Tactics ideas for the new patch

[Anubis_FB]

well first off bring the level limit higher then 7, maybe like I dont know 10? Bring in another end boss for cryin out loud, when I was hearing about the new zed before I found out it was a husk, I was thinking it was going to be a new boss after pat or to replace him. Not really a need to add more weapons (I see lots of posts about new weapons, but if you want to add something, give something give the firebug something, or its insult to injury) and I know theres alot of the KF community that will diagree with me, but in reality how much has the game really progressed. Its getting worse as it goes, come on TW you need to check the feedback from the players.

Changes that can be made to the perks -
Berserker - increase damage resistance, increase melee damage, and add cleave
Commando -increase range of seeing invis increase damage AK/bullpup/scar and add penitration
Demolition -increase explosive damage, increase amount of pipe bombs that can be carried, reduce ammount of smoke produced
Firebug - increase ammo and increase damage done with flamethrower and grenades
Medic - increase synergy regeneration, reduce armor loss from damage taken and increase damage absorbtion of armor
Sharpshooter - Increase damage with Pistols/M14/Lar/Xbow, increase ammo and reduce reload time.
Support - (Changed to be a jack of all trades) Support will receive all the benifets of all the other perks that they have when they reach lvl 3. Will maintain the welding and the space that it can hold, but no longer has grenades.


Listing for the new Support Class
LvL 1 - increase welding regeneratoin and speed by 50%
LvL 2 - increase movment speed by 5%
LvL 3 - increase resistance by 5%
LvL 4 - increase damage armor can take 5%
LvL 5 - increase damage with all weapons by 2%
LvL 6 - increase movement speed by 10%
LvL 7 - increase resistance by 10%
LvL 8 - increase damage armor can take 10%
LvL 9 - increase damage with all weapons by 4%
LvL 10 - reduce the cost of all weapons by 25%

I could be wrong about the LvL 3, Its been a while since I took a look at what the perks do for each class, but like this but not really. Where the support will get something from each class, but that class with still have something that will be spacific to its own class.

 

[SMIFF]

id like a perk thats the jack of all trades, but dont change the support into one

Oh, and i really...REALLY dont want any more perk levels, level 6 was bad enough.

i would rather prefer to have a choice of what level number i use, i have level 6 sharpshooter, but i want to be able to choose level 3 for example.

so hard actually becomes hard again.

 

[nutterbutter]

LAst thing this game needs is stronger players. Game is easy enough as it is right now.

 

[Steg]

A new boss would be awesome, but fluff. New specimens would be better I think. I like the husk, he's such a jerk, more specs with different abilities would crank up the difficulty level overall to help balance out the new weapons. More ranged attackers, or new movement modes (high-jumping?) or camouflage (Zeds that look like teammates?).

Level 10 is a bit much. L6 Medic is 100,000HP. Keep scaling and it would be millions of HP for level 10. I'd rather they keep rolling out new perk levels and difficulty tweaks one by one, and taking a few patches in between to balance them.

The problem with buffing every class across the board is keeping the game from becoming too easy. Adding new zeds could fix most of that, though I bet there's people who would love to see a super-suicidal difficulty level.

Sharps need tweaking. A sharp should be good at one of two roles: clearing trash or killing hard targets. Conveniently, the sharp has 2 high end weapons, EBR and Xbow. So make the Xbow have less ammo or cost more to refill or whatever, so a Xbow SS focuses on the bigger threats. Put two (or more) bolts in the head of a Skrake/FP to take it down and save the team some damage. Or take the EBR, and pick off trash zeds and sweep the room, but be as ineffective vs the hard zeds as everyone else.

Other than fixing the sharpshooter (if only to stop the constant whining) I'd rather they work on the server and server browser. There's no reason to not be able to filter the server list better. QuakeSpy was a better browser and that was 13 years ago. Add to never-ping! Filter by Maps I Have! Filter by games under round 4!

