Wreck Likely That of Nazi Aircraft Carrier

[Hans_klempner]

What does the word Nazy mean?

It is used as an adjective.
Nazi= National Socialism believer.

However National Socialism is not what people mean by saying Nazi.
NS is a ideology in which people are extremely nationalist.

But when people say Nazi, they mean antisemitic, inocent children killer animals.

Germany was not Nazi. A country doesn't have beliefs, the people do.

Thus, calling a ship a Nazi ship is making no sense. A ship has no belief.

Can you hear the sirens? I think its the grammar police>
RUN! MOVE IT NOW!


ANyways, its a nice find.
I hardly know anything about the Graf Zeppelin...

Has GZ seen any action?

 

[Deathsai]

That's pure BS. You can't make nowadays germans responsable for what happened 60 years ago. Man, I don't know what more to say, it's just so ridicolous.

Agreed.

 

[Capt.Marion]

alrighty then, back to our friend the topic. The gerrys never used their carrier(s) because the Luftwaffe's CO (can't recall nor spell is name) didn't want to risk his men. They had the Bf109's all set up and ready to go, but ne'er did it happen.

 

[trench]

So the ship was completeled in 1938 and never saw action?
Surely - they could have refitted her for some other roll.
Am I the only one that thinks this is jsut a little odd?

 

[D3terioNation]

That's pure BS. You can't make nowadays germans responsable for what happened 60 years ago. Man, I don't know what more to say, it's just so ridicolous.

WTF??? How am I calling modern day germans (nowadays germans ) NAZI'S??

What a moronic statement

 

[Wolfstuka]

Ya the Germans had the carrier even before the war in Europe started and had all that time during the war to use it but didn't, its a shame really such a waste. Thats what happens when you have a bunch of school kids running the government.

 

[malice]

Imagin if the bismarck and this ship went around together, perma air cover.

 

[Gomer Pyle]

By 1943, Hitler had become disenchanted with his Navy. Raeder was relieved at his own request and D

 

[=GG= Mr Moe]

Yeah, the carrier was never completed, also plans to convert the 4th Hipper class heavy cruiser never was either.

From what I had read, Germany never really planned to be involved in a World War until the mid 40's...never thought England and France would declare war over Poland. By then, he had plans for a much larger (than he had) navy,

In the late 30's, the Germans were still behind in certain ways in naval architecture. As powerful as the Bismarck was for example, the Germans were not wise enough to put their main communications BELOW the battleship's armored deck. They were above it and did not benefit from its considerable protection. Hence, in its final battle with the battleships King George V and Rodney, communications were mostly knocked out early in the battle. This probably contributed to the Bismarck's inability to score any hits as the battle progressed. Even when the Bismarck was located on the ocean floor a few years back, initial indications were that no hits penetrated is main armor, and its destruction was probably due to the immense topside damage and fires as a result, then the scuttling. Even the torpedoes from the Dorsetshire appear to merely have 'dented' the main armor.

 

[DraKon2k]

WTF??? How am I calling modern day germans (nowadays germans ) NAZI'S??

What a moronic statement

Actually it's a good statement, but you're right, you didn't say anything about that, my fault. What I meant was that you should still respect the german soldiers which fought back then(no matter of you won the war or not, it doesn't make you any better people), just as we respect your american soldiers which fought just as bravely

 

[D3terioNation]

Ok fair enough but Im half English half South African

 

[Dr. Noobtard]

Cool we have a Voortrekker on the forums!

 

[Gwart]

That ship would have been meat if it ever was finished and made it out of port,look how far the German Fleet got in the Battle of Jutland.

Right up until the Atomic Age England and her Fleet has been a dagger pointed at Europe , mainly France and Germany though.

Possibly the main reason why ,of all the European powers of the past 300 years that England acquired such a large Empire,her navies basically had the key to the door.

 

[BuddyLee]

That ship would have been meat if it ever was finished and made it out of port,look how far the German Fleet got in the Battle of Jutland.

Right up until the Atomic Age England and her Fleet has been a dagger pointed at Europe , mainly France and Germany though.

Possibly the main reason why ,of all the European powers of the past 300 years that England acquired such a large Empire,her navies basically had the key to the door.

They should have deployed her, the Bismark, and the Graf spree together, then they might have stood a better fighting chance.

 

[Gwart]

The Royal Navy's pond-two bottleknecks- hence my dagger analogy.

The Navy was more than happy to let the Scharnhorst and Gneisenau back in.

This thread ideally should be combinded with the fancifull wet dream of Germany winning the 2nd WW thread as i believe the lack of a large surface fleet hampered Germany significantly.


That and the failure to beat the allies in North Africa-how different would the war had been if the Germans could have driven all the way through Egypt throught the middle east ->next stop India.

The timing of this would put the Japanese on the border of India also.

It would leave a very green US military in a very isolated position.

The British Empires answer to such catostrphic events is unfathomable,from being a dagger to a little fish in a very big Axis net.

Flee to Canada?- the U-Boat menace at its peak.

A fight to the last>?,the Home fleet sailing to a suicidal clash with a German Invasion force?.

Gas and Chemical weapons used to repel landings?.

One things for sure i will forever appreciate the sacrifes of the people who made the above NOT the reality and have given me the freedeom to type the above ramblings and what ifs.

 

[Vietnow]

Did the Germans even need an aircraft carrier? I mean, I can understand if they had beaten off the allies and then wanted to invade England (which you would pretty much need carriers to do) but the European theatre was, at the most, 90% ground war with very little sea engagements.


Now the Japanese needed carriers because most fighting in Asia was at sea, around little island chains.

 

[D3terioNation]

You are probably right that they didnt 'need' an aircraft carrier. No other nations needed an aircraft carrier in the European campaign.

...BUT...

In the North Sea, a german aircraft carrier may have come in handy! But who knows...

 

[Zbojnik]

Plan Z. The codename given to the re-equipment and expansion of the Kriegsmarine. They either had to options to

1) Create a force quickly of Pocket Battleships and U-Boats. Though they could not fight evenly with GB, a big threat to her lifelines was made.
2) A force of large striking power with Capital ships of the highest class who could not only attack Englands lifelines but pose a threat to the British High Sea's Fleet. However this would take longer to create.

Since Hitler assured Raeder that war would not start till '44-'45, the second option looked better. And that's where the Graf Zeppelin fits in. I think that if Germany just did the following,

1) Mass Produced the R.M.A.(R.M.B.) magnetic mine that moored itself on the ground and stayed their. Dropping many of these early in the war would have caused much chaos in British ports and naval bases.
2) Fix the torpedo's. If the U-Boats were operating with quality torpedo's from the start the war would definately look different. The damage they would have done to the British Fleet during the Operation Weser