Kicking and Banning Concerns

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anotherDSH

FNG / Fresh Meat
Dec 24, 2017
10
2
3
60
@RBCorp - You hit the nail right on the head. Here's my welcome page which covers your list of concerns nicely. These rules are born from over three years of running a game server. Players breaking the kick rules are given multiple chances to correct their game play before a kick vote is initiated. Bans come from the server admin in the web interface.

Respect your teammates. They may not have the skill and experience you do.
If you are able, buy a medic weapon and heal your teammates...they may return the favor.
Don't rage scrakes if you can't kill them by yourself. The scrake you rage is the one that kills your teammates. If you can't kill them just avoid them. They're slow and predictable.

Bans are for:
Vulgar or offensive player nicknames or comments (sexual or racist content).
Jerk game moves (stealing weapons).

Kicks are for:
Misuse of team chat (yelling or being too bossy).
Lone wolf play or perk level under 15 on suicidal or HOE.
Low prestige is OK.


My interest in hosting a server was born of frustration from matchmaking. Once I got mine going on my network I purchased a small form computer with an i-5 processor and equipped it with 16GB of RAM. It sits on my desktop and everyone who plays on my network enjoys a great ping. In the early years I ran multiple instances of takeover servers (with my fiber connection) to accommodate matchmaking for others but Tripwire's failure to correct a bug (which crashes a takeover server on a bad matchmaking request) put a stop to the takeover servers.

My server resides on the west coast is mostly frequented by players from BC, Alberta, California, Washington and Oregon and is usually full in the afternoons and evenings. I have entertained players from throughout the world. Latest addition to my friends list is a player from Mexico. My regulars are attracted by the rules, not put off by them. There is a nurturing and cooperative atmosphere generally but the occasional kick vote is needed for teaching purposes. The kick-ban features are teaching tools that represent real life consequences for antisocial behavior.

My ban list from almost 4k hours of gameplay over several years (yes I need a 12 step program) is 32 players long. Most bans are for homophobic and racial slurs but also for groups who have entered and immediately voted me off (essentially a hostile takeover).

In addition to the DLC weapons I mentioned in my post from yesterday I have also purchased many cosmetic bundles, including the most recent space pirate bundle. Apparently I won't buy buying any more of those either.

I wouldn't mind kicking and banning from the developer console when I am in game but frankly it just doesn't work for players who have special characters in their names and I have never been able to bring up "the kick list" described in the wiki guide. I wonder if that is an unimplemented carry-over from a port of a different game server.

I implore Tripwire to implement the changes in the correct order. Develop your solution to the perceived miss-use of the Web Interface before you take out kicking and banning (from the next game update). Perhaps you will listen. I have my doubts. Common sense is not very common.

I agree that @Humam2104 is likely a Tripwire employee and his remarks are condescending to server owners who have good reason to object.

Thank you to everyone else who has voiced your concerns.

Kind regards,
David
 

Kittenmittens

Tripwire Interactive Community Team
Staff member
Mar 11, 2016
1,419
344
83
Killing Floor Discord :)
Still no valid reason from TWI to remove features.

We had to get used to being ignored for years for all the bug reports (yeah laughing hard when I read new Jacks policing us about the need to trust TWI and wait... the same as when a TWI staff tells me I need to report issues! THE ****!), and now you're even removing features because a couple people complained server owners rule their servers? Are you serious? We own our servers we rule them. End of story. People not in the mood of following rules can find another server, there are 3000+ servers available.

You can even do something, as I suggested earlier. You pay for you own servers, you link your broken match making with your own servers. No issue. People who join a server not accepting low levels, or specific perks, or whatever, just follow the rules or F off. No way you're removing the only power we have on our servers. As I said we know you enough, fixing a reported typo in your code can take 6 month to multiple years for being fixed, I have absolutely no trust in this "issue" (what is it? nobody knows for sure) being fixed anytime soon. This will go under the carpet like the rest.

You're not getting away with that one! Enough of this BS!
To catch you up, it was more than a handful of people complaining. It was also more than a few servers. It was about 900. They first auto kicked certain perks and bragged about it. Then when people wanted to avoid the servers, because you could get thrown into them by matching making as their methods circumvented deranking of modded servers, the server owner started using methods to avoid blacklisting by auto changing ip addresses, then also escalated things by changing their server names, and changing to auto kick everyone on their servers after time. You can imagine the complaints we got when people were thrown into these types of servers more than the official ones because of the owners determination to troll.

