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RO2: My Impression (warning, it's mostly positive)

We discussed this already - objectivy speaking the game is good piece of work, but for some it is not good enough when they comapre it to ROOst.​


His point of view is that he has got something fresh, really fresh and not the same thing served over and over again like COD did. And we - people playing RO2 - along with him. It is a paradox that people here complain about change in formula when we compare both situations when he complained about lack of changes in COD. It is as simple as that.​


He said that for him videogames like RO2 are to play it for fun, because he doesn't care about realism or historical accuracy and if people want to feel real war then they can go find one.​

While I disagree with statement that people discussing realism, historical accuracy, etc. should join the army I find this point somewhat fair in its meaning that games are just games and are made for fun.​

Problem is that many people can find fun in different things. Really hard games - like ARMA, Operation Flashpoint - are fun for me because they are as close to the reality as they can be. RO2 is fun for me because of the similar reason: when I crawl across the battlefield with the other people, talking to them what to do I sometimes feel great, before enemy sniper or machinegun takes my head off. It is different kind of a game. A good one.​

If he don't like realism, historical accuracy, and tactics, he shouldn't express his opinions about that. Because only people that want to increase the realism have the right to express their opinions. Everything else is just stupidity to increase this arcade rubbish even more. If it isn't fun for him - to bad, then he might just pick another game OR keep playing it as it is.
 
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If he don't like realism, historical accuracy, and tactics, he shouldn't express his opinions about that. Because only people that want to increase the realism have the right to express their opinions. Everything else is just stupidity to increase this arcade rubbish even more. If it isn't fun for him - to bad, then he might just pick another game OR keep playing it as it is.

*facepalm*

I hope that's sarcasm. It's surely a witty snark and I'm just failing to see the wit within.
 
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Cyper said:
If he don't like realism, historical accuracy, and tactics, he shouldn't express his opinions about that.
He never said that he doesn't like these things. He simply has no interest in them and want to play the game and have fun while doing so... Don't read something that has been never written in the first place.

Cyper said:
Because only people that want to increase the realism have the right to express their opinions. Everything else is just stupidity to increase this arcade rubbish even more.
No. Everyone has the right to have and express their opinions, even if for some they might sound stupid or rubbish. He own the game - or right to use it, nevermind - just as much as you do. Nobody here is to decide who has the right to speak or not.

Cyper said:
If it isn't fun for him - to bad, then he might just pick another game OR keep playing it as it is.
Same argument can apply to anyone. Even you. Remember that.
 
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I don't understand why some people want the game to be one hand or the other. Can't it just be both at the same time? I mean, tactical people just have to play on tactical servers, with tactical settings to the maximum hardcore A+++ values, and those who prefer it less realistic, play on less realistic servers.

TWI, just allow features to be configurable enough to please everyone. If you can attract more people from the mainstream to play on less realistic servers, you have more money for your developers team. So you can develop more stuff, for both groups (hardcore realism guys and more arcade guys).
 
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Firstly, to those who have supported me, regardless of whether you agree with my particular views, thank you.

After second thought, I have removed the "join the army" statement. It was a bit too much of a generalization and it was unfair and it distracted from my other, much better points. I'm sorry for that.

Cyper, I didn't mean to say I had zero expectations coming into this game, certainly for the past year or so I've watched trailers, read the latest updates, and kept up as much as I could with it, I just mean that I didn't have the same kind of expectations as past RO players had. I knew pretty much as much as there was to know about the game before it was available to play, so yes, I did have expectations and they were quite high relative to my expectations to other games.

Let me make it clear, I do like realism. What I don't like is a simulation. That's why I never got into ARMA or other similar games. What I like about RO2 is that it bridges the gap between arcade and simulation.

I do think it's important for a WWII FPS to be historically accurate as far as weapons available at the time, the strength and weaknesses of those weapons, and that all the technology and references are accurate to the best of our knowledge today. What isn't important to me is 100% absolute strict adherence to historic information, there is, and there should always be, considerations and compromises made for the fun and playability and replayability of a game. It's not about doing it exactly by the book, it's about doing it close enough to the book to provide suspension of disbelief.