I'm sure lots of people around here would love a 'progression server' setting, that filters perk levels based on difficulty. Normal: 1-4, Hard 4-5, Suicidal 5-6, whatever. Give server admins the ability to restrict perks if they want. Are you Mr. Perky but your friends on on Normal? No problem, but you'll effectively be level 4. Make it an option and people can run it if they want.

-edit-
This should get moved to Suggestions, not Tactics.

 

[Anubis_FB]

Shortly after posting this, I messaged the forms admin and requested it to be moved, still waiting.

Would be good if the fix what they currently have by adding things simmilar to the husk, but the support is almost a pointless class. He is only good for welding doors and carring things for everyone else (and I have a lvl 6 support that can be lvl 7) Demo took the place of the firebug, and commando is needed more then support. Im just looking for ways to fix the perks. Firebug is almost a lost cause, because nobody will give them a weapon. I would even be cool with a fire projectile that sets the player on fire. Only the fire bug can use it. If anyone else does, guess what FIRE DAMAGE, but that didn't go to well.

Anyway, these are just a thought. I would like KF to improve and imo the support has lost its luster. It started with the 100% pen with shotty, then they took it away, then to fix the double barrel glitch they get nerf bat again. AA12 was a step in the right direction, but its not enough, the support needs more then the AA12 to define its class.

 

[HaTeMe]

Support useless? Its one of the best perks imo, altho I rarely play it.

The only weakness it has is slow reload times on shotgun and hunting shotgun which makes it hard to escape from a group when you are surrounded. (Ive even died a few times on the FIRST level of suicidal with support just because I was surrounded and caught on reload, you cant take out the clots quickly enough when having to reload after each shot)

And I dont really want to see such drastic changes on the current perk system. If they were to add more levels, the rewards for leveling up should be minor but usefull, such as the smoke reduce for demo, resistance puff for zerker and flamer ammo capacity increase for firebug.

Why is this topic in the tactics category anyway.

 

[Anubis_FB]

Support useless? Its one of the best perks imo, altho I rarely play it.

The only weakness it has is slow reload times on shotgun and hunting shotgun which makes it hard to escape from a group when you are surrounded. (Ive even died a few times on the FIRST level of suicidal with support just because I was surrounded and caught on reload, you cant take out the clots quickly enough when having to reload after each shot)

And I dont really want to see such drastic changes on the current perk system. If they were to add more levels, the rewards for leveling up should be minor but usefull, such as the smoke reduce for demo, resistance puff for zerker and flamer ammo capacity increase for firebug.

Why is this topic in the tactics category anyway.

Ok, lets look at all perks LvL 6, now compair them to the usefullness compaired to other perks. Support is a perk that does crowd control, or at least that is my understanding of it. Now ppl will say there is no use for zerker, but good zerkers can save games with terrible players in them. Problem is Support has nothing to define itself, and that is what I was saying before. Its a support perk, but what is the support specialist supporting? I thought of it more as a perk reinforcment, so like all the trades mixed into one (jack of all trades). This would make the Support a Support perk and not another crowd control perk. Im still not seeing how you feel that its one of the best perk in the game, I can agree that the AA12 is a good weapon, but thats about it. Iv seen the support slowly digress to what it is now, and Im sad to say, If they wanted a shotgun based perk, support was not a good choice of words.

List from About.com Fire Support Specialist
A Fire Support Specialist is a member of the Army's field artillery team. Artillery are weapons that fire large ammunition, rockets or missiles to support infantry and tank units in combat. The Fire Support Specialist is primarily responsible for leading, supervising or serving in intelligence activities such as target processing for artillery units and maneuver brigades.

So in closing, IF, TW wanted this to be a Support specialist, it should be a artillery based. Thats kind of out now because of the Demo now tho. Thats why I threw in the Jack of all trades.

