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Bring back the FP decap

If the flat-out bug with melee headshots not counting for extra damage versus Fleshpounds is not ultimately resolved, I am in support of once again allowing melee weapons- apart from the knife- to decapitate fleshpounds.

Why would you be melee-ing the FP anyway? Particularly with SS, support, and commando easily owning them. Zerkers have crawlers and siren to worry about but otherwise deal with most enemies easily. Scrakes have stun (which I don't support) to allow melee to be viable, even optimal, against one of the most durable enemies in the game.

The main issue with decaps was that a 'pup (easily) or 9mm (difficult) could decap at slight range. A medic (for the armor buff) or a berserker (for damage resistance) with a 'pup was all you needed to easily take care of any and all FPs.
 
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I never actually thought I'd have to post on this forum, but the sheer astonishing lack of basic reading comprehension displayed in this thread has driven me to it. (No, that isn't an accomplishment.) Similarly, I'm not going to bother quoting particular posts to reply to them, because, quite frankly, reading them the first time was painful enough.

Firstly: I often play Suicidal with Jabau. I know how he plays. To everyone saying he mostly uses guns: No, you are wrong, and should stop pulling things out of your arses. He uses the Katana for everything except Flesh Pounds, and to good effect at that. Crawlers? Yes - if you move backwards at the right time, you can dodge their leap and slash them in the face without taking damage. It can be awkward if there's a group of them, but it's still doable. Sirens? Again, yes - if you time it just right, you can bum rush them without taking much damage, or if that doesn't work, you can try to ambush them (since the scream attack uses simple point-to-point line of sight for hit detection, which can be blocked by just about anything). Groups of Sirens take a bit of creativity without backup from the team, unless you defer to your ranged weapons; probably the best way to deal with them is to split them up either by luring them around obstacles (or off ledges) or by throwing a grenade at them from far enough away. And I don't even know why people whinge about Husks, because dodging their fireballs isn't that hard, and one strike to the head will knock it off. The Crossbow is exclusively for the Flesh Pounds, though it isn't quite as effective at that as it is in the hands of a Sharpshooter (I'm pretty sure it takes an extra shot in 6-man Suicidal; maybe two).

Also, while I'm at it: He's well aware of the Chainsaw nerf, as he's said in this thread. If you think he isn't, you haven't read his posts properly, and thus should not be commenting on them.

Moving on to the topic at hand: No one is saying that the Flesh Pound melee decap was difficult in isolation. With a bit of practice, it could be executed reliably in almost any circumstances, and if the circumstances didn't permit it, a smart player could generally manipulate them easily enough (e.g. moving to better terrain). What made it particularly dangerous (besides the damage inflicted by a punch to the face, which was never pleasant in Suicidal especially, and a good way to lose armour) - and require teamwork at that (shock!) - was the fact that the person doing it was prone to attack from the other specimens. Everyone saying that its advocates don't like teamwork apparently forget that on Suicidal, Gorefasts hurt. A lot. So does the Siren hiding behind the Flesh Pound, and in the later waves especially, there almost always is one (at least). The team was therefore needed to protect the headhunter from the hordes that wanted to shred his sides. They also had to be on the ball in case something went wrong (e.g. the team misjudged the Flesh Pound's target, so instead of facing the valiant attacker, the FP brushed him off, then took the hit in his side and expressed an objection).

Note how I never said "the Berserker" in the previous paragraph. That's because, as Jabau has pointed out, any perk could do it; it was usually left to the Berserker simply because he was much better at it than the others, and was less affected by the Flesh Pound's attacks (and those of his company) than his closest competitor (the Commando, who, in my experience at least, was an uncommon sight in Suicidal prepatch anyway). Jabau's point - and I agree with it - is that the ability of any perk to take a Flesh Pound's head (though not without cost) stopped Suicidal from being a Sharpshooter fest like it is now. They were still common, but not absolutely necessary.

But what weapon should the other perks use? I agree that the knife and 9mm taking it off in one go is a bit silly for gameplay reasons. But what if it wasn't one go? What if weaker weapons required several hits, a Fire Axe and Katana an alt fire swing, and the Chainsaw a full second of cutting? That's just my idea, but there we go; the particulars can be addressed one step at a time.

I think that just about covers it.
 
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I would like to point out, that compared to the FP of the original mod, this one is kind of nerfed. I mean, he still instills fear into the hearts of grown men but back in the day this ****er meant serious ****ing business, even on easy difficulty. You HAD to have a LAW to make sure he didn't kill anybody and if you didn't you might as well draw straws to see who got their skull crushed by this mean nasty bad-*** mother****er. Now, you can just pop him in the head and he goes down.

I propose that the FP gets a serious buff just so he goes back to his mother****ing godlike status.

Trust me, the f-bombs accurately depict his complete badassery
 
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Honestly, I can see why we might need to nerf SS, and maybe give a couple of other classes the ability to HS the FP.


