Moveable small artillery guns on half tracks.

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MEGADETHTHRETH

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 24, 2009
166
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0
My brother posted this on the darkest hour forums and I thought I'd post it here too.

"i was thinking that if the small artillery guns(the ones with wheels)could be hooked onto the half tracks and the opel and whatever trucks are present, on tank maps and infantry maps and moved around it would be very cool,just an idea, they could be hidden in the bushes.
+
:D
 
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REZ

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 21, 2005
3,534
482
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44
The Elitist Prick Casino
I would definately like to see field guns in game.

If I may elaborate on your suggestion with some ideas of my own I would suggest a one minute or so pre-game time period where the Squad Leader is in control of a set number of map 'assets'. During this pre-game time period he could arrange these assets however he likes within a predetermined area around his spawn zone. A visual of the asset placement could be broadcast to the other players in real-time to allow for input from the team, but in the end, the Squad Leader is the only one with the power to place the assets.

In placing the assets, the Squad Leader is attempting to give his team the best possible advantage by effecting the other teams' movement possibilities once the game starts.

Assets could include -
the ubiquitous pile of sandbags (several shapes and configurations choosable)
static machine gun nest usable by anyone
mortars usable by anyone
static trucks or other vehicles
small buildings or encampments
ditches or trenches
hedgehogs or barbed wire (various obstacles)

This would also have the positive side-effect of giving the same set of maps some constant variety so they dont become stale after playing them 1000 times.
 

Mr Milkman

FNG / Fresh Meat
Aug 10, 2009
401
68
0
I remember one custom map on RO that had [FONT=Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Sans-serif,sans-serif][SIZE=-1]SdKfz 251 with AT mounted, I'm not sure of the history, if they were used at Stalingrad, prob not so much as it was mostly close quarters street fighting I think, but I hope AT guns are implemented more, and less buggy, at least for mappers making non Stalingrad based maps. Man ROHOS is gonna rock...
[/SIZE][/FONT]
 

SturmSS

FNG / Fresh Meat
Aug 31, 2007
93
2
0
I'm quite sure that pre-Stalingrad and even during that the predominant method of transporting Artillery/Pak etc was actually horse and cart.

I dont like the idea of a squad leader being given this enormous amount of power - cos I can just imagine some d-bag squad leader who just because he joined first but has no experience or maturity behind his belt places things in an RTS style fashion in incredibly crappy locations for your own team. Other than that flaw it would be pretty good - but I'm against the elitism of one person having that role, its just too risky. Perhaps if there was some sort of ranking/experience system that'd be another story.
 

MEGADETHTHRETH

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 24, 2009
166
77
0
I would definately like to see field guns in game.

If I may elaborate on your suggestion with some ideas of my own I would suggest a one minute or so pre-game time period where the Squad Leader is in control of a set number of map 'assets'. During this pre-game time period he could arrange these assets however he likes within a predetermined area around his spawn zone. A visual of the asset placement could be broadcast to the other players in real-time to allow for input from the team, but in the end, the Squad Leader is the only one with the power to place the assets.

In placing the assets, the Squad Leader is attempting to give his team the best possible advantage by effecting the other teams' movement possibilities once the game starts.

Assets could include -
the ubiquitous pile of sandbags (several shapes and configurations choosable)
static machine gun nest usable by anyone
mortars usable by anyone
static trucks or other vehicles
small buildings or encampments
ditches or trenches
hedgehogs or barbed wire (various obstacles)

This would also have the positive side-effect of giving the same set of maps some constant variety so they dont become stale after playing them 1000 times.


That is a great idea, i never thought of that, kind of like a strategy game for that minute, placing sandbags, artillery, and mgs. Cool
 

Lucan946

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jun 12, 2009
636
84
0
I really don't have any problem with this. The artillery could do quite well on larger maps (ala Krivoi Rog)
 

REZ

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 21, 2005
3,534
482
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The Elitist Prick Casino
Yeah Sturm I see what you're saying, there's always gonna be someone who acts the fool.. but for those who would use it to full effect it could be a really nice layer of depth in the gameplay. Otherwise static maps would rarely be played the same way due to the pre-placement of assets.

