My worst nightmare

[Lorkenpeist]

It finally happened. Last night I had a KF2-related nightmare. I dreamed that Yoshiro posted the patch notes for the first content update, and the only change to Berserker was renaming one of the useless perk skills. He was like "Berserker's not broken, you're just playing it wrong!" Yes, not changing the Berserker was literally the scariest thing my brain could come up with... TWI please don't make my life a living nightmare

 

[MORDRED]

...TWI please don't make my life a living nightmare

You shouldn't have said that. Now they'll make your life a living nightmare

 

[Yoshiro]

To be fair, you may be playing it wrong (I don't know, I haven't seen you play). But even so, that doesn't mean the perk doesn't need some work. We are still looking at how we want to address the various perk issues (I do not know if many, or any, will make it into the content update) and the work that will go into that.

 

[Vintage]

To be fair, you may be playing it wrong (I don't know, I haven't seen you play). But even so, that doesn't mean the perk doesn't need some work. We are still looking at how we want to address the various perk issues (I do not know if many, or any, will make it into the content update) and the work that will go into that.

Taking from my other thread:

Beserker is balanced to be a solo perk (which everyone absolutely despised in Killing Floor 1) since if a Medic is alive and Beserker goes near the team the majority of their skills do nothing. It's not very satisfying to have your perk's bonuses fading in and out as a medic is topping you off. There are many ways to fix this, pick 1: Skills keep their bonuses for X seconds after falling below HP threshholds. Skills provide a base bonus at full health that increases as you lose HP. Either suggestion allows Beserker to use their skills while playing with their team.

 

[KaZe_DaRKWIND]

To be fair, you may be playing it wrong (I don't know, I haven't seen you play). But even so, that doesn't mean the perk doesn't need some work. We are still looking at how we want to address the various perk issues (I do not know if many, or any, will make it into the content update) and the work that will go into that.

When almost everybody thinks it needs buffs, generally there is a problem.

 

[Lexxure]

Taking from my other thread:

Beserker is balanced to be a solo perk (which everyone absolutely despised in Killing Floor 1) since if a Medic is alive and Beserker goes near the team the majority of their skills do nothing. It's not very satisfying to have your perk's bonuses fading in and out as a medic is topping you off. There are many ways to fix this, pick 1: Skills keep their bonuses for X seconds after falling below HP threshholds. Skills provide a base bonus at full health that increases as you lose HP. Either suggestion allows Beserker to use their skills while playing with their team.

I agree that yeah, those effects need to be changed (or thrown out entirely for different abilities, hopefully for something better and more defensively oriented IMO), but Berserker right now is anything but a solo class.

Over many, many Hell on Earth solo attempts, I've only managed to reach Hans once, maybe twice as a Berserker, where-as I've managed to very easily reach Hans as a medic (and beat him, all without buying weapons). The HP effect on Zed time doesn't give any mileage on a berserker to keep him going in a long fight in solo play, and that syringe timer is so abysmally slow right now.

Regrettably though, my nightmare is happening right now: I can beat Hans HoE with a knife, but not as the Berserker D:. I tried just now with the pulverizer as berserker to no avail. I think the fight is more geared towards survivability rather than damage, and right now, all of that survivability is front-loaded to the other perks. In solo, the HP drain is just way too much to deal with as anything other than a medic, unless you can somehow save your armor throughout the fight (practically impossible as berserker for me).

 

[Escadin]

Taking from my other thread:

Beserker is balanced to be a solo perk (which everyone absolutely despised in Killing Floor 1) since if a Medic is alive and Beserker goes near the team the majority of their skills do nothing. It's not very satisfying to have your perk's bonuses fading in and out as a medic is topping you off. There are many ways to fix this, pick 1: Skills keep their bonuses for X seconds after falling below HP threshholds. Skills provide a base bonus at full health that increases as you lose HP. Either suggestion allows Beserker to use their skills while playing with their team.

I disagree that it is a solo perk. The x happens on % lost HP is an awkward choice imo but my guess is they wanted to enable Zerker to break free when things go down hill, which they do more quickly in melee. A "Press [V] for Patriach AoE attack" skill would have done the job for me though.

Apart from that Berserker offers a handful of very powerful and unique(for now) combo tools to combine with other perks and he is in a position to parry-tank stuff more naturally than anyone else.

Still the awkward skills and his comparably low defense could use some work.

