Hip shooting

[Reddog]

This is fast becoming one of those threads

Personally, it doesn't feel any different at all to me, and no blkmgc, stamping your feet and saying it has 'undoubtedly changed' doesn't mean it is true.

 

[Nimsky]

I think he's imagining things. I've never noticed any changes regarding sway and freeaim. There's nothing in the changelogs either.

Someone get Ramm in here.

 

[blkmgc]

Again, for the comprehensive impared

 

[Murphy]

Listen mate, you are either a troll or you haven't played RO yet. Nothing has changed. I just played, about 20 seconds ago and everthing was as it used to be.

Now stop talking about the discreditation of options, because there are none. Everything is normal except you and I doubt the devs can do much about that issue. j/k.

We still like the game because it is as it used to be, and if its different on your machine you might want to consult the bug report forum or the support forum to find help for your problem. Bring a vid that shows you playing your altered RO if possible.

 

[merder]

I've described exactly how its different, and how it can be tested (please read the entire thread), and I dont really see any similarity between tanks and rifles.So...

1- It has changed after the March patch, no doubt about that.

...Blah

If you have a suggestion to make things the way they were, fine post it.Its more than welcome, and conducive to a productive conversation about the topic. Otherwise your just trolling ,unless you have some proof that you cannot mark your screen and hipshoot like a CS kiddie in Red Orchestra.

Assuming the rest of what you said was correct, I'd agree with your second and third points.

The difference in subject matter between the thread I mentioned and this one is immaterial. You're just trying to impress us into believing you without actually presenting proof. You keep telling us to try it out for ourselves, but that is NOT our job. If you assert that hipshooting somehow changed since the last patch, YOU have to prove it did.

In any case, hipshooting is not something you can achieve at "50 to 100 yards" with any kind of ease, with ANY weapon, especially if the target is moving or is using cover. Only bots have been known to do something that crazy, and the last time I checked, most RO players aren't bots, nor do they hack extensively. Hipshooting is only really feasible under 50 yards for supression, and only deadly in the length or width of a regular apartment room, or small farm which is nowhere near 50 yards.

Going through the effort of:
1) Marking your screen with a sharpie
2) Calibrating your rifle to hit that spot
3) Repeating the calibration for every variety of bolt-action rifle held in several positions
4) Constantly repositioning your rifle in order to hit that precise dot (which may involve moving your view in odd ways in order to get the rifle to be positioned just right)

Sounds a lot harder to do than relying on instinct, or, god forbid, using your ironsights. You just can't hipshoot-snipe a guy 100 yards away who is letting a few pixels of his head (and maybe torso) peek out from behind a box. Well, maybe you could if you were disturbed enough to want to rely on that, but the hassle isn't worth it when your weapon comes with a built-in aiming mechanism.

 

[blkmgc]

Listen mate, you are either a troll or you haven't played RO yet. Nothing has changed. I just played, about 20 seconds ago and everthing was as it used to be.

Now stop talking about the discreditation of options, because there are none. Everything is normal except you and I doubt the devs can do much about that issue. j/k.

Lets see, when I started gaming you were...umm....8 or so. So thanks for adding to my ignore list yet again.Before I squelch you, please re-read my description, mow some lawns and buy an original copy, load it under a virtual drive or on a machine thats not connected to the net, and test as described. cya.

 

[Drapan]

Can't you put together a video (or any other actual proof) showing what you talk about. It's up to you too prove it, Untill then everyone is gonna keep saying nothing has changed.

 

[Reddog]

Again, for the comprehensive impared

If anyone here is comprehension impaired it is you my friend.

You have yet to provide one single shred of evidence that hip shooting has been made easier outside of 'because I said so' despite numerous requests for evidence from all and sundry. Saying 'it has undoubtedly changed' and 'a heap of guys who I won't name agree with me' does not qualify as evidence.

From what I can see here the vast majority of people of which I am part do not see any chage at all in the hip shooting between release and now.

To be quite frank in my opinion there has been no change at all and you're talking out of your arse.

 

[Tanuki]

I agree. I've not noticed any change, and I have also spoken to a fair few people in game who have not noticed a change either. In fact, your the only person I have ever heard talk about a change to hip shooting.

Then again humanity assumed the Sun rotated around the Earth until one man said otherwise. But Copernicus did at least offer some proof to his argument.

