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Germans now have the same number of Assaults as Soviets :(

I just do not see why people keep insisting on treating any 150+ meter kill with a PPSh as some stroke of god.

Real life and this game don't always seem to go together. I am purely speaking of in game performance whether it is as it should be or not.

People who say they 'snipe' with it are either very lucky (like when i fired the last bullet in my stickmag when i forgot to reload, getting a German in the head from 100 or so meters) to simply putting a few dozen bullets on them and hoping they hit.

Thats how it behaves ingame, and honestly, i happy with it. I prefer it over the MP40 even if its accuracy in game suffers.
 
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Problem is that these TO&E varied a lot during the war, and from unit to unit. Also a lot of them merely list what a unit of a certain size was "meant" to look like at a certain period from, based on what it took off with. These things often changed however as units got requipped at the frontlines, a regular riflemen suddenly ending up with an SMG or semi auto rifle instead, or vice versa.

I am fully aware of that and I already pointed that problem out, I used the early german attacks in Stalingrad as a prime example where notable amount of units were prioritised to re-eguip themselves with SMGs and such. The following units were not so lucky and besides what they already had most of them were looted rather than ben supplied officially.

The problem with the whole TO&E vs other things to use as basis is still that the exact details when something starts, where it ends and strenght of such can become rather skewed even more so if you try to average it out a bit and take looters into account, and how often it was that especially for german due the squad structure understrenght units were technically merged together temporarily and in some very odd cases even had few MGs combined together for say lack of riflemen in that specific company or so? Arguably that would be a way to justify some kind of superb and odd unit which was not exactly impossible at the frontline that had way too many MGs to their headcount and the rest were armed with SMGs, as much as it would have quite negative gameplay impact. Now turn the tables around on the other side and practical results can be somewhat identical, even more so considering the soviet method of fortifying buildings into strongpoints and making them quite well prepared firing positions in some cases.

My main point and argument in this thing still is to rely bit more on TO&E because as accurate and worth of consideration as other things can be, it requires extreme caution to properly apply in a map or context as given the bit chaotic nature of things you can find all kinds of weird things to justify with it, to the point it can has significant negative gameplay effect or just be downright hilarious and gamey at the same time. Take grenade stockpiles and their use in urban enviroment as one example.

(The odds are, either is not going to happen at all considering the current state of things.)
 
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I still want to see those tables. Specially the Russian ones (German organization is well known)
Not even David Glantz's books have details (just the type of unit (Panzer reg., Flak bat. etc.) and the number of men.) about precise equipment.

All he mentions are the amount of men/tanks in an engagement and their relative strength (compared to a full unit).
Some annecdotes, yes, but no precise details...
 
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I still want to see those tables. Specially the Russian ones (German organization is well known)
Not even David Glantz's books have details (just the type of unit (Panzer reg., Flak bat. etc.) and the number of men.) about precise equipment.

All he mentions are the amount of men/tanks in an engagement and their relative strength (compared to a full unit).
Some annecdotes, yes, but no precise details...
Depends on the books. He lists Soviet units to include number of rifles, SMGs, ATRs, MGs in a number of spots. Of course, one usually needs look in the footnotes. Some of the units got so beat up that ATRs were almost more prevalent than SMGs, but overall you would see a typical unit with 7 to 9 or so times the rifles compared to smgs.
 
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Mekhazzio said:
You want to hit a distant target, you point the PPSh in the general direction, brace it on something, and hold the trigger down. A 150m headshot isn't "sniping" when it takes an entire drum mag to get it.
When I use PPSh I try to aim a bit below my target - when I fire, even a short burst, then there is a chance that weapon itself will hit the enemy because while firing barrel goes up. I have some successes in mid range shooting even if I don't win each engagement.

greenlemonade said:
This is highly unrealistic. At least the old system gave the Russians slightly more Assault roles. PPSH was extreamly common on the battlefield. 6 times more common than the MP40! I suggest giving the Russians 1 more Assault role or taking away one more German Assault role. This would bring a touch of realism.
It is very hard to present very realistic weapon loadout while keeping the balance of the game between sides as well as between weapons per side.
 
