How Does the community feel about officially adding THE BRUTE?

[masteriamamind]

All this talk of balancing and miscellaneous raging at the new update made me think. The core of most arguments is that the game will become too easy. All that could change by simply adding the brute. That monster is a serious buzz killer!! No more kiting! Head shots are difficult. Camps can be broken into easily. Displaces player position. The brute is tough, hits hard , fast(it will rage asap) and has enough sense to protect its head while moving! The only zed that has a higher "kill this &^%# right now!" level is a siren. Tell me fellow zed slayers would this be enough to bring back the ouch factor in kf?

Brute link is here: http://www.wolfpackclan.com/modules/newbbex/953-18-the-brute-vfinal.html

 

[Spicy]

Emphatically yes.

It'll increase reward and make us really feel like we've really done something when we get a map acheevmint.

Good thing it's white-listed. :]

 

[C_Gibby]

No.

If it's rare, then maybe.

Don't forget that KF is a defence game and not a kiting game. Sure it'll break up kiting, but when you can't defend anymore... then what the **** is the point? You have a zed put in place to make it so you can't run and can't hold out. It should at least be possible to headshot it.

 

[Swift-Brutal-Death]

No.

If it's rare, then maybe.

Don't forget that KF is a defence game and not a kiting game. Sure it'll break up kiting, but when you can't defend anymore... then what the **** is the point? You have a zed put in place to make it so you can't run and can't hold out. It should at least be possible to headshot it.

I agree about at least being able to head shot it. I enjoy more zeds but generally when this one runs at me on a decent difficulty I just know I have to take a hit and there's nothing I can do to stop it.

 

[C_Gibby]

I agree about at least being able to head shot it. I enjoy more zeds but generally when this one runs at me on a decent difficulty I just know I have to take a hit and there's nothing I can do to stop it.

Exactly the problem, it's an unfair ZED. Sirens and Husks are bad enough and they damage defensive play if they get their hit in, at times it can prove fatal. IF they get their hit in. It can be avoided with a quick bit of sharpshooter magic, that's what makes those ZEDs balanced.

But why make taking the fatal hit completely inevitable? Sod that.

Here's what I think. I think the brute can be added in and have a good place in the game. I mean, it's a new ZED! Everyone seems to want a new ZED in game! But it must not be as common as the siren/husks, and it must be vulnerable to headshots. I'm okay with it having solid health as it places emphasis on the need for sharpshooter/support players or ganging up on ZEDs, but as it stands, the Brute has virtually no weakness.

It should have a weakness against headshots, and possibily being burnt.

 

[Gartley]

The point of the Brute wasn't so much to punish the campers per say. It was designed as something that could get close enough to be a threat on a locked down position. And he's far from invincible. And there are some very solid tactics for taking him down. He just can't be snipped easily from a distance.

You can still head shot him from the side, you can aim for the lower body and kneecap him, you can rage him to get him to drop his guard when close and blow a hole in his head. FBs are effective against him. And so on.

I do agree the frequency should be lowered a tad. And come in a wave or so later.

If not the Brute then the Shiver who is an excellent zed as well.

 

[C_Gibby]

The point of the Brute wasn't so much to punish the campers per say. It was designed as something that could get close enough to be a threat on a locked down position. And he's far from invincible. And there are some very solid tactics for taking him down. He just can't be snipped easily from a distance.

You can still head shot him from the side, you can aim for the lower body and kneecap him, you can rage him to get him to drop his guard when close and blow a hole in his head. FBs are effective against him. And so on.

I do agree the frequency should be lowered a tad. And come in a wave or so later.

If not the Brute then the Shiver who is an excellent zed as well.

Yes to having the frequency lowered and appearing later on.

But isn't headshotting zeds sideways-moving zeds one of the harder things to do in the game due to the hitboxes? I'm not sure if I approve. It's bad enough with gorefasts. Also how are FB's effective? I didn't know that they were, do they slow him down or do more damage or something?

 

[Slappy Cromwell]

No more kiting!

How does the Brute discourage kiting in any way? If anything, the Brute helps kiting players as his (very weak) punch actually knocks his target further away from the rest of the zeds.

Anyway, the Brute doesn't successfully fill any role and by no means should he be officially implemented in the game. His main gimmick of blocking his face from a distance is supposed to hurt Sharpshooters, but Sharpshooters learned all you need to do is bait the Brute into attacking (he's even kind enough to sprint ahead of his zed friends so you can deal with him solo) and then insta-kill head shot him at close range when he reveals his head to punch you. Supports can use the same tactic with their shotguns or even expend some of their extra ammo capacity on the Brute's exposed lower body to take them out at a distance. Berserkers simply have to crouch while attacking since it negates the Brute's knock back. Demos utterly demolish Brutes with no extra strategy required.

