Tactics All right, I've had it. Just tell me how to use an AT rifle already!

[Sir Roderick]

I've been experimenting quite extensively on both the T-34 and the PzIV and I just can't get any consistent results at all. Sometimes the T-34 blows up for no apparent reason, sometimes I can't even seem to scratch the PzIV at all (though never the other way around). I've officially given up.

Where do I have to aim for the best results? What are the weak spots?

 

[Maj.Faux-Pas]

I've had very good results aiming for the view slits on the turret and the front of the turret itself. Sometimes a crewmember dies, sometimes the ammo detonates and instagibs the tank. Usually it takes 5-10 shots to kill the tank, which is very deadly, and perhaps unrealistic, but it works. Aim for the front of the turret IMO.

Nothing happens when I shoot at the armor plating on the side of the tank or the front glacis. Makes sense.

 

[LordKhaine]

I find the trick is to drop the AT rifle the moment you spawn. And use your new found mobility to better get in range for AT nades. At least on commissars, pavlov's and the factory I've had far more success tank hunting this way.

But for the times when you do have to use an AT rifle... Frontal shots are mostly useless, but a well place side or rear shot at the ammo or engine can really do the job nicely. The only problem is the enemy often won't present those sides to you. In that case I tend to shoot at the tracks and hope the guy panics and attempts to drive away. Then you can often get a side shot as he attempts to relocate.

 

[Sir Roderick]

I've had very good results aiming for the view slits on the turret and the front of the turret itself. Sometimes a crewmember dies, sometimes the ammo detonates and instagibs the tank. Usually it takes 5-10 shots to kill the tank, which is very deadly, and perhaps unrealistic, but it works. Aim for the front of the turret IMO.

Nothing happens when I shoot at the armor plating on the side of the tank or the front glacis. Makes sense.

I can't imagine getting that close on FF

By turret viewing slit you mean the cupola? Also I'd personally expect that if I fire beneath the PzIV turret from the side I SHOULD have a decent shot at the ammo stores.

 

[DesiQ]

The absolute best and easiest place to aim (as far as actual being-shot-at usage goes) is the side of a Panzer, in the middle and just above the track. Fire from a perpendicular angle, and you can penetrate right to the ammo and destroy the tank outright. My record is three shots into that region for an explodey catastrophic kill.

You can also fire at the side and towards the rear to hit the engine. This one takes more shots for a catastrophic kill; maybe five, maybe ten. Firing into the turret-hull seam also works, but can be unreliable. Have gotten catastrophic kills with anywhere from four to ten shots into that region.

I haven't had much luck firing into the rear of a tank (hard to see any landmarks on the hull to aim at), plus these are only likely to be mobility kills, which is not very helpful if you need to get rid of it right now.

There are some critical spots at the front of a tank, but I also have not had much luck there (firing into the viewport never did much for me, and neither did firing into the hull MG gimbal mount, behind which there is apparently an ammo store).

But now we get to the important part: the best way to disable a tank with an AT rifle.

On a server that has aimbot hullgunners disabled, then this is quite simple: Your priority is to disable the turret traverse, and then to disable the engine. Completely destroying a tank is not desirable because it means two things: a) The tank respawns a few seconds later, and b) You are now five or ten cartridges poorer, and must slink off to resupply.

But if you simply disable vital components of the vehicle without causing so much damage that the commander can scuttle it, then the tank does nothing but sit there and look pretty. You kill the turret traverse, and the cannon and coaxial MG have a very narrow field of fire. You kill the engine or the tracks, and they won't even be able to maneuver to use the hull MG. If your team understands this, then they can leave those tanks unharmed and steamroll the enemy, who is now without close support.

So TL;DR: approach tank perpendicularly from the side, aim at the turret-hull seam until the turret no longer turns, and then put two or three into the hull towards the rear of the vehicle to destroy the engine. Then tell your team not to even touch the tank over VOIP.