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I am fully aware of that and I already pointed that problem out, I used the early german attacks in Stalingrad as a prime example where notable amount of units were prioritised to re-eguip themselves with SMGs and such. The following units were not so lucky and besides what they already had most of them were looted rather than ben supplied officially.

The problem with the whole TO&E vs other things to use as basis is still that the exact details when something starts, where it ends and strenght of such can become rather skewed even more so if you try to average it out a bit and take looters into account, and how often it was that especially for german due the squad structure understrenght units were technically merged together temporarily and in some very odd cases even had few MGs combined together for say lack of riflemen in that specific company or so? Arguably that would be a way to justify some kind of superb and odd unit which was not exactly impossible at the frontline that had way too many MGs to their headcount and the rest were armed with SMGs, as much as it would have quite negative gameplay impact. Now turn the tables around on the other side and practical results can be somewhat identical, even more so considering the soviet method of fortifying buildings into strongpoints and making them quite well prepared firing positions in some cases.

My main point and argument in this thing still is to rely bit more on TO&E because as accurate and worth of consideration as other things can be, it requires extreme caution to properly apply in a map or context as given the bit chaotic nature of things you can find all kinds of weird things to justify with it, to the point it can has significant negative gameplay effect or just be downright hilarious and gamey at the same time. Take grenade stockpiles and their use in urban enviroment as one example.

(The odds are, either is not going to happen at all considering the current state of things.)

For that reason, as-well as knowing the huge number of other SMG's issued to the German army besides the MP40, I believe it would be most historically correct if the same number of SMGs are made available for both sides ingame.

In short I don't see why the OP has a problem with the current load out, and personally I find the below issues much more pressing and destructive to immersion:

- Excessive recoil of certain weapons (MG34, Mkb42 & PPSh41)
- 6x scoped SVT40 & 4x scoped G41 (Never existed)
- ZF41 for the G41 & Mkb42 (So rare it shouldn't have been added) [Ok as a regular rifleman unlock for the K98 though]
- Silenced Nagant Pistol (So rare it shouldn't have been added)
- MP40/II (So rare it shouldn't have been added)
- MG34 saddle drum (So rare it shouldn't have been added)
- Bullet damage issues (7.92 Kurz being underpowered etc.)
- Bullet penetration issues (Pistol rounds overpenetrating etc.)
- Inability to fix & unfix bayonets
- Inability to choose between the upgrades you've unlocked
- Bayonet equipped sniper rifles (Never happened)
- Lacking scope models (Come on!)
- Too high a minimum mouse input treshold making minute corrections to aim at high magnifications impossible.
- Lack of larger maps (One of the things that made the original game stand out)
- Mouse control for tank turret traverse & gun elevation (Lacks the coordination needed during real life gun laying, whilst WASD keys simulated it as close as possible)


Note: This list of issues is not sorted according to the importance of each issue, thus the stuff at the top is not necessarily more important than the stuff at the bottom.
 
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People who say they 'snipe' with it are either very lucky (like when i fired the last bullet in my stickmag when i forgot to reload, getting a German in the head from 100 or so meters) to simply putting a few dozen bullets on them and hoping they hit.
Sniping (a single, aimed shot not hosing the area down or fluke stray) with a "level 50" PPSh -- as abhorrent as that sounds; I really do blame the consoles for this kind of BS -- is very doable up to not far off 200m (in my case
 
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The fact that other SMGs were handed out to the Germans doesn't change the fact that before and during Stalingrad, the Germans didn't hand out SMGs to whole squads. SMGs were for paratroopers and squad leaders.
The Russians were known for outfitting entire squads with PPShs.

Looking at photos from Stalingrad gives you a small sense of this. MP40s are rare and PPSHs are in every other picture. Sometimes there are more than 6 or more in one photo. This is never the case in a picture of a German.

Does this warrant giving the Russians one more assault role than Germans have? I think it does and I also think it would be balanced. Bold actions can be even more useful in certain situations.
 
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