Suspension of disbelief means I get lost in the moment because it feels real enough that I'm not sitting here questioning the practicality of the situation. This is indeed subjective and different for each person, so there HAS to be some sort of middle ground that we can all meet at. Sure, they can do Relaxed Realism, Realism, Hardcore ...perhaps they need to do Extreme Realism mode too to please their most ardent of veterans... but at the core of it all it's got to be a game that appeals to a larger crowd than just RO1 players.

The MkB is a prime example, I don't care that there are "X" amount of those guns in any given match... afterall, I come from Cod:UO where if everybody in a full 64 slot server wanted to equip one they could! ... but for the hardcore realists nothing gets up you guys' skin like this weapon does, but I'm going to use my bolt-action unscoped rifle regardless, because that's the way I've played for years, and I find it extremely satisfying to kill somebody with an MG or assault rifle with a single well placed rifle round. Knowing that there is some historical info supporting the fact that there were at least a few MkB's present in Stalingrad for the time period that this game covers, that's enough for me. Now, if there were irrefutable evidence that there were absolute zero MkB's anywhere near Stalingrad for the time frame of this game, alright then I might agree with you guys that it shouldn't be in this game. Of course, they'd have to change the cover art :) Now, don't twist my words around to think that I'm saying, "I wish that everybody in a match could have an Mkb because that's how CoD did it," I'm not, and I do like the way RO2 only allows so much of each class/weapon per team.... just a few more or less isn't going to make or break my day.

As a compromise, it would be nice if a server admin who wanted less or zero of any particular weapon, could change that setting without unranking his server. I'd personally love to see some rifles only servers.

Now, some of you have also pointed out the contradiction of my hatred of the way CoD changed, and criticizing you guys for hating the way RO changed. The point I was trying to make with that, is that's the way it goes in the gaming industry (and just about every other industry) and I had already learned that with BF and CoD, but it's just striking you guys now because this is the first full sequel of the RO series. I'm not saying don't complain to TWI for changing your beloved past time, I'm just saying that's something I've come to expect.

And finally, somebody asked me to be more specific about the things in RO2 I enjoy. Aside from a couple things I've already mentioned in this reply, I like the fact that even though this game has a leveling system, it's no where near as dramatic as BF or CoD type leveling. I also like how weapons aren't restricted to levels, only the upgrades for those weapons are acquired by leveling up. And the depth of leveling is quite complex when you spread it all out, which is pretty impressive for an FPS. All that said about the positives of the RO2 leveling system, I do prefer a more traditional FPS that doesn't include leveling up at all, but if I had to have one, I'd take RO2's over any other.

Other things I enjoy, little things like: bullet penetration, bleeding, no healing only bandaging to stop you from dying, sprinting melee charges, SOME of the auto taunts like the battle cry when doing the sprinting melee charge, guns & tanks with realistic advantages and weaknesses, the way a weapon will steady itself automatically if I just get close enough to something to "prop" the gun against it, classic server browser, classic dedicated server control, diving to prone, sprinting while standing or while crouched, the way you hold a pistol like a bada$$, full modding and customization support (soon), up to date graphics & physics, player movement feels as natural as any other good FPS, the importance of quick & intelligent team play to win matches.

Things I don't like: forced suicide if I try to change weapons/classes while alive, no "auto ready" function for respawning, no Capture the Flag and a general lack of variety in gameplay types, as a server admin not being able to mute players from their typed messages, no ability to sort server ad messages from public chat messages (text color would be nice), no kill or death log in the console (this helps a lot when trying to control TK'ing for example....yes I know server kicks automatically once it's done too much but admins should be able to take control as well whenever they are present), bugs that have been widely known about since the beta but that have not yet been fixed like the "can't melee proned players" or the constant screaming heard in the fields of Barracks, the defensive spawn points that are a mile away from the objectives and the inability to spawn on the squad leaders, not being able to choose which earned weapon upgrades are applied, the lack of scope in the game in general...meaning...it's just the battle of stalingrad, it's just Rusky versus Jerry, no other allied forces versus any other axis forces, no weapons/vehicles/equipment outside of the time frame of the battle of stalingrad (and before you rip me apart, yes, I'm aware the title is Heroes of Stalingrad and I was well aware of this before I ever got the game that it would only focus on this time period and these two countries, but that doesn't change the fact that I'd still like to see RO2's version of western front and all the other classic WWII battles).

