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Machine Gun, Belt Extending suggestion

Lazermane made a good point with the lack of supression effect on people, and also the big bugbear of the mg is respawning people, who know exactly where your going to be.

However i do often find myself getting blown to pieces as i reload my MG42, if i had the option of adding more bullets i may have lived. I'm an advocate of increasing the supression effect from MG bullets to stop people popping up and just plugging you, so if MG's blur was increased a bit, and the ammo adding feature was increased, it would be a good addition.
 
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IMO the mg42 is gimped, it doesn't work realistically. You can't hit the broad side of a barn at 50 meters, I don't think such was the case in real life.

And I continue my quest to make the MG42 more realistic. Which is why I quote this part as I have quoted lots before.

The 42 IS gimped, and no, it doesn't work realistically. Someone, for the love of all this WW2-ish, fix the MG 42! Recoil, supression use, accuracy (though closely linked to the recoil issue) and being able to use it when kneeling and standing. Please please please!
 
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"Oh yes, let's expose our whole bodies instead of just the upper half!"

Here's a real crazy idea, set up the MG/tripod combo in a position where you're not exposed! Like behind a wall or in defilade. Duh.

BTW regarding recoil, if coded right, using the tripod would greatly reduce recoil and make use of the scope. So you have some tangible benefits.

I'm guessing that a number of you guys never fired an MG before let alone say an MG3. You can hit targets with the currently modelled MG from far away you are limited to what you can see and must use VERY short bursts.(I'm not saying that I don't agree about problems with the current MG modelling in RO) BTW firing an MG from a bipod is not the most accurate way to employ he weapon, that's why you need a tripod. The majority of bipod or tripod MG firing is done in very short bursts, 6-9 rounds, and a good gunner can pop off single or 2 round shots. The long bursts come in handly for stuff that pops up in shorter ranges. And if you watch Ww2 footage you will see most of the time the gunners are getting off very short bursts.. particulalrly in bad climate conditions (Extreme cold or heat) the Mg jams or suffers multiple stoppages which is why you see the gunner firing short bursts and having to recock the weapon constantly.

If you want bigger belts and stringing belts together then you should have an Assistant Gunner. These things are something that an individual gunner normally does not do. That's why you have the small ammo packs 50-75 rounds) in drums for the "single" gunner. BTW this is still the same issue that any gunner has today. And sure you could link together a bunch of rounds and rap them all over you like rambo but then with any serious movement they'll get kinked up and when you hit the ground they could get full of mud or snow and then cause the gun to jam. If you want realistic these factors have to be taken into consideration.

A good gunner using his head can function just fine within the current model by controlling his fire. The main thing that's misisng is that normally the gunners are lone wolfing it which is not something that's done in real life. The machinegun represents THE most important part of your squad or platoon. Operated correctly they are your biggest casualty producing system. The squad leaders and platoon leaders emplace MGs and tell them where they want them before they do anythng else.

If you are a rifleman swanning about looking for something to do you should tag onto your gunner and support him. Give him ammo but also cover him when he's in position and reloading. Then you will see an exponential rise in the effectiveness of MGs without changing a single line of code.

Think about it, even in games today, normally, when an enemy MG is firing it draws the attention of everyone. Either they are trying to knock it out to get the advance going or you are going somewhre else to try and avoid it.

Los
 
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Los said:
"Oh yes, let's expose our whole bodies instead of just the upper half!"

Here's a real crazy idea, set up the MG/tripod combo in a position where you're not exposed! Like behind a wall or in defilade. Duh.

BTW regarding recoil, if coded right, using the tripod would greatly reduce recoil and make use of the scope. So you have some tangible benefits.

I'm guessing that a number of you guys never fired an MG before let alone say an MG3. You can hit targets with the currently modelled MG from far away you are limited to what you can see and must use VERY short bursts.(I'm not saying that I don't agree about problems with the current MG modelling in RO) BTW firing an MG from a bipod is not the most accurate way to employ he weapon, that's why you need a tripod. The majority of bipod or tripod MG firing is done in very short bursts, 6-9 rounds, and a good gunner can pop off single or 2 round shots. The long bursts come in handly for stuff that pops up in shorter ranges. And if you watch Ww2 footage you will see most of the time the gunners are getting off very short bursts.. particulalrly in bad climate conditions (Extreme cold or heat) the Mg jams or suffers multiple stoppages which is why you see the gunner firing short bursts and having to recock the weapon constantly.

If you want bigger belts and stringing belts together then you should have an Assistant Gunner. These things are something that an individual gunner normally does not do. That's why you have the small ammo packs 50-75 rounds) in drums for the "single" gunner. BTW this is still the same issue that any gunner has today. And sure you could link together a bunch of rounds and rap them all over you like rambo but then with any serious movement they'll get kinked up and when you hit the ground they could get full of mud or snow and then cause the gun to jam. If you want realistic these factors have to be taken into consideration.

A good gunner using his head can function just fine within the current model by controlling his fire. The main thing that's misisng is that normally the gunners are lone wolfing it which is not something that's done in real life. The machinegun represents THE most important part of your squad or platoon. Operated correctly they are your biggest casualty producing system. The squad leaders and platoon leaders emplace MGs and tell them where they want them before they do anythng else.

If you are a rifleman swanning about looking for something to do you should tag onto your gunner and support him. Give him ammo but also cover him when he's in position and reloading. Then you will see an exponential rise in the effectiveness of MGs without changing a single line of code.