 

[Temstar]

Support's defining feature is that it's very good at both crowd control and single target damage, but only at close range. It's useless at mid-long range unless you carry out of perk weapon.

Support excels at dealing with situations that's about to get out of hand. He comes into play just as specimen's close in and dishes out very high DPS (scaled up by number of specimen) for a few seconds before all of his shotguns are empty. But those few seconds are often enough for the other team mates to finish reloading / healing / etc and regain control.

Support is also the best person for taking point when the team needs to move. When you're moving you're fighting at closer ranges and have less time to aim, shotgun is perfect for these moments as it works best at close range and is very forgiving in terms of aiming due to spread.

Support is not as good on harder difficulty levels because the best way to survive is to hold a position and camp the whole round. Most will pick a spot with long corridors where you can stay safe by keeping the specimens way back. Support is fairly useless in that situation.

 

[Anubis_FB]

Support's defining feature is that it's very good at both crowd control and single target damage, but only at close range. It's useless at mid-long range unless you carry out of perk weapon.

So basiclly if you have a SS/M14, or Commando you dont need support.

Support excels at dealing with situations that's about to get out of hand. He comes into play just as specimen's close in and dishes out very high DPS (scaled up by number of specimen) for a few seconds before all of his shotguns are empty. But those few seconds are often enough for the other team mates to finish reloading / healing / etc and regain control.

Demo can do the same thing here but better(Pattern?)

Support is also the best person for taking point when the team needs to move. When you're moving you're fighting at closer ranges and have less time to aim, shotgun is perfect for these moments as it works best at close range and is very forgiving in terms of aiming due to spread.

Support is a very slow class, unless all your carrying is the pump action or the 2Xbarrel. Would not be my first choice as a point man if the group is running.

Support is not as good on harder difficulty levels because the best way to survive is to hold a position and camp the whole round. Most will pick a spot with long corridors where you can stay safe by keeping the specimens way back. Support is fairly useless in that situation.

So as a lvl 6 perk Support would only be good in the beginner to normal difficulties? Hhhhmmmm. dont know if you helpin your argument much with what you been typing

 

[Temstar]

So basiclly if you have a SS/M14, or Commando you dont need support.

Commando is not good at single target damage. Yes SCAR have high sustained DPS, but it's burst DPS is only so so and you can only hit the full burst DPS at very close range due to SCAR's intense recoil.

SS/M14

Don't go there.

Demo can do the same thing here but better(Pattern?)

Demo is actually the worst class to bring a dangerous situation back under control, as all that smoke most likely makes a bad situation worse. Demo is good at mid-long range crowd control.

Support is a very slow class, unless all your carrying is the pump action or the 2Xbarrel. Would not be my first choice as a point man if the group is running.

I'm not talking about running like headless chickens or medic kiting a group by running straight pass them in a corridor. I'm talking moving as a group. Medic and berserker's speed is no good when you're moving in a group as you have to stay in some sort of formation rather than string out. Support with 2 shotguns is only marginally slower than the other 4 classes.

So as a lvl 6 perk Support would only be good in the beginner to normal difficulties? Hhhhmmmm. dont know if you helpin your argument much with what you been typing

It's not that Support is only good on beginner or normal, it's that Support is godly at close range but rubbish at anything not close range. Fighting at close range is perfectly acceptable on beginner and normal but not so much on hard and sucidal as the specimen do so much damage they kill you in two hits, thus on harder difficulties it's prudent to keep them at long range.

 

[Anubis_FB]

Commando is not good at single target damage. Yes SCAR have high sustained DPS, but it's burst DPS is only so so and you can only hit the full burst DPS at very close range due to SCAR's intense recoil.

Well, I was compairing to the AK, and but if you want to use the scar, ok. The SCAR, (If the commando knows what they doing) can take out up to husk in 4 shots. Even at distance.

Don't go there.