Oh, if you can, team up with some friendly AT riflemen and lay an ambush. I did this once on Red October with two other team mates: this Panzer was ripping our team up and we could hear it making its way to one of our caps. We set up on different sides of an open square and listened to it inch closer. The Panzer lumbers into view, we wait until it's in the clear, everyone starts firing in unison, and the tank is in flames less than two seconds later.

 

[Mekhazzio]

Where do I have to aim for the best results? What are the weak spots?

This is for the first game, but it hasn't changed much except to require a lot more precision on angles and add some other, less effective, weak spots. Your best bet for wrecking the tank is to hit one of the red boxes on the diagram. The front two are ammo storage, the rear is engine. Engine hits will produce reliable damage, but the ammo storage will have a much greater effect. One hit into the ammo storage can cripple the tank, two can potentially destroy it, but it will usually take more than that.

Complicating the issue is actually hitting those spots. The weak points are inside the tank itself, so you need to get the right angle to hit the internals rather than just aiming at a point on the side. The problem is that if you fire at too much angle to the armor, it won't penetrate, so even small changes between your position and the position and facing of the tank can make a big difference in what kind of damage you can cause.

Getting into a position where you can hit where you want at a sufficiently perpendicular angle can sometimes be impossible, so you have to go for what you can get. A penetrating hit on the Pz4's cupola on the top can kill the commander. Firing directly into the hull machine gun can kill that gunner and, with some sideways angle, potentailly go straight through into the ammo storage behind him too. The driver's vision slit can kill the driver, or hit the ammo behind him with a downward angle. Firing at the turret ring can jam the turret, but it is a very tiny area to land a hit on. Firing at the edge of the gun mantlet where it joins with the turret can kill the gunner and/or commander. Firing just inside the tracks from straight ahead or straight back will take out the brakes on that side, impairing their ability to turn, if you just want a mobility kill.

There's also a diagram for the T-34 but its armor model seems badly bugged and you can almost just shoot it anywhere and deal serious damage. It doesn't need anywhere near the precision or ammo expenditure that the Pz4 does.

 

[Sir Roderick]

Well, thanks for the advice gents. I'd hand out some rep bu I appear to be all out

 

[Field Marshal Rommel]

A penetrating hit on the Pz4's cupola on the top can kill the commander.

Not calling you out Mekhazzio but why is this even happening? Could a dev please explain why a 50 mm round armored cupola can be penetrated by an AT-rifle that does only 35 mm at zero degrees at its best? Could a dev also explain why the armored slits on the cupola do not function in game?

Firing directly into the hull machine gun can kill that gunner and, with some sideways angle, potentailly go straight through into the ammo storage behind him too.

Why is the armored ball in the ball mount not armored in the game. What is the reason behind this, devs?

The driver's vision slit can kill the driver, or hit the ammo behind him with a downward angle.

The driver's vision slit should be closed in combat rendering the AT-rifle useless in killing drivers. When it was closed the driver's KFF2 perisocpes were used. Darkest Hour (a mod) has correctly working Panzer III drivers slit with KFF2. Why is it in ROII that the driver's slit does not open/close and function like in DH?

Firing at the turret ring can jam the turret, but it is a very tiny area to land a hit on.

What about the turret ring guard that goes around the turret? Is this protection even fuctioning in game?:

 

[[SM]Fluttershy]

I've been in the same boat as the OP as far as where to shoot to achieve either crew kills or vehicle kills. Against the T34, It's not so bad as I'm achieving kill shots (crew/vehicle) against frontal armor and at undesirable angles whereas with the PIV, I pray it rumbles past my position so I can attack its side/rear. I've had great success against the PIV using the diagram a previous poster had posted albeit with at least 4+ shots at <50m ranges. More often than not, I find myself shot to death because of lack of team cover or because optimal firing positions on the PIV/T34 tend to put you in the open and as such, you basically have a giant "SHOOT ME!" sign above your head (figuratively, of course). It'd be really nice to see some updated diagrams for RO2:HoS in the near future but again, I do agree there is something fishy with how the T34's armor is functioning at present.