 

[Solo4114]

As has been pointed out, it's not up to us to convince ourselves. It's up to you. And the reason I asked for data is because, without it, ALL you have is anecdotal discussions. "I really think it's different now. So do some other people who agree with me." That's not proof, nor is it data. You've told me how I can reproduce it (put a sharpie dot on my screen and watch the bullets go there), but like I said, it ain't my job to do this.

You have offered no basis for comparison, no proof of any kind, only your general (and vehement) assertions. What's more, you've done it all with the kind of dismissive attitude that tends to undercut the effectiveness of your statements. People are going to be a lot less inclined to take your word for it, when in the process of giving your word you also insult them, dismiss them out of hand, or otherwise act like a jackass.

You want folks to believe you? Install an older version of RO, before the March patch that you say changed everything, and grab a video of hipshooting. More than just one shot, too. Then take a newer version of RO, post-March patch, and do another video of hipshooting. Assuming there actually is a difference, this will leave people saying "Wow. Undeniable, that is."

Alternatively, you can try to find the code in RO that controls hip shooting, and see if that code itself has changed, then post the results. It could be, for example, that the old hip shooting modification factor (or whatever controls it) was set to 0.02, and through some accident in coding, that got changed to 0.2. Or whatever.

Kind of like if someone came in here and said "The IS-2's armor has undeniably been weakened. I can kill it with a Pz III every time, and before the patch I couldn't", people would want to see the numbers showing that the armor had indeed been weakened.

Find those numbers and you'll convince people. Otherwise, saying "Look, you nimrods, just take my word for it" isn't exactly going to win you any converts.

 

[Drapan]

Btw, There wasnt any march patch if you would believe "Steam - Update News" (Right click Red Orchestra in Steam Games window then "View Update News")

[+] June 8, 2007 - Current Release
[+] May 31, 2007 - Summer Assault
[+] October 31, 2006
[+] October 5, 2006
[+] September 19, 2006
[+] July 27, 2006
[+] July 5, 2006
[+] June 22, 2006
[+] April 11, 2006
[+] April 5, 2006

 

[Murphy]

Lets see, when I started gaming you were...umm....8 or so.

This is about RO and not about your crazy adventures with your Atari2600.
Besides, who told you I wasn't playing games at the age of "8 or so"?

So thanks for adding to my ignore list yet again.Before I squelch you, please re-read my description,

Thanks, but no thanks. You posted it often enough and I already got it before. Contrary to popular beliefs, statements don't get any truer no matter how often you repeat them. Only your chances to find someone stupid enough to believe them increase over time, but that's not the same.
There is a difference between not understanding and not believing you know.

As for the ignore-list: You're not on mine, let me tell you that. Not because I could be bothered by what you post, but because your ramblings are amusing and even if you squelch me, I will continue to have my fun with you. With or without my input.

mow some lawns and buy an original copy, load it under a virtual drive or on a machine thats not connected to the net, and test as described. cya.

I have the game since its release and I played the mod since version 3.0 and never has the behaviour of the freeaim mechanism changed in a noticable way. Adjustments to free-aim speeds of certain weapons excluded.

So before you go on bragging about your age post a video of your anomaly.
It takes less time to capture one with fraps, downsize it with Windows Movie Maker and upload it to www.rapidshare.com than it takes to think of pseudo-evil messages you have to type with a deep red head.

As a general tip for you if you happen to end up in another discussion where people don't know you already: Use your grey cells rather than your grey hair when trying to make a point.

 

[blkmgc]

Any Devs care to comment ?

 

[[VFD]HH]

Well there was always that bug that let you center the free-aim. Maybe you just noticed it, its not to hard to pull off. I can PM you the details of the bug if you think this might be what your getting (I will not post them on this forum.)

Hell, your testing method might actually be giving you that bug now that I think about it.

I've never really been to concerned about free-aim working or not. The fact that hipshots (and hell, even in IS) your gun is centered a decent amount to the right of the center of the computer screen throws most people off. The free-aim just adds a little bit, but once you overcome the first barrier, one can hipshoot accurately 5-15 meters, and beyond that get close enough to give semidecent suppresion.

Anyways, I haven't noticed any chances. What people are saying is:
1) You claim there has been a change, you say you have evidence, but you have not provided any (pictures, videos) etc. You say it clearly shows this, but nobody here has seen it, and they do not know your testing method.
2) You say many people agree, but you have not had anybody else speak out on this forum yet.