Lots of ppl hate SS/M14, they have lots of ammo with tons of power. Ill leave it at that

Demo is actually the worst class to bring a dangerous situation back under control, as all that smoke most likely makes a bad situation worse. Demo is good at mid-long range crowd control.

Im guessing you never had a good demo on your team. These learn to make panic rooms i.e. room to retreat to incase of overrun that go boom.

I'm not talking about running like headless chickens or medic kiting a group by running straight pass them in a corridor. I'm talking moving as a group. Medic and berserker's speed is no good when you're moving in a group as you have to stay in some sort of formation rather than string out. Support with 2 shotguns is only marginally slower than the other 4 classes.

You know if you get in groups like this where mid game you can move like this (from bunker site to bunker site), I am kind of jelious. I always get in games where the group wants to fend for themselves and leave others to die.

It's not that Support is only good on beginner or normal, it's that Support is godly at close range but rubbish at anything not close range. Fighting at close range is perfectly acceptable on beginner and normal but not so much on hard and sucidal as the specimen do so much damage they kill you in two hits, thus on harder difficulties it's prudent to keep them at long range.

Im not debating that the support can do damage, what I am debating is that because of the changes, its a usless perk the way it is, in the games current state. With everything in the game already, there are other perks that can do the job as good if not better (besides weld)

 

[HaTeMe]

Ok, lets look at all perks LvL 6, now compair them to the usefullness compaired to other perks. Support is a perk that does crowd control, or at least that is my understanding of it. Now ppl will say there is no use for zerker, but good zerkers can save games with terrible players in them. Problem is Support has nothing to define itself, and that is what I was saying before. Its a support perk, but what is the support specialist supporting? I thought of it more as a perk reinforcment, so like all the trades mixed into one (jack of all trades). This would make the Support a Support perk and not another crowd control perk. Im still not seeing how you feel that its one of the best perk in the game, I can agree that the AA12 is a good weapon, but thats about it. Iv seen the support slowly digress to what it is now, and Im sad to say, If they wanted a shotgun based perk, support was not a good choice of words.

List from About.com Fire Support Specialist
A Fire Support Specialist is a member of the Army's field artillery team. Artillery are weapons that fire large ammunition, rockets or missiles to support infantry and tank units in combat. The Fire Support Specialist is primarily responsible for leading, supervising or serving in intelligence activities such as target processing for artillery units and maneuver brigades.

So in closing, IF, TW wanted this to be a Support specialist, it should be a artillery based. Thats kind of out now because of the Demo now tho. Thats why I threw in the Jack of all trades.

So basically you are saying they named the perk wrong. That doesnt make it bad.

It might not be exactly the best perk in the game but its certainly not the worst. Imo it goes somehow what like this atm:

1. SS
2. Commando
3. Support
4. Demo
5. Medic
6. Berserker
7.Firebug

Actually, support is about as good as commando, because he can take out bigger guys more easilly. The only thing commando does better is picking up targets further away. Demo is worse than support for various reasons, medic cant cause any actual damage with his weaponary but is still better choice that berserker because of his speed and armor. Firebug is just generally bad perk due lack of ammo, damage and secondary weapons.

BUT

All that aside, I agree that Support Specialist doesnt really live up to its name. The only thing that makes it an actually support perk is the LAW imo, but in its current state the weapon is worse than the machete (which is useless).

Instead of re-building the whole perk, I think they could aswell rename it to something like Combat Engineer, and give the LAW to demo. I dont know why but many games seem to give shotguns for engineers, and the welding stuff seems like engineers job aswell. Kinda. Or I dont know.

 

[anthracy]

Medic should be third on that list. Armor + speed + syringe regen = can not die.

If anything, medic needs a nerf.

 

[HaTeMe]

Medic should be third on that list. Armor + speed + syringe regen = can not die.

If anything, medic needs a nerf.