But for all it's faults, it has more than enough pro's to make this game thoroughly enjoyable. And most of the faults are things that the developers can & will fix in time. Other things will be better once the SDK is finalized.
 
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I'm a tactical COD refugee myself from the UO days and I agree that compared to everything after COD2, RO2 is a dream come true.

However, even though I'm not a RO vet or a rivet counter, the gameplay choices the devs made pretty much kill this game for me. I got on tonight to play after being away for a month or so to check out the new patches and in a span of 5 minutes, was mowed down by a guy sprinting up to me with my trusty (rusty:D) bolt, hip shooting me with his MG34 as he danced past, then sprinting on. I respawn, move downrange and am promptly sniped by a pistol at over 100 yds. Um, really? MG34's a weapon of choice for QCB and pistols for long range? And they're effective in those roles? Any chance I have at immersion is just spoiled by people exploiting the limits of the game, endlessly running, insta ADS, essentially no fatigue, insta bandaging etc etc. You've heard it all before.

Like you, I could care less if insignia are authentic, but I want to feel some emotional response in the game, some tension, some fear for my virtual life, to feel like I'm part of a team fighting for survival. I just don't get that in RO2 and I think we should. To me, if feels like WAW, just with more features, animations and more realistic weapons, but the same mindless gamplay. The game itself has sooo much potential, I'm glad you like it and I don't think the version you like should go away, but I think there should be a version that I and it seems quite a few other people would like as well. That's harder, slower, grittier. Less twitch shooter and more teamwork and strategy. I honestly don't feel that TWI is that interested in making that version and I'm afraid the modders aren't going to be willing to invest the time either. We'll see....
 
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Don't discount the modders so soon, Lug, you've seen the mod forums right? They're already working on things.

And don't let 2 sorry deaths in a row kill the game for you. I'm sure you're just exaggerating though.

Fatigue would be very interesting. I could see something akin to suppression effects fading in as you start to run too long and taking a bit to wear off.
 
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If he don't like realism, historical accuracy, and tactics, he shouldn't express his opinions about that. Because only people that want to increase the realism have the right to express their opinions. Everything else is just stupidity to increase this arcade rubbish even more. If it isn't fun for him - to bad, then he might just pick another game OR keep playing it as it is.
Is this satire?
 
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I played a lot of Call of Duty: United Offensive, too. Great game.

RO2 often reminds me of UO. For example, one-man tanks, LMGs most useful to take killing pot-shots and not suppressing, and general run'n gun.

If RO2 was called United Offensive 2, there'd be no problem.

But I expected something different.
 
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And don't let 2 sorry deaths in a row kill the game for you. I'm sure you're just exaggerating though.

2 deaths don't get me down and I'm not exaggerating, it's just typical of the things that do get me down. I've done more than my share of time in RNG style FPS's and they just don't hold my interest anymore. If I was playing BF3, I wouldn't care and would play that way myself.

I'm a believer in the game itself controlling the behavior of players and not arbitrary rules like "crouch only" and "always ADS" like the Tactical COD servers I used to play on. The mechanics of the game in ARMA forces realistic behavior for example. You can't sprint around and Rambo because you get out of breath and aim like a drunk, there's inertia, your weight of gear and terrain affects your movement speed, so you can't sprint down corridors with a heavy LMG, turning on a dime and hipfiring. Same thing prevents insta ADS. It completely changes the way you have to play to be successful.

I was hoping and expecting to have a "Realism" mode in RO that provided more real world constraints like that. I don't expect it to be a sim, and I don't want it to be as complicated and hard to play as ARMA is, but I think that even within the constraints of the engine, most of those sort of mechanics are possible. That alone would drastically change the pace and style of RO2.

And check the activity in the modding section, the realism mods seem to be quietly dying......
 