This is also not the first step we took to try to stop the servers. The first step was taken with the Halloween update but they worked around it quickly. This is just one of the steps we have taken and it will not remain permanent.
 

®omano

Grizzled Veteran
May 14, 2009
4,156
207
63
France
www.hellsoldiers.tk
I don't believe the 'troll' has infinite resources. Can't you implement a remote blacklist you maintain up to date to removes these servers from match making? If you already 'tried' then you're doing it wrong, because as said, the guy does not have infinite resources and can not indefinitely change IP, this is non sense (also, have you ever heard about REPORTING ABUSE to hosting companies, in this case it may be hard to have actions taken but as a video game company you know lawyers things like that, some sweet talk with the representatives of the hosting company can sometimes help..).

As I already replied multiple time when TWI does claims like that, on my side "I believe what I see", and also from experience we know how you handle your hotfixes (like minimum three months later, for hotfixes that should follow the update soon after initial patch, for real) and patches, we'll be lucky to have a 'solution' in less than a year..

If you're unable to stop a 'troll' because of his infinite resources, then maybe consider what I suggested twice already: match make people on your official servers only this way you keep control, and you don't temporarily, for six months to a year, remove features from the administration panel.
 

Kittenmittens

Tripwire Interactive Community Team
Staff member
Mar 11, 2016
1,419
344
83
Killing Floor Discord :)
I don't believe the 'troll' has infinite resources. Can't you implement a remote blacklist you maintain up to date to removes these servers from match making? If you already 'tried' then you're doing it wrong, because as said, the guy does not have infinite resources and can not indefinitely change IP, this is non sense (also, have you ever heard about REPORTING ABUSE to hosting companies, in this case it may be hard to have actions taken but as a video game company you know lawyers things like that, some sweet talk with the representatives of the hosting company can sometimes help..).

As I already replied multiple time when TWI does claims like that, on my side "I believe what I see", and also from experience we know how you handle your hotfixes (like minimum three months later, for hotfixes that should follow the update soon after initial patch, for real) and patches, we'll be lucky to have a 'solution' in less than a year..

If you're unable to stop a 'troll' because of his infinite resources, then maybe consider what I suggested twice already: match make people on your official servers only this way you keep control, and you don't temporarily, for six months to a year, remove features from the administration panel.
We can't share details about steps we've taken, are in the process of taking, or will take in the future currently so as not to tip off the owner. You're free to search reddit, the discord, and steam forums for information about this situation. They are commonly referred to a :VIN" servers or "NO FUN" servers. I believe on of the big threads on steam was called "PSA VIN Servers" or "PSA NO FUN ALLOWED" servers. You can read people's frustration and the steps they took to avoid them and how the server owner worked to circumvent, thus proving it was not just about running servers the way they want but intended malice.

There happens to be a stickied thread on reddit on what's happening if you encountered random removal from servers. From there you can find guides on how to try to avoid them and see the comments as the situation continued to escalate and he started working around people's efforts.
 

anotherDSH

FNG / Fresh Meat
Dec 24, 2017
10
2
3
60
Ok assuming that is true ... I will research reddit later....
Please elaborate on @Yoshiro's comment "If you mean the in game developer console, that works." with regard to kicking and banning.
Please explain how to bring up the "kick list" in the console and how to kick someone who has unusual characters in their user name.
Having a functional console would cumbersome but would meet my immediate needs until a more elegant solution in the web admin is completed.
Thank you.

I did the reading and agree you have a big problem and I support your efforts to prevent some jerk from bringing down a game that I love. How can I get some instruction on how to use the developer console to meet my needs?
 
Last edited:

RBCorp

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 19, 2020
2
0
1
To catch you up, it was more than a handful of people complaining. It was also more than a few servers. It was about 900. They first auto kicked certain perks and bragged about it. Then when people wanted to avoid the servers, because you could get thrown into them by matching making as their methods circumvented deranking of modded servers, the server owner started using methods to avoid blacklisting by auto changing ip addresses, then also escalated things by changing their server names, and changing to auto kick everyone on their servers after time. You can imagine the complaints we got when people were thrown into these types of servers more than the official ones because of the owners determination to troll.