But guys. Seriously, arguing realism? Realism is:

Clot Kills you in four hits
Gorefast in 1-2
Siren in one, pending hearing ability.
Bloat is uncertain, as he still has skin and is walking around blowing chinks on himself.
FP one
Scrake one
Crawler probably five or so.


However:
Clot dies with one HS 9mm
Gorefast same.
Siren same.
Stalker same.
Crawler same.
.44 (Lever) kills Scrake, Husk, FP in one headshot. Same with patriarch.


Wow what a fun game.
 
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I never actually thought I'd have to post on this forum, but the sheer astonishing lack of basic reading comprehension displayed in this thread has driven me to it. (No, that isn't an accomplishment.) Similarly, I'm not going to bother quoting particular posts to reply to them, because, quite frankly, reading them the first time was painful enough.
Insulting people on first introduction. You sure know how to win people over.

Firstly: I often play Suicidal with Jabau. I know how he plays. To everyone saying he mostly uses guns: No, you are wrong, and should stop pulling things out of your arses. He uses the Katana for everything except Flesh Pounds, and to good effect at that.
I can believe that. I would still find crawlers difficult, but I'm not very used to the katana, and never liked it in the first place. My main argument was that Berserker is not Fine, as Jabau put it, just because it's effective if you use a specific load-out, comprising of one of the 5 weapons at the Berserker's disposal, and then combining it with what's probably the most OP weapon in the entire game, from a different perk. Berserker isn't completely useless, but he's certainly not far from being there. In the sense of practical weapons, he's now more pidgeon-holed than the Firebug. At least Firebug has a choice in what sidearm he takes.

Also, while I'm at it: He's well aware of the Chainsaw nerf, as he's said in this thread. If you think he isn't, you haven't read his posts properly, and thus should not be commenting on them.
I know he's acknowledged that, several times. He's also on several occasions claimed there was nothing wrong with the Berserker class. That's a contradiction, and that's what I have a problem with.

[The rest of Entangler's post, about the decap]
I agree completely with this, save for maybe the point that I don't think a 9mm should ever be able to decapitate the Fleshpound. I can't imagine 9mm rounds ever penetrating a neck well enough to make a head fly off. But I wouldn't complain really if it could, realism aside. As long as it wasn't easily done.
 
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The theory is the FP was vulnerable for maybe 1/5 of a second while his head bobbed down during his non-rage attack, when the top of his head was exposed along with the "seam" which apparently put his head back together after his brain was rewired. Any amount of damage executed point-blank during this tiny window of opportunity would hit the weak spot, his achile's heal. I had no problem with a 9mm doing that, it made sense, was fun, entailed risk, and looked super cool.

However, with the new headshot vulnerability now, it's ridiculously easy to one-shot the fp with a sharpshooter xbow from across the map. It should take 2 xbow headshots with a level 4 sharpshooter on 6-man hard, 2 headshots for level 5 on 6-man suicidal, and 1 headshot for a godlike level 6 SS. The fp should get a special headshot script that's different from all the other specs, increasing the damage required to decap.

Either that, or reduce the uber damage boost that the xbow does on headshots (I read from this site that it does 6X damage on headshots):

[url]http://strategywiki.org/wiki/Killing_Floor/Weapons[/URL]

Can anyone confirm? Maybe only do 4X damage for headshots, make fps more of a challenge.
 
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To make this simple every class has it role sharpshooter is to take out high ranking zeds. SS is not designed to do the crowd control as some of the other classes. On suicidal you feel the limited ammo with 6 players in the room. If you feel that you aren't getting enough kills it also goes down to player ability. The xbow maybe should have less ammo, but the purpose of the sharpshooter is to kill the big guys. Perhaps the reason everyone is complaining is the don't know the role.
 
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To make this simple every class has it role sharpshooter is to take out high ranking zeds. SS is not designed to do the crowd control as some of the other classes. On suicidal you feel the limited ammo with 6 players in the room. If you feel that you aren't getting enough kills it also goes down to player ability. The xbow maybe should have less ammo, but the purpose of the sharpshooter is to kill the big guys. Perhaps the reason everyone is complaining is the don't know the role.

I think your the 1 who doesn't know its role.

It use to be the best for taking out Sirens, Scrakes and Fleshpounds at range with the Crossbow and could hold its own against a reasonable number of enemies with the 9mm and Handcannons.
Now if you choose the Crossbow it can take out Sirens, Husks, Scrakes and Fleshpounds in a single shot on all difficulties. If you choose the M14 you can take out everything bar Scrakes and Fleshpounds with a single shot and spam headshot those 2 to death without much trouble either.

If you attempt to kill everything you'll run out of ammo, been there, done that. Thats the same with any class to my knowledge. If you use more care you can easily conserve ammo.
 
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