 drum as an unlockable. The important thing is the following.
The guns still handle as the exact counterparts, and that's what the goal of the game was ( and I think still is).
When you have the recoil raised in RO1, it might be balanced, but then it would essentially be another weapon (Mosin 71 drum mag?).
Also the box magazine is still realistic since it existed, so not really a nerf of the weapon imho.

So yeah like the bayo it is not realistic to have it an unlock, but the weapon will handle realistic as intended.
So it wil still own the short to medium ranges, like it did!
Click to expand...

+1

Exactly.
 
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#38
im just gonna say it here and now

if the recoil on the smg's is diff. than whats in the videos
or if its changes back to the "Look at the Sky after 3 shots"

there will be a backlash and alot of new players will never look at red orchestra again

everyone wants to be a sniper but when it turns out they suck its
"omg the smgs are over powered"
seen this happen since medal of honor:allied assault
funny thing is .. most my mates use the rifle and they have no problem knocking a smg user on his butt

its the wanna be snipers that cant shoot
thats the problem
 
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#39
Well there is a rather big difference between the 7.62x25 the 7.62x54. From what I understand is that all the weapons have more realistic recoil, so SMGs are much more controlable, but anything that fires rifle rounds will also have realistic recoil.

I remember a reviewer that got to playtest the game giving the impression that the AVT was a very difficult gun to fire full-auto..as it should be.

I'd be fine with the AVT having accurate recoil, just because a gun is cool, doesnt make it practical.
 
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#40
HellBilly said:
im just gonna say it here and now

if the recoil on the smg's is diff. than whats in the videos
or if its changes back to the "Look at the Sky after 3 shots"

there will be a backlash and alot of new players will never look at red orchestra again

everyone wants to be a sniper but when it turns out they suck its
"omg the smgs are over powered"
seen this happen since medal of honor:allied assault
funny thing is .. most my mates use the rifle and they have no problem knocking a smg user on his butt

its the wanna be snipers that cant shoot
thats the problem
Click to expand...

What? That barely makes any sense, and what does sniping have to do with the SMG recoil? :rolleyes:
 
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