A mod announcement, sort of...

[EchoJ7]

Well not wanting to jump the gun but here are my current planned projects that I hope to build for HoS. I aim to create a realistic modern warfare mod dealing predominately with recent conflicts eventually moving to cover (real and hyperthetical) operations from the 1990s onwards, the mod would come in the form of modules dealing with specific theatres or timeframes. The initial of these (and depending on there success) would deal with NATO and Coalition forces in Iraq and Afghanistan with the focus being on British/American marines & army and Canadian troops in the latter theatre. Development of other theatres would depend on interest and on the establishment of a dev-team. The emphasis will be on Coop, objective and AAS style gameplay, the hope is that they is room to create expansive maps that allow a degree of freedom and room for pilots, vehicles and support roles such as triage, artillery and transport (with rank based rewards).
In addition if HoS SDK can support advanced features then I would strive to recreate all modern features you'd expect eg. nightvision, thermals, IR etc. In the case of aircraft (again if do-able within the engine without being compromised) a realistic model will be developed for rotatory and fixed wing (and there appropriate systems).
The final item would be to re-create body armour in the most appropriate and immersive way (as not to become artificial or forced) and to give players a degree of customization in there uniform and weapon selection (Again based upon real world experiences none of this gucchi CoD style stuff) this may include mixed body armour, mixed camo's (Eg. US Army might have BDU/DCU gear mixed with ACU), chest rigs, head rigs etc. The aim to represent an body of soldiers who are part of the same unit at a glance but look much individual closer up. In the case of weapons the hope is to represent additions in a realistic way that effects combat performance without resolving to heavily on traditional gameplay buff/debuffs - eg. a frontgrip will not give you a 5+ aim boost but it might make it easier to aim after quick movements for close engagements.
A quick note about weapons, they will be pre-zero'd to there most effective range, for carbines and rifles this is generally 300-450m; thus the importance of roles and calibre become important.

Essentially I'm striving to create the most realistic shooter without it becoming bogged down by overbearing controls or mechanics; for example if possible I'd like ammo count to be down by having the "eyes" of the player forced to look at the chest rig to count the individual mags, but make it so its doable in a split second (so a minor special effect to subtly highlight the mags) in addition I'm not afraid to look to where other games have advance the gameplay further even there not necessarily part of the same genre such as mimicking Bad Companies destruction (if do-able) or using mechanics that are 100% game based (such as tagging a enemy to help with visual coordination). In the event that certain features cannot be created or represented in the manner desired then scripted, off-map functions will be created instead (this might concern air strikes, artillery and all air based content) Again to use these functions realistic measures would be undertaken (grid referencing etc).

I say this a maybe announcement because they are many unanswered questions about what is possible within the framework of the HoS SDK, I can't create a mod portraying modern warfare for example if nightvision can't properly implemented. Basically I have a list of criteria that unless matched would make any modern warfare mod unpalatable, the reason for this post is the garner interest and hopefully answer my own questions about what is possible.

To re-cap - A mod thats about modern warfare, recreates modern combat systems and is going to be objective & coop orientated.

 

[TrampledUnderFoot]

You could always try and test your ideas (night vision, IR, etc) in the UDK, in the meantime.

The character/weapon customization ideas are pretty cool. Thats always a big player draw. I'd wait to see how/if HoS does it, and expand off their model. It's been said that heroes will be visually distinctive, but I don't think it's clear exactly what that entails as of yet in terms of customization, or just set pieces as you level.

I think the realistic flight models aspect might be a asking a bit much of the engine, but best of luck with the project.

 

[Zetsumei]

Pretty much everything is possible and the sky is the limit. The question is what is your limit, what can you bring to a said modding team?

As much as I like to think up suggestions and ways to make ROHOS better in my view point, things must actually be created and that takes talented people.

If you aim for the sky you might never reach the roof. Be conservative and work towards milestones. Too many mods have died because of a feature list they would never be able to full fill.

---

Besides ROHOS allows you to adjust range on ironsights and magnified scopes, according to the first news that came out about ROHOS. So no need to fixate it at some range.

Anyway good luck, as any mod needs it especially in the startup phase

 

[EchoJ7]

Thank you for the kind words, if you'd like to ask questions or make suggestions please feel free to

A question that might be asked :
Why Afghanistan and Iraq? Why not the dozens of real and possible conflicts from the past 20 years and near future?