 

[Mekhazzio]

Of course, realistically, the PTRS shouldn't be doing anything to nearly any part of the tanks modeled in the game from almost any angle. Everyone even passingly familiar with the setting knows that. It's an obvious concession to gameplay, just like the pathetically weak grenades and artillery are. The AT rifle in RO2 is intentionally overpowered, just like it was in RO1, because without some sort of way for infantry to attack tanks, the tanks just roll around with impunity playing their own little mini-game at the expense of everyone playing infantry. That has no place in the innately limited and gamey nature of a small-scale MP shooter. You can't require heroic efforts to kill a tank when that tank is just going to respawn 15 seconds later anyway (something else that isn't very realistic, either )

Heck, the near-invulnerable tank wrecking the game for everyone on foot is already a pretty common sight, because while the PTRS -can- inflict damage to the Pz4, it's not at all common or easy, even in the hands of someone who knows exactly what to aim for. You tend to see more Pz4 kills by AT grenades, satchel charges, and mortars than you do AT rifles....and that's why this thread was born.

 

[Wookie87]

You tend to see more Pz4 kills by AT grenades, satchel charges, and mortars than you do AT rifles....and that's why this thread was born.

I actually like that more of the AT kills done by Russians infantry is via AT nades and satchels. It just feels 'satisfying'. I understand the frustration, though. I find it easy to kill T34 with AT rifle, where as the Pz4 i have had no luck at all. In the end i just gave up with AT rifles and rather assault it with AT nades.

Assaulting a tank in some areas is plain suicide however, especially if its supported.

I wouldn't mind seeing a greater availability of AT nades for the Russians, even if only Elite rifle can get *one* AT nade at a ammo stash. It maybe abit unbalancing though.

 

[Cpt-Praxius]

I'm trying to find some decent images online of the Panzer and T34's in-game so I can mark the spots I generally make impacts with the ATR, but can't find many good images.

The Panzer is a bit harder to get some good shots on, but there are some pretty good weak spots on both tanks.

Obviously shots in the rear of either tank is a great way to get some good hits.

Here we go.... these are the approx. areas in which I get most of my successful impacts. Results may varry:

I'm just going from memory at this stage and I imagine there are other areas that work well too, so by all means, feel free to revise these diagrams.

But the area I noted on both tank's front views, where I circled the areas of the inside tracks below the flaps (or whatever you call them) is a nice sweet spot that seems to penetrate almost every time on every angle.... you usually need more than one shot in that area depending on your distance, but you can do some good damage.

Aiming for the turret of the T34, especially when the barrel is aiming in your direction, is a nice spot to kill the commander and possibly blow up the entire tank. I've done this a couple of times on the Panzers, but can't seem to remember where I hit the last time.

Oh and that viewport on the Panzer (side view) where the driver is positioned..... I didn't mark it, but that's also a good spot.

 

[Spiderlok]

Re: Intentionally Overpowered Tanks

Re: Intentionally Overpowered Tanks

I play as an anti-tank rifleman a lot, and I find that once you get use to the weak points, you can score tank kills with little problem.

As long as your team have more than one AT firing at the tank, and are positioned at safer ranges/covers (difficult to be spot by the tank), the tank is gone. All you need to do is quickly unload all your rounds onto the weak points, reload, and repeat until the tank is dead. It's usually too late for tanks to pull out of a sticky situation due to their slow speed when driving in reverse.

I do think tanks should be slightly hard to take down at least. An anti-tank rifle functioning THIS well in WWII is so historically inaccurate it boggles me. It's better to have the infantry being inaccurately more well-equipped for anti-tank purposes than to have the tank be made be by cardboard.

 

[Cpt-Praxius]

I play as an anti-tank rifleman a lot, and I find that once you get use to the weak points, you can score tank kills with little problem.

