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Bondarevo: what is PzIV with 75/L24 good for?

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Oleg Volk

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May 22, 2006
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#1
Under which circumstances would the low-velocity L24 gun of the early Panzer IV be better than the high-velocity 50mm of the PzIII? Does the HE payload have greater blast radius? The curved trajectory certainly makes the range estimation more critical...

What about APDS ammunition for the PzIII: does it have any down sides, or it is uniformly preferable to the regular solid AP?
 
#2
Well since the low-velocity is 75mm, its HE payload should be greater than that of a 50mm. The Panzer IV was originally designed as an infantry support tank, whereas the Panzer III was originally designed as an AT tank (though it started with a 37mm gun).

Also, APDS stands for armor piercing discarding sabot. This type of round gained a significant velocity increase, which for the most part also meant an increase in penetration. The only possible downside I could see is that since the round is now smaller, there might be a greater chance for it to shatter.
 
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#5
Oleg Volk said:
Under which circumstances would the low-velocity L24 gun of the early Panzer IV be better than the high-velocity 50mm of the PzIII?
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The PzIV F1 is the best infantry killer for Bondarevo and the PzIII doesn't have HE rounds. The PzIII is best for the anti-tank role.

What about APDS ammunition for the PzIII: does it have any down sides, or it is uniformly preferable to the regular solid AP?
Click to expand...
It's actually APCR "Armor Piercing Composite Rigid". It's more effective againsts T34's and KV-1's then the regular AP round.
 
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#6
First off, the Panzer III in Bondarevo has APCR rounds not APDS. The APCR rounds were made with a Tungsten core which gave them MUCH better armor penetration at close range due to the hardness of the Tungsten and extremely high muzzle velocity. The downside is that the Tungsten core was lighter and thus the round loses penetration power and velocity very quickly. All of this is reflected in the in-game performance of this round. So for close range the APCR is the better round, and for long range the standard AP is the better round. APCR rounds were only used early in the war, as the Germans ran low on Tungsten and had to use it for tools instead of tank shells.

Regarding the short barrelled panzer IV, its primary role is infantry support. In the map bondarevo, it is best used to bombard the objectives with HE rounds, which have a fairly large blast radius and are good for killing infantry. This will help keep sappers and PT-soldats out of the objective area.
 
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#7
I've also noticed that the 75mm L/24 is better vs the T-60 then the 50mm...
Or maybe that is just wishful thinking
If they're doing impact calculations in addition to penitration, then it should be that way, and maybe I'm just seeing things, but I seem to get more 1 shot kills with it vs the T-60 then the 50mm L/60

Wow, that's quite the run on sentance...
 
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#8
Depends on facing and range, but yeah it can be. If you crest over the hill and see a T60 at the bottom, you're likely better off with a PzIV loaded with AP rounds.

Generally speaking, early-war tank doctrine for the Germans split the roles into the anti-tank role (PzIII) and the anti-infantry role (PzIV). You're best off using the tanks to perform those roles. If I was in a PzIV, I'd be rolling in with the APCs, and load my cannon with HE rounds. Pop one or two of those through the windows of the farm or at corners at the village and you'll probably clear out a few infantry.

The PzIV 75/L24 will probably be most useful on a map where you have a full server of 32 people with a good balance of infantry and tanks. If you have a tank-heavy map, the PzIV won't be as useful.
 
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#10
[RO]Ramm-Jaeger said:
First off, the Panzer III in Bondarevo has APCR rounds not APDS. The APCR rounds were made with a Tungsten core which gave them MUCH better armor penetration at close range due to the hardness of the Tungsten and extremely high muzzle velocity. The downside is that the Tungsten core was lighter and thus the round loses penetration power and velocity very quickly. All of this is reflected in the in-game performance of this round. So for close range the APCR is the better round, and for long range the standard AP is the better round. APCR rounds were only used early in the war, as the Germans ran low on Tungsten and had to use it for tools instead of tank shells.

Regarding the short barrelled panzer IV, its primary role is infantry support. In the map bondarevo, it is best used to bombard the objectives with HE rounds, which have a fairly large blast radius and are good for killing infantry. This will help keep sappers and PT-soldats out of the objective area.
Click to expand...

Bingo.

(Although Sichartshofen did beat him to the punch)

The devil is in the details, people.
 
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#17
Heldentod said:
offtopic: i wonder if the camouflage scheme of the Panzer IV F2 is correct for the time setting of Bondarevo it has the same scheme as the Pz IV F2 on Arad and thats a 44 map, Bondarevo is a 42 so i doubt they have no changed their schemes within 2 years
Click to expand...

IIRC, the Pz4 on Arad has the 1943+ paint scheme (the tan/brown with the cammo lines) and the Pz4 in Bonda-rape-oh has the Panzer Grey color scheme for 1939-1942.

Both are correct.
 
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