The plan is have a phased release system with the core the mod being very close to HoS - Once we are satisfied that the core is at a decent state with the necessary features the plan is to open the door for other developers to create modules based around specific conflicts, in addition within the modules earmarked by us would allow developers to create content for that specific theatre, not unlike the system used by the Project Reality team. In short, a team could approach us and ask to co-develop a campaign and content about the Aussies for example, to which (once standards are set) would happy to allow. To me they is little need for several mods that deal with the same subject! It's far more useful to share workloads and operate under a unified framework to avoid fragmentation (Case study : ArmA2 community)

The second but equally important reason for choosing them two theatres is they are the most recent conflicts and best represent modern combat, they also offer an excellent test bed. Borrowing the philisphoy release early release often I'd release a test build, one that would include two maps - a close urban and a medium/long distance with some urban fighting. This would represent a test bed to gather feedback and give players the vehicle to become active members in steering development, in the first build a handful of weapons would be made to test roles, ranges and the small details needed to fine tune gameplay. From there expansion would take place to encompass the full armouries of various NATO and Coalition forces (perhaps all) and there enemy counterparts.

 

[RoME]

Why not just add some modern weapons and modern character skins to RO HOS?

You keep maps and gameplay that comes with HOS. That would save a lot of time and effort. And from this base, you could add features you like later on.

That would bring a modern war mod pretty quick, and would give you a good idea of what could be better.

Just my 2 cents,

Rome

 

[smith1215]

When you say modern, do you mean the War on Terror and the War in Iraq or something completely fictional?

Anyway, good luck! I cant wait to see progress made on this mod!

 

[EchoJ7]

Why not just add some modern weapons and modern character skins to RO HOS?

You keep maps and gameplay that comes with HOS. That would save a lot of time and effort. And from this base, you could add features you like later on.

That would bring a modern war mod pretty quick, and would give you a good idea of what could be better.

Just my 2 cents,

Rome

It's certainly a good idea in the short term but it's not what this project aims to be, they already a few mods for different games that for all intents and purpose would qualify as HoS with modern weapons, in a manner of speaking.
The aim is to create a different experience to HoS and for the underlying gameplay to be fundamentally different, to what extent I can't really elaborate as I need to test first hand to see if its viable, I can say that the gameplay would centre around the concept of morale and teamwork.

Smith1215, the initial module would focus on Afghanistan and Iraq with the emphasis on coalition/ISAF forces other then the US armed forces (The US Army, Navy and USMC will be represented in time). This is for a number of reason already covered but the main is for the sheer amount of technical detail and research readily and easily available, however that said - A semi-fictional module will be worked upon to represent conventional warfare which later in the mod will be a focus with both fictional and real conflicts.
Playing as asymmetrical forces will be a completely different experience.

 

[Zetsumei]

Still take one step at a time. Don't try to jump too far right away as you might fall.

 

[Flogger23m]

Keep it simple.

An Insurgency - Realism RO Style would be great (what a lot of people hoped INS to be).


A good start, as others said, would be to just create modern weapons, player models, the maps, and some props.

Once you get the very basics in, you can try other things.

If you are going the Iraq or Afghanistan route, check the INS Suggestions forum. There were so many good ideas brought up for Insurgent style gameplay.

An example is make the teams asymmetric, unlike it is in RO (and how I think HoS will be like this).

For example, if you add the USMC in, their standard issue sight is the ACOG on an M16A4. No full auto, and you have to have magnification. This means the USMC team has an advantage at long distances, while the Insurgents have the advantage up close.


But, before you try stuff like that, just make sure you can even get the maps, weapons, sounds, animations, ect. in.

Best of luck.

 

[EchoJ7]

Thanks again for the wise words of advice but not to fret I've been part of mod teams before where they've aimed high but failed to deliver on the fundamentals, rest assured this won't be the case here!

On the subject of the Insurgency mod, I am aware of the ideas and suggestions, mainly because I tested it back in its pre-release days however while I can not commend the team behind Insurgency enough I would like my project to be distinctly different.