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I care for realism when it improves immersion and gameplay. Beyond that I really have only a slight interest. In fact in Ostfront days we had a split between "gameplay" and "realism" people but now it seems even the gameplay and realism guys are on the same side

I just liked the tactical gameplay in Ost, and the player skill and little nuances to combat. Theres just a lack of depth and soul in RO2. Its getting better for sure, especially on realism servers with most of the HUD off. Just too many distractions though with leveling, obnoxiously unrealistic things happening before my eyes, bionic eye zoom, sprint and pull iron sights up without skipping a beat. The careful, punishing, seemingly authentic WW2 gameplay from RO isn't really there atm
 
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I don't understand why some people want the game to be one hand or the other. Can't it just be both at the same time? I mean, tactical people just have to play on tactical servers, with tactical settings to the maximum hardcore A+++ values, and those who prefer it less realistic, play on less realistic servers.

TWI, just allow features to be configurable enough to please everyone. If you can attract more people from the mainstream to play on less realistic servers, you have more money for your developers team. So you can develop more stuff, for both groups (hardcore realism guys and more arcade guys).

I don't think it's possible to have a genre with the label ''ALL''.

Regarding RO2 accessibility was not an extra feature it was forced upon everyone and on the expense of the hardcore mode.

The reason why TWI didn't make features configurable is very clear to me.

They didn't to it because they knew that the people that will be running servers are the most loyal fanbase a.k.a the people on this board. This would most likely mean that 99,99% of all servers would be completely hardcore and it would turn off the COD/BF players even more. Just look at this board. The clear majority seems to want the game to be more hardcore. Imagine if these people could set up servers completely to their likeing - that would be really, really far from BF.

That's how I see it. How else isn't it even possible to change a stupid settings such as no unlocks, perks etc, and no lockdowntimer?

This was obviously not a mistake or due to technical understanding. If one can create a game like RO2 It's perfectly possible to make it configurable. But they didn't. And there is a reason for this. Maybe exactly not what I wrote because that's just what I believe.


Since the mainstream gamers have hundreds of games to choose from that basicly plays out the same way It's better to do like BIS - give the mainstream the finger and do their own thing. When someone says accessibility on the BIS board people go wild. Yet this niche community is A LOT bigger than TWI's

If TWI want to continue to make the community stronger the must make a choice and realize that their game will never ever appeal to everyone. You can't appeal to the bf people, the roosters, the codies, the arma people, at the same time. This will only make an even smaller niche audience stick with the game. I wont say no if TWI want to make this into a fullblown tactical shooter or a fullblown arcade game. The most important thing is that I enjoy it and that I know what I will get instead of empty promises about a game that will appeal to everyone.
 
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Of course I don't come in with any of that RO1 baggage. I didn't have any expectations of RO2, other than a few hours of RO1 (which I never gave much chance to begin with) and a basic knowledge of who TWI was and how they came to be and their porfolio & reputation up to this point.
So you had no opinion... It's like if you bought the new COD and it was in space, and had lazor cannons, zombies, eyeball monsters and rocket jump. yeah we are pissed. you... you have no opinion in the first place so zip it.

There's a way to experience war for real, if that's what you're into, and it's called your local Recruiting Office, they'll be glad to show you what real war is all about.
We do not want to experience war for the most part. What we want is for the weapons to be done justice, modeled correctly, and operated realistically. The RO1 crowd for the most part are gun enthusiasts. We are the same group of people that made the switch from Quake to Rainbow Six (one of the first shooters to go tactical and try for realism)

This game has it's bugs, no question, but from what I've seen with all other TWI titles, there's nothing to suggest that they can't/won't fix what mistakes they've made and get this game to the greatness that it should be. I've been waiting this long for a CoD replacement, I can make do with what this game currently is, for a little while longer. Not to mention this game has VASTLY improved since Aug 30th.
That's why I continue to play this game and not worry so much. I'm confident Tripwire will do right by it's players like with RO1

I'm usually pretty harsh and critical when it comes to the games I play, but the level of negativity that constantly seethes out of these forums it's enough to make even me feel like a utopian optimist. So here I wait, not complaining.
That's cause as you stated earlier you have no opinion. you had no expectations for this game.
 