What type of assets, how many assets and which areas within the map that are authorized to have assets placed on them would be totally in the mapmakers control. In designing the map, one should take into account all possible douchebaggery, of course, as well as the number and appropriate types of assests for the map scenario. Not every map needs to include mortars or MG's or even both teams having assets... maybe the mapmaker just wants the defense to have assets and very limited ones at that etc.

I dont really see it as enormous power for the Squad Leader but rather a tactical tool that a SL would have at his disposal anyway. He tells the rank and file to dig a trench/ditch over there, or set up a line of fire with those sandbags over here.. etc. This would also be good incentive to have some sort of ranking system where you cant immediately pick SL from the start. Personally, I'm not a fan of ranking systems.. simply having to rank up in order to act like a jerk doesnt really stop those who want to act like jerks.. they just rank up and then screw you anyway :D but I digress..

The side-effects of the pre-placement of assets are good.. another layer of tactical gameplay (being able to funnel traffic etc.), the maps and consequently the tactics needed to play them dont become stale as quickly as static maps do, and it encourages but doesnt force teamwork.
 

Floyd

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 19, 2006
4,313
725
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Waterproof
www.ro50pc.net
No need for vehicles. The Soviet Army was adept at moving thier anti-tank weapons around manually :D





Not related, but an interesting pic from the same site:
A medium Soviet BA3 in German service
 

VariousNames

FNG / Fresh Meat
Aug 6, 2009
1,226
521
0
Moving anti tank weapons around manually was a necessity due to the limited gun traverse so that is not special to the Soviet army.

Vehicles moving heavy ordinance was a matter of convenience over long distances. You could move your anti-tank gun maybe a few hundred meters, but towing it by man power for 100 miles is just plain absurd. Even 600 years ago somebody would have thought to latch it to a pair of oxen or tow it with horses.

And this brings me to my next point, which is that moving heavy ordinance via vehicles is ridiculous in-game. Games are meant to simulate battles, and it would be a distinctly stupid move to try towing one and setting it up in the middle of an armed conflict, potentially with tanks already set up, hull down and ready to strike the HT or towing vehicle.

HoS, in my opinion, DEFINITELY needs anti-tank ordinance, however, and mannable, towed anti-tank should be included in the game regardless, but my suggestion is that they should be mannable in static positions like you see in some Ost Front mods and in Darkest Hour, I.E. the gun should be accessible to a single operator and have a limited traverse.

(I think towed AT is necessary to bridge the infantry anti-tank role's gap in short to long range AT.....AT rifles and Panzerfaust both being decidedly short range.)
 

RedGuardist

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jun 14, 2006
1,697
349
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And this brings me to my next point, which is that moving heavy ordinance via vehicles is ridiculous in-game. Games are meant to simulate battles, and it would be a distinctly stupid move to try towing one and setting it up in the middle of an armed conflict, potentially with tanks already set up, hull down and ready to strike the HT or towing vehicle.

This.



And like argued many times before by others, there should be a possibility for platoon leader/squad leader to choose the position of the gun. And if not freely, then from let
 
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LogisticEarth

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 24, 2007
831
132
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Pennsylvania, USA
And this brings me to my next point, which is that moving heavy ordinance via vehicles is ridiculous in-game. Games are meant to simulate battles, and it would be a distinctly stupid move to try towing one and setting it up in the middle of an armed conflict, potentially with tanks already set up, hull down and ready to strike the HT or towing vehicle.

On larger tank maps this would not be true. In many situations the enemy force might be over the next ridge, or behind a line of trees that's concealing your position. If we're talking about moving the gun over a few hundred yards, it would be perfectly reasonable to tow the gun into position, and set it up for future defense/ambush.

I think movable AT guns would really spice up the action in open maps.
 

Napoleon Blownapart

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jul 1, 2009
170
3
0
Los Angeles, CA
a map like Black Day... towing AT guns would be very nice!
something like a Sdkfz 6 or even a Sdkfz 7 would be great... carries troops and guns :D

personally i think they would only be put into larger slower paced maps... it would be kinda cool to have the 7/1 or 7/2 variants too... for those large maps were you are shooting @ somebody 1000yrd away... personally i would love to see maps of the open fields of Russia with tanks charging over it and Russians defending it... with all sorts of goodies to blow each other way with:

here is a vid to give u an idea:

YouTube - tank battle - barbarossa 1941
i wanna see combat like that too... along side the dirty hard grisly combat in Stalingrad