As long as your team have more than one AT firing at the tank, and are positioned at safer ranges/covers (difficult to be spot by the tank), the tank is gone. All you need to do is quickly unload all your rounds onto the weak points, reload, and repeat until the tank is dead. It's usually too late for tanks to pull out of a sticky situation due to their slow speed when driving in reverse.

I do think tanks should be slightly hard to take down at least. An anti-tank rifle functioning THIS well in WWII is so historically inaccurate it boggles me. It's better to have the infantry being inaccurately more well-equipped for anti-tank purposes than to have the tank be made be by cardboard.

Tanks made out of cardboard were RO1's thing.... the tanks in RO2 are far more of a challenge I find.

I was playing FallenFighters TE a day or two ago and I kept taking out the Russian Tanker. It took 3-10 shots each time but took him out often enough to tick him off that the next time he came around he just drove straight at me until his AI MG'er mowed me down.

Guess I should have relocated.

 

[Mekhazzio]

But the area I noted on both tank's front views, where I circled the areas of the inside tracks below the flaps (or whatever you call them) is a nice sweet spot that seems to penetrate almost every time on every angle.... you usually need more than one shot in that area depending on your distance, but you can do some good damage.

Yeah, those are the brakes. A single shot will wreck the brakes on that side, every time, but it doesn't do anything else to the rest of the tank, even though you keep seeing penetration flashes. I tested it on a local server so I could see both the Pz4 and AT soldier at the same time. The brakes make a mobility kill easy but that's all it'll do.

Aiming for the turret of the T34, especially when the barrel is aiming in your direction, is a nice spot to kill the commander and possibly blow up the entire tank.

Yeah, this happens with high regularity. It seems bugged, really. Not only should the turret not be so easy to penetrate almost anywhere on it (especially compared to how hard it is to get through the ligher-armored Pz4 turret) but a single crew casualty shouldn't be making the tank self-destruct. The T-34's pretty busted in general.

 

[Devor]

I've been experimenting quite extensively on both the T-34 and the PzIV and I just can't get any consistent results at all. Sometimes the T-34 blows up for no apparent reason, sometimes I can't even seem to scratch the PzIV at all (though never the other way around). I've officially given up.

Where do I have to aim for the best results? What are the weak spots?

my experience from hunting tanks as well as driving them is that the T34 is easilly killed by shots to the turret, the armor seems to bebugged or siomething. The Pz IV on the other hand is virtually untouchable from the front. The only decent results I got was on side and back aiming on height of the tracks, though I have sunk 4 to 5 mags into a PzIV with just causing minor damage that way. I don't bother to aim for the turret on the IV.

 

[The_Cook]

the big flat end goes to the shoulder, the hollow tube end points at the tank, little bit of metal fang in a loop attach to the thing is called a trigger. squeeze that to make it go boom.

 

[Spiderlok]

The anti tank rifles definitely did not do as well in WWII. They were most prominent during WWI and early WWII, but as better armor are put on tanks, better antitank weapons were invented to counter that.

At close range, yea, could have good penetration on even thicker points, but
from over 120 meters against the front, or even slanted angles? Not likely.

I can't imagine what the situation for lighter armors (in future updates hopefully) would be like. Might be just like playing infantry, except for being 10 times the size and just as easy to get killed.

 

[LordKhaine]

The anti tank rifles definitely did not do as well in WWII.

Well they did very well in WW2. Just not against tanks (excepting the very early part, and against Japanese tanks). They saw much successful use vs lighter targets such as APC's and the like. Makes me wonder how they'll work when tripwire add an APC or other transport vehicle later on.

We can only hope it won't result in the same situation as RO1. In which tanks were easy to kill with an AT rifle, yet APC's required several hits

 

[Spiderlok]

Makes me wonder how they'll work when tripwire add an APC or other transport vehicle later on.

Exactly what I meant.

I don't know how TWI would balance between gameplay and realism, it's like walking on a thin line.