This is also not the first step we took to try to stop the servers. The first step was taken with the Halloween update but they worked around it quickly. This is just one of the steps we have taken and it will not remain permanent.
Nothing you described seems to have anything to do with me being able to manually go into the webadmin interface and click "kick" on somebody who's shouting the N-word.

You seemed to describe a problem with the game's bad matchmaking feature. And your solution is... THIS? How can you not acknowledge how insane and terrible this move was?

You're interfering with services that we pay for. Our money, our services. Fix your game instead of robbing me of a feature I pay for a year in advance. The way I see it, you took money out of my pocket. FIX IT.
 

®omano

Grizzled Veteran
May 14, 2009
4,156
207
63
France
www.hellsoldiers.tk
There happens to be a stickied thread on reddit on what's happening
Didn't see anything here though (beside this exact thread explaining nothing before I started ranting). I though we were on official forums here. I avoid Reddit at all costs.

We'll see what happens, we're hostages anyway. Paying hostages, let not forget.
 

Kittenmittens

Tripwire Interactive Community Team
Staff member
Mar 11, 2016
1,419
344
83
Killing Floor Discord :)
Nothing you described seems to have anything to do with me being able to manually go into the webadmin interface and click "kick" on somebody who's shouting the N-word.

You seemed to describe a problem with the game's bad matchmaking feature. And your solution is... THIS? How can you not acknowledge how insane and terrible this move was?

You're interfering with services that we pay for. Our money, our services. Fix your game instead of robbing me of a feature I pay for a year in advance. The way I see it, you took money out of my pocket. FIX IT.
The way it was being done used the webadmin's ability to kick and ban to automatically do it.
 

Kittenmittens

Tripwire Interactive Community Team
Staff member
Mar 11, 2016
1,419
344
83
Killing Floor Discord :)
Didn't see anything here though (beside this exact thread explaining nothing before I started ranting). I though we were on official forums here. I avoid Reddit at all costs.

We'll see what happens, we're hostages anyway. Paying hostages, let not forget.
These are the official forums, but this is not always the more active place when it comes to community chatter. I'm sure you are aware. The last place i saw it mentioned here was in a thread for TICR Q&A questions, I think. https://forums.tripwireinteractive....post-your-questions-here.2336711/post-2344458 This was before it jumped up to even higher numbers of servers.
 

SpookyD

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 13, 2018
11
2
3
47
Well we have pulled the trigger on our server. We have just made it private and put a password on it till this is is resolved or the subscription is up at the end of January. So now there is one less server out there now that did not have any stupid rules for people to play in.
 

®omano

Grizzled Veteran
May 14, 2009
4,156
207
63
France
www.hellsoldiers.tk
These are the official forums, but this is not always the more active place when it comes to community chatter. I'm sure you are aware. The last place i saw it mentioned here was in a thread for TICR Q&A questions, I think. https://forums.tripwireinteractive....post-your-questions-here.2336711/post-2344458 This was before it jumped up to even higher numbers of servers.
I mean if you ignore this place, it may be the reason the activity is going down since KF2 release. I remember here being pretty active at some point.
 

Kittenmittens

Tripwire Interactive Community Team
Staff member
Mar 11, 2016
1,419
344
83
Killing Floor Discord :)
I mean if you ignore this place, it may be the reason the activity is going down since KF2 release. I remember here being pretty active at some point.
Never said we ignore it. Just said that it's not always the most active when it comes to chatter compared to numbers elsewhere as a cause of why one may not be aware of the discussion around it if one only visits this forum.
 

anotherDSH

FNG / Fresh Meat
Dec 24, 2017
10
2
3
60
Still waiting on instruction on how to kick from the developer console when a player has special characters in their name. I don't want to have to password my server as @SpookyD has done.
 
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SpookyD

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 13, 2018
11
2
3
47
Still waiting on instruction on how to kick from the developer console when a player has special characters in their name. I don't want to have to password my server as @SpookyD has done.
well I did not want to to that either, It was a case of me having no choice.