Think about it, even in games today, normally, when an enemy MG is firing it draws the attention of everyone. Either they are trying to knock it out to get the advance going or you are going somewhre else to try and avoid it.

Los

Very well said.

One thing to add is that another major reason why gunners usually don't rip out long bursts (besides accuracy) is that tracers works both ways. Once an MG is spotted, it can be suppressed and neutralized. If I recall correctly from some reading, it was fairly common practice in WWII for German MG42'ers to have like 2-4 prepared positions for each MG. Thus, after they fired off a few rounds or were in postition for too long, then they could displace to their next postiton. If they ever fired off a fairly long burst, they would usually move right away.

Lets fix the MG42's accuracy/recoil at long distance!
 
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Yes that's so true.. While this goes for all firing positions iin general, in particularly with MGs and tracers. It's very tempting to sit in a good position even if somewhat exposed because one gets a few kills. But unless you have guys supporting ,you are basically sitting there with your pants falling farther down around your ankles due to the limited arc a visibility while deployed. Another argument for having riflemen in support.
 
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Wow enough with the tripod. The MG42 weighs on 11.5 kg on bipod and 32 kg on tripod (meaning the tripod weighs 20.5 kg by itself). A tripod is too unwieldy to simply be emplaced in the kinds of terrain featured in RO on a whim, let alone moving it every minute or so. A tripod is not needed, tweaking recoil and other attributes are. Now that thats over... I think this would give the Germans a huge advantage over the Russians puny 47 round DP. Maybe in the future it could be implemeted, but for now it would unbalance things.
 
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I'm not advocating a tripod before tweaking the characteristics of the MG, that should be done first. Maybe a future enhancement. But guys are asking for unrealistic things like larger ammo belts or stringing together multiple belts on the fly, when primarily what they are unwittingly compensating for is a lack of understanding on how to employ the MG effectively, current flaws and all. Anyone who's ever fired an MG ona regular basis for real would know that the current model is not too terribly off for the current ranges most engagements are taking place at in RO.

Los
 
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I would like to see a tripod implementation in a realism mod(such as Barbarossa).

If the MG-Assistant(new class) was near the MGer would be able to link all his ammo, as long as he was stationary, also, the MG-Assistant would cover for the MG and he would carry extra barrels.

It's a huge benefit. Just imagine being setup in a bad ass position with a schweres MG42 with 500+ linked rounds and an assistant covering your back.

Edit:
The Schweres MG42 would be carried by both men, the assistant would carry the tripod and the gunner the MG, it'd have to be deployed and at any time the gunner could disassemble the MG and carry it alone, leaving the tripod emplaced unless the assiant himself moved it.

It would use 250 round boxes, not less. It would also be as accurate to the real version as possible, none of this 50 meter maximum firing distance.

img35726pp.jpg
 
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Anyone who's ever fired an MG ona regular basis for real would know that the current model is not too terribly off for the current ranges most engagements are taking place at in RO.

Noo TOO terribly off, true. But still it's not quite as accurate as it should be, though this is mostly due to the insane recoil you get when bursting. Which is definately not realistic.

I have a harder time hitting targets in RO than I had in real life, which is quite odd since it's a game.
 
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Nifel said:
Noo TOO terribly off, true. But still it's not quite as accurate as it should be, though this is mostly due to the insane recoil you get when bursting. Which is definately not realistic.

I have a harder time hitting targets in RO than I had in real life, which is quite odd since it's a game.
IRL the MG42's effective range was around 1000 meters, ITG(in the game) its effective range is around 50 meters(even w/ single shots).

Anything you hit beyond 50 meters was only because you put 200 rounds in there, a single one was bound to hit something.
 
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kabex said:
IRL the MG42's effective range was around 1000 meters, ITG(in the game) its effective range is around 50 meters(even w/ single shots).

Anything you hit beyond 50 meters was only because you put 200 rounds in there, a single one was bound to hit something.

Effective range isn't the same as accuracy. I am quite aware of the fact that it is indeed accurate up to several hundred metres; with the MG3 I can hit soldiers 400 metres away after 2 - 3 bursts of 2 - 5 rounds per burst. Due to wind etc you need to have a few bursts to see where the bullets hit. Hitting people 1km away is rather hard irl though, at least with bipod only, though it is possible and I have seen it being done. The operator was an expert with the weapon, with years of experience.

ITG I can't really say how accurate bursts are due to the unrealistic recoil, but I don't think it's way off... I'll get back to that when they fix the recoil. Like I said, it's not as accurate as it ought to be and also that's it's harder to hit anything with it ITG than it is IRL. Fix recoil and accuracy and we are getting there. And make it useful when crouching and standing while we are at it.

What I do love about it is the authentic rattle and clanck when you reload and change barrels... Spot on!
 
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Ok people lets get more specific about recoil and accuracy (so as to get back on topic... again). After the patch I noticed the recoil was no longer crazy in the first second when firing like it was previously (even after the recoil part of the patch was rolled back I've had no major problems with the recoil). My main problem is the first few rounds recoil. The shots should be dead on (unlike now) because A) recoil doesn't affect the accuracy of the first shot (being that recoil is felt after the bullet has been fired and left the barrel) and B) The MG42's ROF is so high that the recoil isn't felt until probably the 3rd to 5th shot (guessing, someone fill us in if you have fired it, will settle for MG3), therefore those shots should be exactly where the IS is pointing. Now if we could please stay on topic, thank you.
 
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