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The tank controls in ro1 were superb...I remember them saying they we're trying to make it more accessible in ro2..why? They were amazingly smooth and intuitive already...
.... forcing people to stay in tanks is one of the most awful changes ..just put a delay on it so people can't rocket out them..they butchered the tanks....a new damage modeling system was all they needed
 
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The tank controls in ro1 were superb...I remember them saying they we're trying to make it more accessible in ro2..why? They were amazingly smooth and intuitive already...
.... forcing people to stay in tanks is one of the most awful changes ..just put a delay on it so people can't rocket out them..they butchered the tanks....a new damage modeling system was all they needed


They have now a new damage model. It isn`t ping pong anymore.
When you use good teamwork and the tactic you can beat every enemy.
And the tanks looks superb.:) But the damage model can be made better.
 
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The tanks are very bad in RO2 i like it much more like it was in RO1.

The damage model is a bad joke, the controlling is so arcarde (where is my WASD turrer control gone?)
You can switch between HE and AP without reloading, and you can reload the Gun and the coxial (turret) MG at the same time. Your Reloader is a magican. He can reload with 4 arms and he know what ammo type you will need next.

There is only one good point about the tanks. They are looking good. But all other need a lot of love and work. :rolleyes:

Oh and of course the whole Tank-AI ruined the tank gameplay for me, too.



And today, after i have take a break of 3 days playing RO2, i was shocked.
I have played at 3 different server and everytime i was thinking "have i start the wrong game? why i
 
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So you had no opinion... It's like if you bought the new COD and it was in space, and had lazor cannons, zombies, eyeball monsters and rocket jump. yeah we are pissed. you... you have no opinion in the first place so zip it.

First off, excuse me?! We all have a right to speak our minds here, this isn't the RO1 Players Only club.

Secondly, please refer to my earlier reply to this post, which you obviously did not see: http://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/showpost.php?p=982545&postcount=25
 
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If you didn't have any expectations that pretty much explains it all: You standard was Null. For the ones who played the first game the standard was already set, the formula was already set. People did expect something.

Pretty much nails what most of the old RO players feels about RO2. Still, you seems to be critic to all the complaints on this board but at the same time you're negative to COD because there was no proper successor in terms of gameplay? This is precicely what people are critic to in RO2 on this board.

If you don't like historically accurate games, based on tactics - because ''It's a freakin' game'', or because you ''should join the army if you want realism'', then, don't come up with ideas on this board. Because these ideas will most likely be bad. Because RO2 is a tactical shooter. Tactical shooter would means that there is no other way to play it. Only the tactical way. If that isn't fun for you, to bad. Historical accuracy is important. The reason why this game got critized so much is because of the mainstream rubbish that were not just implemented into the game but forced for everyone to use. I really don't hope you see this as a COD: UO replacement (even though COD UO is an amazing game) because that would really turn this game into smelling garbage.

I see your post, started to read the same thing yet again, then it all ran together a little like this:

charlie.jpg

"WAH WAH WA WAH..... WAH WAH WAH.... Wu WA WAHH WAH"

To the OP, thanks for the honest view of the game.... you obviously had expectations coming into RO2.... you wanted a game to replace CoD and you wanted a decent and entertaining WWII "Video Game".... which you got.

And while Cyper rants on with his holy crusade against RO2 and Tripwire.... going on about how he's a vet.... so am I, and while I enjoyed the previous RO's, my only expectations for RO2 was exactly your own expectations.

I wanted an entertaining, fun, visually impressive WWII Video Game.

Cyper will go on about how RO is a "Tactical Shooter" and not a Game.....

NEWSFLASH:

RO started as a mod for a Video Game (UT2004)

RO1 was a stand alone, full version, retail Video Game.

RO2 is also a Stand alone retail video game.

They were all designed on Unreal Engines..... which are used for video games.

I didn't start playing the Mod because I wanted some tactical shooter or some combat simulator.... it was a video game that looked entertaining, original, and used elements other games didn't think of at the time. I continued to play RO because I found it fun and entertaining. It's also a good way to wind down once in a while.

RO fits right into my time slot for video games I play, it has similar controls and keyboard/mouse usage as the other FPS video games I own.

Something tells me..... *Gosh* It's a Video Game.

If it wasn't a video game, if it wasn't fun, and if all the aynal authentic-nuts had their way and turned RO into a Simulator, I wouldn't buy it, I wouldn't play it..... and chances are the majority of everyone else wouldn't either.... and Tripwire would be stuck with the same 25 odd players to pay their wages.
 
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