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Pistoleer Perk

handguns should have never been added to count for SS headshots....period. #1 cause that brought about the "SS overpopulation". every player has a 9mm, so why should 9mm headshot count for SS leveling when a SCAR or AA12 headshot doesn't? you can't "assign" a gun to one perk when every perk already has that weapon.

a pistoleer would be a good idea. handcannons are not needed as a SS weapon. the leveraction is essentially the tier1 weapon, crossbow/EBR at tier2/tier3.

9mm damage + Handcannon damage + (tier3 handgun) damage

benefits: more damage with handguns, carry more ammo, carry more handguns, maybe a laser?
 
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well if people are whining over what special ability the gunslinger might bring to the table, how about the ability to charge up and initiate a zedtime.

The game already has a charge mechanic and so you can just attach the zed time initiator to the alt-fire of all pistols. Then the zerkers and commandos can take over and extend it for the team.

This would make for a control feature to zedtime and increase teamwork for this new class as he could initiate it when lets say on wave 10 when the surge of 2 fp's 2 scrakes and 3 sirens behind them all come. idk how many times my team has died of foundry to that. This could help out the team pretty well and allow for the ss to line up that perfect headshot on the fp.

If people need some backstory on why a gunslinger has this maybe say that he has been practicing all his life to prepare him for the moment the bell tolls on high noon, to make his hand move ever faster and win each and every duel.
 
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image4zx.jpg


That's bigger, and looks so ****ing awesome that it chews your face off!

If a gun like this is chosen to be in the game *crosses fingers*, please ensure that it comes with a devastating gunshot sound to back it up. :)
 
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Not the worst idea ever, although I can't see where the perk would be useful tbh.

Pistols aren't very damaging as a rule of thumb, so using a Pistoleer to take out scrakes, fleshies and husks is a little out there. That leaves the perk as a crowd control class.

Hoooooooooowever - The commando has the high ammo capacity and rapid fire crowd control, the support spec uses penetration and single shotgun shots to rip through groups, the firebug weakens massive groups of foes rapidly with large AoE, the demo offers long range spread damage crowd control.

However you slice it the Pistoleer would not be able to out function any other class without making it unrealistic. I personally wouldn't mind a pistol class, it does have that aura of finesse about it, but sadly I just can't help but think the other classes would simply dominate the field. :(

You hit the nail on the head. The only reason this idea is getting support is because "it would be cool" and "the SS shouldn't have pistol boosts." That alone doesn't justify the Gunslinger's existence, especially if it's outclassed by other perks.

One option to make the perk somewhat feasible is to enable independant firing and reloading of pistols for each hand. You don't really need to "aim" with right-click when using dual pistols. So why not allow the right-click to fire the right gun, and left click fires left, so you could put a continuous stream of bullets downrange while alternating reloads between guns? (Alt-fire could be the aim button for akimbo pistols).

Reloading one gun while firing the other is not very realistic, but would bring a fun change of gameplay and give the Gunslinger a unique skill (don't ask how he does it). For rapid fire, you would click both mouse buttons quickly. A different game has this akimbo system but it's not very practical since it's a competitive PvP game, and generally better to spew as many bullets as possible. It would be a real option in KF however, since you see exactly what's coming and can anticipate when you'll need extra firepower.

Another option to make the perk feasible and badass is to give him a jacket with extra pistols so he could drop and grab new ones instead of reloading. If you're cool you know the movie I'm talking about.

I also agree with another poster that glocks/machine pistols are too SMG-like and would be treading on Medic/Commando ground.

A S&W 500 would definitely be the go-to tier 3 gun, being the most powerful production handgun in the world. It's possible to fire with one hand but you need to be a gorilla. It would be assumed that the Gunslinger is skilled enough to dual-wield these mighty weapons without straining his wrists. I pity the foo who gets repetitive work injury.
 
