Poll are the tanks broken or messed up
- Thread starter jtkalal
- Start date
Yeah I dislike the armor loadouts alot the russians ger uber loadouts with all 85s and Is2s its bull crap the many workhourse should be the 76 like it was historicly.
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True. What always amuses me are the people who try to get into slugging matches with a 76 vs Tigers and Panthers.
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yeah, I selected "other" in the vote, and was going to say what you did. we just need some better maps as regards historically accurate tank allotments.
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Before I get picky, I want to say that I really do enjoy the tank combat in RO:OST. I'm not a military or historical expert and that some of my pre-conceptions are probably wrong.
First, either the guns are too powerful, or the armour is too weak. And rather than siting the Tiger / T-34 match-up, I'm going to mention the PzIII.
It can kill a JS-2 at 750m with a single shot into the front armour, when using APCR. The front if the JS-2 is 120mm at angles of 30 and 60 degrees for the upper and lower respectively.
The 50mm gun of the PzIII shouldn't have a penetration of more than 70mm (as a maximum) at an angle of 30 degrees at a range of 750m.
The only thing that I can think of that would allow the PzIII to do this is if by aiming low enough, the hit is being applied to the bottom of the tank. But the angle should be too shallow to allow it.
Second, angling plays too big a role, especially when you consider the first point. It the armour is strengthened / guns weakened, and angling is not adjusted, then even a small angle will start deflecting shots, when 5 degrees less, your tank would have been destoryed.
First, either the guns are too powerful, or the armour is too weak. And rather than siting the Tiger / T-34 match-up, I'm going to mention the PzIII.
It can kill a JS-2 at 750m with a single shot into the front armour, when using APCR. The front if the JS-2 is 120mm at angles of 30 and 60 degrees for the upper and lower respectively.
The 50mm gun of the PzIII shouldn't have a penetration of more than 70mm (as a maximum) at an angle of 30 degrees at a range of 750m.
The only thing that I can think of that would allow the PzIII to do this is if by aiming low enough, the hit is being applied to the bottom of the tank. But the angle should be too shallow to allow it.
Second, angling plays too big a role, especially when you consider the first point. It the armour is strengthened / guns weakened, and angling is not adjusted, then even a small angle will start deflecting shots, when 5 degrees less, your tank would have been destoryed.
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- The SU76 and T60 should not be deflecting any thing fired at it except small arms fire.
- Tone down this angling armor bonus. The only tanks that should benefit from this are the IS-2, Tiger and Panther. 88mm and 75mm rounds should not be bouncing off T34's at the ranges we fight at. The PzGr39 round was designed to penetrate slopped armor.
- Fix rounds bouncing off turrets when a tanks hull is angled away from you with the turret aiming at your tank. This makes T34's invulnerable.
- PTRD SHOULD NOT BE ABLE TO DESTROY TIGERS AND IS-2'S!
- PzIII should have more armor then the PzIV. The front of both of them should be resistent to PTRD and 20mm rounds.
- T34/76 should only be able to penetrate the sides and rear of the Tiger at 100 meters. Right now you can do this at 1000 meters.
- Tone down this angling armor bonus. The only tanks that should benefit from this are the IS-2, Tiger and Panther. 88mm and 75mm rounds should not be bouncing off T34's at the ranges we fight at. The PzGr39 round was designed to penetrate slopped armor.
- Fix rounds bouncing off turrets when a tanks hull is angled away from you with the turret aiming at your tank. This makes T34's invulnerable.
- PTRD SHOULD NOT BE ABLE TO DESTROY TIGERS AND IS-2'S!
- PzIII should have more armor then the PzIV. The front of both of them should be resistent to PTRD and 20mm rounds.
- T34/76 should only be able to penetrate the sides and rear of the Tiger at 100 meters. Right now you can do this at 1000 meters.
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1. Penetration, 2 hit bug is still there, besides tanks don’t go yellow, then red, then kaboom! If a tank takes a hit - that’s it.
2. Driving full speed with your engine on fire is the most ugliest and lame thing I've ever seen (and it was done right in the mod).
3. In reality, a fired shell doesn’t look like a Shang Tsung's fireball
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2. Driving full speed with your engine on fire is the most ugliest and lame thing I've ever seen (and it was done right in the mod).
3. In reality, a fired shell doesn’t look like a Shang Tsung's fireball
Cheers
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Agreed. Especially about the T60. A Pz4 only takes about four 20mm rounds before it blows up. I can't believe that this is realistic.