A problem for me in the majority of online shooters and action games is there a lack of cohesion between players (Clans aside) and tactics amount to rushing forward as fast as possible. Project Reality I suppose doesn't fit that mould but requires a lot of work to understand and properly play, which for a lot of people is off putting. I'm aiming for that middle ground, and no not dumbing down, but stream lining the process of command and control by making teamwork an integral part of gameplay.

The idea we are toying with is expanding the moral system touched upon by Tripwire so that (with a few exceptions) physically rushing forward or seeking individual glory will kill you. The idea is to create a stress system with each player being linked together by morale, the lower your morale the harder it is to aim/react and the slower you move, the harder it is to fight - squad leaders would give "buffs" to those around them in there platoon and fireteam. Commanders would give a constant stream of morale with his Regimental Sergeant Major acting as a moving source of inspiration to shore up flagging morale (An idea is to have him give inspiring words or simply if he kills a number of people / completes an objective in proximity to friendlies he inspires them)
Staying together within your squad therefor actually has meaning other then getting bodies on the objective, being within a certain radius gives your teammates a morale buff and vice versa, being close to your squad leader offers a mini buff.
Because of headsets and modern communication each player will be linked to his commander in a linear fashion, one thing I'm keen to avoid is if a player is separated from his squad he somehow becomes immobile because he is stressed, therefor the suggestion is to have radio's act as an invisible morale link with morale slowly sapping down (Can be paused momentarily by gaining kills, supporting etc) until he rejoins his squad (by moving to there proximity)
Exception to the rule would be snipers/spotters and any other role where acting alone is a plausible tactic.

Morale would be invisible with visible and audio cues, it wouldn't be a floating bar or hud element (not unless its needed) and would underline combat. Hopefully it'll be possible to have global and self morale, the latter as explained already with global morale being dictated by how effective the scenario is being played (Effecting the respawn time amongst of other things). To counter act the possibly of being stuck on a losing streak and unable to fight back because of low morale they would be temporary morale boosts and options to fight back (An idea is to have commanders being able to call in Reinforcements so all those dead will instantly re spawn).

Basically this system would translate in actual real terms to forcing players to work in teams, if your suffering low morale it might take that little bit longer to draw/ready your weapon, recover from moving quickly, a little slower to change stance or adjust position, breathing would be difficult so stamina and aiming is effected. Suppressing fire, snipers and targeting key players become much more important elements to consider but also staying alive and with your team. Racking up kills with your friends by your side will improve your score only marginally but will improve your team chances of winning.
As most maps will be objective assault and secure / coop taking objectives will be morale boosters and so on. Witnessing your team being killed or wounded, seeing enemy tanks without support etc. will knock morale subtly, on the flip side seeing enemy vehicles get blown up, friendly jets and helo's, healing / recovering a wounded teammate will all be morale boosters.

The hope is intertwine the heroes system so that higher ranked characters give better buffs / debuffs and/or become the only players who can play as squad leaders and team leaders. In addition if its possible I'd like to have situations where there are secondary objectives which make taking the main objectives easier/harder as well giving morale bonuses. Finally again depending on what can be modded, the hope is to have this system linked to the multiplayer campaign, with morale being effected depending on how well a campaign is being fought (especially if multiple battles are being fought simultaneously). If your team won there battle but the majority of the allies lost theres then you'd be on the back foot.

A note to add - Playing as religiously inspired forces such as Al-queda would have a different morale system, one that hasn't been explored yet in much depth. Role selections (so for example choosing the role of special/guerilla forces) would have a different self morale to compensate for there training/field of expertise.

But I must point out, until we discover if we can mod morale it would essentially be HoS in a modern theatre. Hopefully we can mod morale

 

[Flogger23m]

As for the "being by the magical squad leader = better aiming, running, more accurate ect." I am not a fan of that system at all.

Think of a sniper, or machine gunner, who shouldn't be up kicking in the doors with the rest of the team.

Will those roles be exempt from the moral feature?

 

[TrampledUnderFoot]

He explained in his post that an "exception to the rule would be snipers/spotters and any other role where acting alone is a plausible tactic."

I think it could be cool if done right, but it will take a TON of tweaking to get it so that it has an affect, but does not completely control the gameplay.

 

[Xendance]

Edit: nevermind xD

 

[smith1215]

No morale system please.