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@ Reise, the extra pistols in the jacket is mostly a joke, but the independant shooting/reloading for each pistol shouldn't be hard to code, and would give the Gunslinger a niche: continuous short-range firepower. No other class has this, since they have to reload or use melee. In my mind this is the best way to justifiy a new perk. You don't just create a whole new perk to give a certain weapon better viability, you need to fill a role that was previously nonexistant.

As for the reloading, if you shoot the left gun (left-click) without shooting the right gun, then you can hit R to reload the left while then firing the right gun (right-click) and vise versa. If you shoot both guns rapid-fire, then R reloads both at once.
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The problem I have is "Sharpshooter" implies long range accuracy. Yes a marksman could make great shots with pistols, but that still doesn't mean a .50 caliber Desert Eagle is going to hit a zed in his crown from 3 blocks away. Same goes for the 9mm Berettas.

Sharpshooters also have other weapons that capitalize on longer range, most notably the crossbow. It doesn't seem right to give them the advantage at close range with pistols, too.

I don't see why it can't imply short range accuracy as well. Nor do I see why Sharpshooters shouldn't have some advantage in close range as well as long range. Especially when, unlike a Commando or Support Specialist, a Sharpshooter cannot carry more than one of his long arms.

A SS cannot, for instance go Crossbow/LA, or M14/La, or M14/Crossbow.

He has to pick one. If he lost his 9mm and Handcannon, well, he'd be up **** creek without a paddle the moment he ran out of ammunition for his LA/M14/Crossbow.

A 'sharpshooter' seems, to me, the kind of person who mostly uses high damage, slow firerate weapons such as rifles (or a crossbow if you have to).
And no handguns.

I mean did you honestly think 'ah, this guys job certainly is to wield pistols' when you first heard this perks name?

Yes.

When presented with "Beserker, Commando, Medic, Support Specialist, and Sharpshooter" my thoughts on whom would have pistol specialization would center on the Sharpshooter.

handguns should have never been added to count for SS headshots....period. #1 cause that brought about the "SS overpopulation". every player has a 9mm, so why should 9mm headshot count for SS leveling when a SCAR or AA12 headshot doesn't? you can't "assign" a gun to one perk when every perk already has that weapon.

The addition of the 9mm is by no means responsible for the "Sharpshooter overpopulation", that's the M14's fault. No one would go Sharpshooter for a 9mm that's - gasp - twice as damaging (provided you hit the target in the head) at level five! A single body-shot from the AK-47 probably overshadows that and it has 30 of them (37 if you're a level 5 commando), which can be rapid fired.

The "Sharpshooter overpopulation" is a result of the M14, which is too good for it's own, well, good. You don't need to aim with it to be good, like the crossbow or lever-action.

Also if because everyone has the weapon by default means we can't assign it to a perk, shall the next update remove the knife from the 'zerker lineup? Remove the fire-nade upgrade level 3 firebugs get? Keep Supports from getting bonuses to 'nade damage, keep demos from getting explosives damage points from nades?

It's really a silly line of logic to follow.

Sounds a little too complex, robdude.

IMO just giving pistols better viability makes it justified. Right now unless you're a Sharpshooter you more or less ignore them.

I think pistols being ignored by everyone who isn't a sharpshooter is justified. Everyone else has a rifle, shotgun, grenade launcher, etc.

The only person who has cause to care about a pistol is the guy who's accurate with them. He's the only one who could make any use of them, and that's as a backup for when he's in a situation where his more precise, metholodical weapons aren't useful.

Crossbows and lever-rifles aren't, after all, prime CQC tools, while a pistol has some use in that department.
 
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The addition of the 9mm is by no means responsible for the "Sharpshooter overpopulation", that's the M14's fault. No one would go Sharpshooter for a 9mm that's - gasp - twice as damaging (provided you hit the target in the head) at level five!

The "Sharpshooter overpopulation" is a result of the M14, which is too good for it's own, well, good. You don't need to aim with it to be good, like the crossbow or lever-action.

I think pistols being ignored by everyone who isn't a sharpshooter is justified. Everyone else has a rifle, shotgun, grenade launcher, etc.