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Things I'd like to see changed:
No 100% HP based system. I don't think a T60 should eventually be able to take something down if it goes at it long enough. If the 20mm couldn't penetrate the armor then it should be ineffective. Same with all guns against all armors. What should have HPs are damagable components.
Armor spall and crew killing.
Tracking should be easier (and visible).
Tanks shouldn't always blow up when destroyed. I'd like to see fires and other critical damages that "kill" the vehicle.
Proper loadouts. No HEAT for the short barrel 75mm? Didn't the Soviets use HESH rounds?
Proper camo for Pz.III Pz.IVF1 and 251 HT.
Slower times for entering and exiting a vehicle (but i dunno how that could be implemented without the accompanying animations).
More early war tanks. More tank destroyers and assault guns.
No 100% HP based system. I don't think a T60 should eventually be able to take something down if it goes at it long enough. If the 20mm couldn't penetrate the armor then it should be ineffective. Same with all guns against all armors. What should have HPs are damagable components.
Armor spall and crew killing.
Tracking should be easier (and visible).
Tanks shouldn't always blow up when destroyed. I'd like to see fires and other critical damages that "kill" the vehicle.
Proper loadouts. No HEAT for the short barrel 75mm? Didn't the Soviets use HESH rounds?
Proper camo for Pz.III Pz.IVF1 and 251 HT.
Slower times for entering and exiting a vehicle (but i dunno how that could be implemented without the accompanying animations).
More early war tanks. More tank destroyers and assault guns.
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You can do one shot kills, you just have to aim at the weak spots. I agree that the tracks should be more vulnerable, but it may just be an engine limitation. Things can only be as realisitic as that allows, too much and the game will run slow.
We all have the same limitations in this regard, so i don't think we should change anything, especially since nobody uses the tanks the way they were used IRL. No tank driver would get within 300m of an enemy tank without backup or cover, yet we all do that, so that trade off is the angling and supertracks that exist.
It's not that big of a deal IMO, especially when you see the guys who are really good with a tank take out 4 or 5 before dying.
We all have the same limitations in this regard, so i don't think we should change anything, especially since nobody uses the tanks the way they were used IRL. No tank driver would get within 300m of an enemy tank without backup or cover, yet we all do that, so that trade off is the angling and supertracks that exist.
It's not that big of a deal IMO, especially when you see the guys who are really good with a tank take out 4 or 5 before dying.
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exactly. Had a couple of one shoot kills, on tigers, panthers and other tanks, when tried to fire in the areas, i have from the tank datasheets (hehe, one thing about the very nice and great ROO game box we got in germany, you HAVE to love it, yes!
). And even more, when using the panther/tiger again T34/76, as when i hit them frontal, its near evry time, a "one shoot" kill. Only, what still is bothering me, that angling playes very big role, as it still happens somewhat occasionally, that shells with high velocity and penetration power, just richochet, from armor, specialy T34, SU and panthers as well, when it shoud not. I do eevn not doubt, that a richochet can happen, even with a gun the panther and tiger fired, but first on high distances, when the shell already loost some of its velocity and power. If a 88mm shell, richochet from a T34 (what ever version) sometimes with distances beyond, letz say for example 1000m, theres nothing i woud say against it, im sure, on such high distances, this happen by times, but it only becomes a very strange thing, that it happens sometimes 3 or 4 times in a row, on distances not biger then 50 or 100m, there is usualy no way, it can richochet several times. Most issues, german tankers, noticed, with there guns, was "missing" their targets (pantherfiebel for example) on long ranges, then realy richochet of from the armor. Aanyway, in average, evry second shot the panther fired, was a "hit", due to its, accurate gun, precise optics and "usualy" well trained crew.
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Mate if you would have followed the Forums, you'd already know that the Devs plan to add Complexity to the Tank System, so people naturally vote for Tweaks.
And those who vote for a complete Redo got no clue of how programming works.
And those who vote for a complete Redo got no clue of how programming works.
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Unless the hit is very minor, but otherwise agreed.
But the angling works way too weird. I know, angling armour affects pretty much but one live situation in Konigsplatz:
I was commander in IS-2, so when we spotted Tiger 30m away from us, driver stopped and angled the tank. The Tiger did this too, and when I fired at first they just got angled and it bounced off. Now comes the funny part:
After VERY long time, both tanks ran out of shells because ALL shells that were shot, no matter where, just bounced off and there was only 30m range from tank to tank. At this point me and my driver were literally crying with laugher.
Realistic? Dunno, but where
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