 

[Lorkenpeist]

To be fair, you may be playing it wrong (I don't know, I haven't seen you play). But even so, that doesn't mean the perk doesn't need some work. We are still looking at how we want to address the various perk issues (I do not know if many, or any, will make it into the content update) and the work that will go into that.

I want to emphasize that I absolutely love KF2 already, and am very pleased by how well it has turned out as an EA release. While I do believe Berserker needs some work, I don't mean to complain because you all have done an amazing job and I am very happy that you all take the time to listen to our feedback and work on making an already awesome game even better. Mostly, I was just amused at what my brain decided would make a good nightmare, and wanted to share

 

[Deathgrip22]

We are still looking at how we want to address the various perk issues (I do not know if many, or any, will make it into the content update) and the work that will go into that.

It's times like these, I wish each of the TWI dev's had their own blogs where they could post their own thoughts, representing only themselves and their own ideas. So that they could give pieces of info on areas of development to which they are involved, so the community could try to speculate the progress of the developmental process without TWI actually having to post anything official and then having that used against them if they don't deliver correctly, on time, etc.

 

[Rocker Fox]

It's times like these, I wish each of the TWI dev's had their own blogs where they could post their own thoughts, representing only themselves and their own ideas. So that they could give pieces of info on areas of development to which they are involved, so the community could try to speculate the progress of the developmental process without TWI actually having to post anything official and then having that used against them if they don't deliver correctly, on time, etc.

Yea but there is a also a large downside to that. If someone makes a slip (like what often happens in wargaming, Valve, a few other game devs) on something that wasn't sposed to be talked about or a miscommunication in when something is being released it can either cause a lot of confusion, make a lot of people angry, and make the company as a whole look bad. If you instead have one source of info (such as the bi-weekly updates) you avoid many of the leaks and slips that happen. It also gives the devs more time to do what they do instead of also having to keep up with a full time blog on top of everything else.

Back to original topic, i would rather it take a little time in order to get it right over rushing it to to say that you got it out and i feel like a lot of gamers share that view. Like yes, it is possible to have a new set of numbers every week but if none of those stick or are just arbitrary instead of based off testing and feedback then all it ends up being is a waste of time if you have to change it back or pick a new set of stats the week after.

Like we know it's going to happen and it's going to happen soon but if it needs to take more time then it needs to take more time. Better to have a working fix that took an extra month then 4 fixes out buy next week that requires 2 more fixes each.

 

[Deathgrip22]

Back to original topic, i would rather it take a little time in order to get it right over rushing it to to say that you got it out and i feel like a lot of gamers share that view. Like yes, it is possible to have a new set of numbers every week but if none of those stick or are just arbitrary instead of based off testing and feedback then all it ends up being is a waste of time if you have to change it back or pick a new set of stats the week after.

I don't know about that, wouldn't it actually be kind of nice if they made small, incremental changes in one way or another, instead of large, sweeping changes?

They could take a useless Skill, and give it a 10% improvement, and then see how that's received, and take a OP skill, and knock it down 10%, and see of that's received, with a goal of having a 50/50 split in terms of the Skill usage by the community.

If I recall there was a Counter-Strike: Source economy system that put the prices of weapons up and down depending on their usage, and that sounds like a good idea (I'm sure somebody who hated it will call me a moron), incremental changes based on usage

I know I'm being way too simplistic with my example, but i think you get the gist of it

 

[Quintuplin]

That kind of balancing is designed around competitive play, though.
You know, games like CS, DOTA, etc.
Seeing as this is a PvE game, there's no need for everything to be perfectly balanced. There ought to be weapons that are more or less effective, because then players less good at the game can still be effective on a team, and people who get bored with just winning can move into the less powerful guns and have fun making them work. Like the seeker six in kf1

 

[Shining Wolf]

Taking from my other thread:

Beserker is balanced to be a solo perk (which everyone absolutely despised in Killing Floor 1) since if a Medic is alive and Beserker goes near the team the majority of their skills do nothing. It's not very satisfying to have your perk's bonuses fading in and out as a medic is topping you off. There are many ways to fix this, pick 1: Skills keep their bonuses for X seconds after falling below HP threshholds. Skills provide a base bonus at full health that increases as you lose HP. Either suggestion allows Beserker to use their skills while playing with their team.

I don't agree that he's balanced as a solo perk since all of his weapons are capable of stuns. Nailgun already can knock around a wave of trash. Eviscerator's issue is that not only can it not parry, he can't take pulverizer with it. He's just not that good as a tank.