See, all those info are player-dependent. I have a friend, and although I can't confirm, he got MOST of his headshot count for SS with 9mm, because he ran out of ammo on his weapon, and had no time to reload. His SS level is 4.

Also, I think there was a "Sharpshooter overpopulation" before the M14 EBR was available. Mainly because of this.
 
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Wolfdust you're still missing the point of the whole thing, though.

I would like to see a perk added that allows me to use pistols exclusively. Right now we just don't have that.

I don't go and play Sharpshooter to dual wield 9mm handguns, I play it to snipe FPs and Scrakes. Pushing pistols in underneath the Sharpshooter perk simply doesn't fit in a realistic sense, or a gameplay sense.

The only person who has cause to care about a pistol is the guy who's accurate with them.
And I'm trying to change that. Sharpshooters after all, aren't prime CQC fighters in and of themselves (Excusing the M14). Why should they get an upper hand with handguns over other perks?
 
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Good point Reise, it makes a lot of sense to remove the short/mid-range pistol advantage from the long-range SS perk.

But again, a player would need more than powerful handguns to compete with the awesome short/mid-range firepower of the Support perk. He would definitely need to have extra capability of some kind. Independant, continuous firing/reloading between dual guns would be a step in this direction. It's a mouthful but simpler than it sounds.
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If he lost his 9mm and Handcannon, well, he'd be up **** creek without a paddle the moment he ran out of ammunition for his LA/M14/Crossbow.

Just this single point is enough to justify a removal of handgun from ss. No class should be able to handle situation from every range. Obviously you must sh!t in your pant once hell got closer, not draw your "fifty cal fun time" out and own everything with 16 shots before jump back and continue sniping with the crossbow.
 
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@ Bio666: Very true, for instance the Demolitions perk has a HUGE weakness at close range. Support is pretty useless from far range. Zerk obviously has no range. Commando is pretty good at all ranges, but this is expected from what SHOULD be the most versatile class (not the SS). The Firebug has a weakness against tough zeds and close range at low levels. Medic's weakness is weapon power.

BUT, the SS has no real weakness due to the M14 and xbow/Dual Handcannon combo. This should be fixed, and giving the pistol boost to a new perk would definitely help.
 
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At first i was like, "this is stupid idea"

After thought, This could work, but would probably never be inter-grated.

Sharpshooter is leveled on head-shots with sharpshooter guns, including the pistols. Would that progress be taken away if this perk ever came to be? Also, the head-shot bonus applies to all weapons so a sharpshooter will still own with the pistols due to there small recoil.

I doubt Twi would completely disassemble a long worked and loved perk just to add another one that will be nothing other than cool.
 
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Just play SS and use both dual pistols.

But, can you handle suicidal with dualies? Even at level 6, your only chance is to always hit the head. And you have to be REALLY, but REALLY skilled.

BTW, you're missing the point. Sure, if we wanted only to play with pistols, we'd do that. But do they shine among other weapons? Are they really that useful compared to M14 EBR, Xbow, and LAR? Why would an SS use pistols, when he can use those?

The point in this perk is to add a different gameplay type. The "Pistoleer" perk could have continuous fire - he'd never stop shooting - with the akimbo mechanics suggested here, and I think it's not too difficult to code.

It'd be a perk where the pistols would truly shine.
 
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Uh i know my post might seem not useful but the pistoleer should get zed time extensions since its kind of like bullet time and all like in the matrix. It needs more speed and quicker reloads. This perk also gets discounts off of all the pistols in the game right now and later. I'm just setting some of my ideas on the table.
 
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Sure, if we wanted only to play with pistols, we'd do that. But do they shine among other weapons? Are they really that useful compared to M14 EBR, Xbow, and LAR?

Of course pistols are not as useful, this is why rifles were invented and why they're universally better than pistols in every game that has a modicum of realism.

Why would an SS use pistols, when he can use those?

Why would anyone, indeed?
 
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