This makes it look like the ramblings of a single person. Whether it is or not is impossible for the rest of us to tell.

 

[Jokerman]

I did a simple test- put your finger where your gun is or where you think the middle of the screen is (Im not gonna be bothered by drawing ON the screen), turn fast left or right and you can clearly see the gun is no longer where it was and no way it could possibly point to the center.

And if the shots were to hit the center it will be against intuition or instinct and surely against what experienced players are used to, so I think we could tell if there was a change.

 

[killaer]

Again, for the comprehensive impared

You fail to actually PROVE anything at ALL. We understand that you a group tested it. Fair enough. But you give no EVIDENCE. I'm sorry, I haven't really noticed a difference. I have never had anyone shoot me by marking their screen, as far as I know, and if they have, I don't realy care since it hasn't effected my gameplay whatsoever. As far as I see it, you're just talking out of your *** on this one. I don't understand why you continue to ignore everything that EVERYONE SAYS TO YOU. When someone asks for a tiny peice of evidence, you scream "NO, I TESTED IT WITH A GROUP SO I'M RIGHT." Not only do you fail to tell us who this group is, but I haven't seen anyone but you actually talk about this in this thread.

You have proven nothing at all

And to your earlier posts, don't assume that people go to RO to "Get away from games like Call of Duty" Perseonally, I think that's bull. I'm not an annoying eletist like you who brags to others that "When I was gaming you were 8" because that doesn't really prove your experience in knowing about this problem in red orchestra at all. Furthermore, I not only enjoy playing Red Orchestra, but also Counter Strike:Source, Day of Defeat, Battlefield 2, and other more fast paced and not realim shooters. Don't assume that you're better than others in any way by playing RO, and please for the love of god don't say "CS kiddies"

 

[[5thW]Rehakles[TRO]]

1) Free-aim hasnt changed, even more so as there wasnt a march patch as somebody stated.

2) There is no possibility to give you "two options to choose from" coz the free-aim never actually has been changed....as far as I know the free-aim is one of the few things that hasnt been altered in a patch yet

3) Thats fine, Im using a bolt from time to time as well

If you have a suggestion to make things the way they were, fine post it.Its more than welcome, and conducive to a productive conversation about the topic. Otherwise your just trolling ,unless you have some proof that you cannot mark your screen and hipshoot like a CS kiddie in Red Orchestra.

Nodody can suggest anything to "make thing the way they were" coz they

 

[602RAF_Puff]

I had posted a thread a while back asking for the same as Blkmgc...but for a different reason, hipshooting is killing the immersion factor in RO for me.Trying to play RO tactically, only to have guys running round killing from the hip consistanly can be annoying { usually leading to me leaving the servers } Historically guys did not run around using bolts, smgs { except smgs to clear rooms }firing from the hip, if the devs could put an OPTION into the server side to allow a more realistic immersive experience , in my opinion, that could only make the game more enjoyable over a wider range of clients.
Alternatively the score for kills could be removed?..when I started playing RO { back in beta 1 for the mod } there was no score for kills, only capping areas got you points. Perhaps an option in server for the removal of kill points would make for tactically immersive gaming with RO.
I didn't buy your game,I dont control your mouse and I certainly can't tell anyone how to play RO, but by adding these into server side options I could CHOOSE where and how to play RO...hopefully with no hipshooting { well maybe only close range smg room clearing } and only scoring with the caps { thus stoping the score junkies who usually do most of the hipshooting }
What do you guys , and hopefully Devs , think of these small changes being incorperated into the server side options.

 

[blkmgc]

I had posted a thread a while back asking for the same as Blkmgc...but for a different reason, hipshooting is killing the immersion factor in RO for me.

As it is for a lot of folks looking for realism Puff. Once you get it set as described, Its not all that different from anything else out there in that regard. An option for the old way would restore the uniqueness of the game imhf course there are plenty of other servers for those who like it the way it is.

 

[Kaneohe]

As it is for a lot of folks looking for realism Puff. Once you get it set as described, Its not all that different from anything else out there in that regard. An option for the old way would restore the uniqueness of the game imhf course there are plenty of other servers for those who like it the way it is.

Show us, don't tell us.