Both America's Army and Red Orchestra appear to have the same ... err.... well, disadvan...error...glitch thing. You need to aim ahead! And this means bullet delay! It's far more visible in America's Army, but it's just annoying, how can you be playing the most realistic WW2 shooter and have to worry about lag? And no, it isn't my internet connection or my computer... I've done research and looked around, watched videos and read forums. This happens to everyone
This is what I hate about the UT2k4 Engine
- Thread starter extremepilot
- Start date
You need to aim ahead because bullets take time to travel, hence you have to lead moving targets.
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Isaak Johnson
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Well, maybe you should also take a look at some of the info on Red Orchestra's balistics system. If you look you might find that the "bullet lag" that your mostly experiencing, even offline, is actually on purpose.
In Red Orchestra, the bullets do not use hit-scan technology. Hit-scan means that when you pull the trigger, the bullet reaches its destination instantly no matter how far away, this method is both simple and effective.
But in RO, the Dev's wanted the bullet physics to be realistic, where it took time to reach the target, where you have to lead your target at longer ranges, and even adjust for how the bullet drops due to gravity. In RO its even possible to two people to shoot each other at the same time, this is because the bullets have to travel the distance instead of instantly hitting.
So dont worry extremepilot, this is normal for RO.
How far away are you shooting at the target? Are you using a scope?
In Red Orchestra, the bullets do not use hit-scan technology. Hit-scan means that when you pull the trigger, the bullet reaches its destination instantly no matter how far away, this method is both simple and effective.
But in RO, the Dev's wanted the bullet physics to be realistic, where it took time to reach the target, where you have to lead your target at longer ranges, and even adjust for how the bullet drops due to gravity. In RO its even possible to two people to shoot each other at the same time, this is because the bullets have to travel the distance instead of instantly hitting.
So dont worry extremepilot, this is normal for RO.
How far away are you shooting at the target? Are you using a scope?
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Thing is, there IS no "bullet lag" offline. That's the thing about it
Sorry if I sound a little stubborn, but it's true for me
Sorry if I sound a little stubborn, but it's true for me
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Isaak Johnson
Grizzled Veteran
Wait, in your first post you said there was bullet delay, and now your saying there isn't. . . I think you might need to give us a little more info so we can help you.
What is your average ping when your experiencing this problem?
What is your average ping when your experiencing this problem?
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Internet Lag is a problem with the Internet, not the Emgine. Practically every game on every Engine is sucseptible(sp) to this effect.
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I havent noticed bullet delay but I hate that unreal engine "vehakals" drive like boxes
True, but they are basically boxes. That said, the Unreal Engine does a pretty good job with vehicles compared to some others like the Quake 4 Engine for eg. What bugs me most about the Unreal Engine and Vehicles are the Collision issues where the Vehicles, in certain situations, Hop and/or Jerk around. Fortunetly that only happens once in awhile.
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On Unreal engine games bullet lag is really noticable sometimes. You'd shoot the floor and the bullet won't hit for a good few seconds, kinda annoying.
Hardly ever happens in RO but in AA it's terrible.
Hardly ever happens in RO but in AA it's terrible.
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Playing RO I used to think I was a bad shot. I would miss so many crossing shots I did not know how. Then I realized internet lag last time I fired up op flashpoint and killed an entire US squad running downhill at an 80 angle to me 400 yards away with a dragunov in a clip and a half. even my misses were a few pixels off.I was like wow!! Then I played RO later and missed a guy at 30, so I now add a little to my lead to compensate for internet lag and miss a lot less now.
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I AM RIGHT WITH YOU EXTREME PILOT.
I can't stand that about Red Orchestra or America's Army. Tripwire needs to find a way to make it so ballistics don't rely on your connection, if that's even possible.
This is my biggest gripe with Red Orchestra. In the end it takes away some fun from the game. You almost have to be a psychic in some situations to actually make a moving shot.
I can't stand that about Red Orchestra or America's Army. Tripwire needs to find a way to make it so ballistics don't rely on your connection, if that's even possible.
This is my biggest gripe with Red Orchestra. In the end it takes away some fun from the game. You almost have to be a psychic in some situations to actually make a moving shot.