If anything, the two classes the Brute really hurts are the Commando and Firebug, and they certainly have a hard time already. Commandos don't have a quick, massive damage dealing attack like Supports or Sharpshooters, so they need to either waste a lot of precious ammo on Brutes with body shots or waste a lot of time taking punches to fire on the Brute's exposed face. For Firebugs, the Brute's head is resistant to fire damage (why?) and they don't flail around and lose their target when they crisp up. As such, Firebugs also need to waste a lot of precious ammo as well.

But that's not even the worst of it. The most terrible aspect about the Brute is that his puny charge damages other specimens. Although the damage was decreased considerably from Fleshpound-gibbing levels, it still results in a single Brute inadvertently aggro-ing tons of specimens that happen to be in his path. This results in massive zed infights that bring the game to a grinding halt as it forces the team to find out where the Brute is engaging in battle with six Clots and four Stalkers in a crowded hallway/stairwell thus blocking all other specimens behind them. And if that weren't bad enough, the Brute's attack is bugged when used against other specimens so that it doesn't actually do any damage to them. Seeing a Brute lose a fight to a single Clot is both really sad and quite unintentionally hilarious.

 

[Left 4 Dinner]

I would ony want to see brutes in the game IF and only if they spawn like scrakes and fleshies (AKA, only a few spawn and very spread apart). As for the shiver, I havent played againist that one. IMO, its not really that special. Yes it has a ability to teleport short distances, pretty fast, but if you have a good enough aim, you can take it out with ease.

 

[C_Gibby]

words

hm

well I guess that wraps that up.

unless the brute gets an assload of changes, I don't think he can be reliably implemented.

 

[FluX]

Plain no (no offence to the authors) as I hate the Brute. Shiver I will say HELL YEAH to with a health change.

 

[C_Gibby]

Plain no (no offence to the authors) as I hate the Brute. Shiver I will say HELL YEAH to with a health change.

I am dumb and lazy, can anyone explain the shiver to me? All I know is that it's a new trash-tier ZED, which I find appealing.

 

[Left 4 Dinner]

I am dumb and lazy, can anyone explain the shiver to me? All I know is that it's a new trash-tier ZED, which I find appealing.

I think the shiver is some type of trash zed that is small and thin, and can teleport short distances at random times. And it moves it head like the guys did in the "What Is Love" paraody from SNL with Jim Carrey

 

[Gartley]

Still seems everyone is divided on the Brute, it's a lot like Marmite, you either love it or hate it.

And of course it needs an update, just look how the IJC weapons got overhauled.

The Shiver is like the clot but with a teleport/fast move attack that gets him in your face.

 

[Splatpope]

How I feel about adding the brute ?

I feel like ****.

How I feel about the fact that it's obviously going to be added ?

I feel hopeless.

 

[Gregs2k2]

I still think the Brute needs to be a kamikaze style zed (we don't have any of these in game). Has a pipebomb or 2 strapped to his chest or areas that require skill to detonate at a distance. Failure to detonate results in..... a bit of a mess.

Although I imagine there are tons of potential pitfalls/balancing issues with this. But I feel some kind of kamikaze zed would really spice things up. And of course, make him/her a rare occurance in the game.

 

[C_Gibby]

I think the shiver is some type of trash zed that is small and thin, and can teleport short distances at random times.

That's actually pretty cool!

Does he teleport sideways, forwards, or a combination of these?

 

[Major Liability]

The only ways I'd ever be happy to have that thing in the game is if the following conditions were met:

1) You can fully dismember him like a Dead Space necromorph, no more arms of steel

2) The knockback from his attack is GREATLY reduced

 

[Left 4 Dinner]

That's actually pretty cool!

Does he teleport sideways, forwards, or a combination of these?

It mainly teleports forward, but if its aggr. is drawn to another player, then I suppose it could go sideways, and then back to going foward.

heres a simple video with it

Killing Floor - Shiver (new specimen) - YouTube

 

[Morari]

I could take or leave the Brute. I think that his charging ability could stand some rethinking. I'm also not too fond of the way he looks. I think he looks far too organic in comparison to the other specimens.

On the other hand, I absolutely love the Shiver!