Well yeah but I was thinking more of the "destructive power", medicgun doesnt kill things very well. That is, if you used perk weaponary only. Or I dunno its hard to put them in any order really, apart from the obvious ones like SS. (and even tho firebug and berserker might be more effective in battle than the medic, they are still too weak all things considered)

But still Id say support is more effective than medic.

Confusing - Yes

 

[omarfw]

levels should not go above lvl 6. you cant give noob level grinders even more to work with. you would just prolong the time before they max out their levels and uninstall the game.

this game is not centered around leveling and never will be no matter how much some idiots like to think it is.

 

[HaTeMe]

levels should not go above lvl 6. you cant give noob level grinders even more to work with. you would just prolong the time before they max out their levels and uninstall the game.

this game is not centered around leveling and never will be no matter how much some idiots like to think it is.

Its the way leveling works that creates this grinding fest. It should be based on achievements or something, so in order to level youd have to do multiple tasks, not just "do a lot of damage".

So for example, if they added levels above 6, it could be:

Berserker
- Kill X amount of scrakes with the chainsaw
- Finish X amount of fleshpounds with a melee attack
- Survive a long game on normal difficulty using knife only (or survive an X amount of waves using knife only)
- Kill a fleshpound on on normal (or hard) using knife/machete only
- Kill a fleshpound on hard (or suicidal) using katana only
- Kill X amount of crawlers in a row with a melee weapon without getting hit (basically training you to avoid the jumps)

Stuff like that. Defeating each achievement would either give you a full level up OR some percentage of a level, for example 20% of a level (meaning youd have to defeat 5 achievements to get a level up).

This should decrease the need for grinding wouldnt it?

Altho, I must admit it might encourage people to do stupid things, like noobs attacking fleshpounds with melee weapons and failing miserably each time.

 

[omarfw]

good idea

 

[No Glory]

Its the way leveling works that creates this grinding fest. It should be based on achievements or something, so in order to level youd have to do multiple tasks, not just "do a lot of damage".

So for example, if they added levels above 6, it could be:

Berserker
- Kill X amount of scrakes with the chainsaw
- Finish X amount of fleshpounds with a melee attack
- Survive a long game on normal difficulty using knife only (or survive an X amount of waves using knife only)
- Kill a fleshpound on on normal (or hard) using knife/machete only
- Kill a fleshpound on hard (or suicidal) using katana only
- Kill X amount of crawlers in a row with a melee weapon without getting hit (basically training you to avoid the jumps)

Stuff like that. Defeating each achievement would either give you a full level up OR some percentage of a level, for example 20% of a level (meaning youd have to defeat 5 achievements to get a level up).

This should decrease the need for grinding wouldnt it?

Altho, I must admit it might encourage people to do stupid things, like noobs attacking fleshpounds with melee weapons and failing miserably each time.

You sir, are on the right track! +rep!

 

[unwary]

Its the way leveling works that creates this grinding fest. It should be based on achievements or something, so in order to level youd have to do multiple tasks, not just "do a lot of damage".

So for example, if they added levels above 6, it could be:

Berserker
- Kill X amount of scrakes with the chainsaw
- Finish X amount of fleshpounds with a melee attack
- Survive a long game on normal difficulty using knife only (or survive an X amount of waves using knife only)
- Kill a fleshpound on on normal (or hard) using knife/machete only
- Kill a fleshpound on hard (or suicidal) using katana only
- Kill X amount of crawlers in a row with a melee weapon without getting hit (basically training you to avoid the jumps)

Stuff like that. Defeating each achievement would either give you a full level up OR some percentage of a level, for example 20% of a level (meaning youd have to defeat 5 achievements to get a level up).

This should decrease the need for grinding wouldnt it?

Altho, I must admit it might encourage people to do stupid things, like noobs attacking fleshpounds with melee weapons and failing miserably each time.

The part about completing achievements to progress perks sounds familiar. Like completing quests in World of Warcraft to level faster.

 

[YoYoBatty]

Lol increase power of sharpie weps my ***!