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I disagree, this is an Unreal Engine problem. Not an internet problem. Battlefield 2's PRMM mod has ballistics and they don't lag.
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In a client-server-based game with 32 players there are 33 realities. One for each player, and the server's.
The server is the king and ruler of the game world, and what the server says is true, is true.
So, what does this have to do with you as a player? Well, UE-netcode uses serverside hit detection. Simply put this means that if it takes 100 milliseconds for an update packet from the server to reach your computer, then the server will be 100 milliseconds ahead of you. If you react to whatever the server tells you happens, it will take another 100 milliseconds for your reaction to reach the server. In short, by the time you have seen a player move into view and pressed the fire button at least 100 milliseconds (0.1 seconds) will have passed before your serverside avatar actually fires, and 200 milliseconds will have passed since the other player's serverside avatar moved into the view of your serverside avatar.
Getting around this is impossible without inventing faster-than-light communication. Some games try to fake it (such as Battlefield2) by trying to predict the difference between the client reality and the server reality and moving the clientside ingame avatars accordingly. This, however, brings with it its own set of problems. Pronespamming and dolphindiving in BF2 is mainly an effort to **** up the relationship between avatar and hitbox for the player shooting at you by abusing the clientside prediction. In UE-powered games you don't have this problem, as the reality you see is simply the serverside reality with a certain timedelay. Other games use clientside hit detection (IE bullet impacts are not calculated serverside, the client simply says to the server "hey, I hit that guy"), which is a method that makes it far easier to make 3rd party hacks that enable you to cheat.
Personally, I prefer the UE way of doing things. I'm decent enough at doing my own clientside prediction in my head, thank you.
The server is the king and ruler of the game world, and what the server says is true, is true.
So, what does this have to do with you as a player? Well, UE-netcode uses serverside hit detection. Simply put this means that if it takes 100 milliseconds for an update packet from the server to reach your computer, then the server will be 100 milliseconds ahead of you. If you react to whatever the server tells you happens, it will take another 100 milliseconds for your reaction to reach the server. In short, by the time you have seen a player move into view and pressed the fire button at least 100 milliseconds (0.1 seconds) will have passed before your serverside avatar actually fires, and 200 milliseconds will have passed since the other player's serverside avatar moved into the view of your serverside avatar.
Getting around this is impossible without inventing faster-than-light communication. Some games try to fake it (such as Battlefield2) by trying to predict the difference between the client reality and the server reality and moving the clientside ingame avatars accordingly. This, however, brings with it its own set of problems. Pronespamming and dolphindiving in BF2 is mainly an effort to **** up the relationship between avatar and hitbox for the player shooting at you by abusing the clientside prediction. In UE-powered games you don't have this problem, as the reality you see is simply the serverside reality with a certain timedelay. Other games use clientside hit detection (IE bullet impacts are not calculated serverside, the client simply says to the server "hey, I hit that guy"), which is a method that makes it far easier to make 3rd party hacks that enable you to cheat.
Personally, I prefer the UE way of doing things. I'm decent enough at doing my own clientside prediction in my head, thank you.
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Battlefield 2 is actually a terrible example of how to make netcode. If you set the latencycompensation wrong compared to your latency you sometimes have to aim behind the target you see in order to hit the hitbox. There are so many flaws in the Battlefield 2 netcode it's not even funny. I won't even mention all the crap you can do by messing around with the interpolation settings.
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To translate and add on to the last excellent post:
-- You have to lead the targets in some games, because you'll need to shoot
maybe 1/5th of a second ahead of where you saw them at so the server will register the hit.
-- You have to lead the targets in some games, because the bullets are treated as real moving objects rather than lasers.
-- In RO:O, you have to do some of both.
-- You have to lead the targets in some games, because you'll need to shoot
maybe 1/5th of a second ahead of where you saw them at so the server will register the hit.
-- You have to lead the targets in some games, because the bullets are treated as real moving objects rather than lasers.
-- In RO:O, you have to do some of both.
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Try an instagib match in UT2004, and you know it's not the engine, but the connection, if things don't go as planned.
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