Why so much arguing?

[Homuth]

What many of you fail to realize is there is only going to be ONE available. There is only ONE person who will be able to use it at any given time. So out of 64 players, ONE will be armed with an MKb42.

ONE!!!

Secondly, as it's a hero weapon you won't see any heroes for at least the first month. Even then few people will attain that rank as quickly. You are not going to see heroes armed with scoped MKb42's in every server on day one of release.

While there was only probably a handful of them, for a couple hundred thousand soldiers who were at Stalingrad, even one is out of the ratio, so that 'there's only ONE' argument is not really making sense on a 64 slot server. The only argument is: It was there. Well I can live with that, although it's representation is out of the ratio.

 

[Lucan946]

I want to add one more thing, it seems like TWI really tries to piss certain people off by including the Mkb.42 in nearly every media outlet.

haha I noticed that too. It cracks me up. I actually really do feel like the German ninja screenshot was meant to make people angry

My only fear is that I won't be able to play in a realism server here in the US, because there aren't any and the only relaxed servers will be 24/7 bologna... but we'll cross that bridge when we get there!

I doubt you'll have to worry. I have little doubt there will be plenty of realism servers, European and American.

 

[Unus Offa Unus Nex]

Regarding the German "ninja", it doesn't look like a balaclava to me, and that simply because you can clearly see that the entire forehead is uncovered. It's simply a German toque pulled up over the mouth & nose to protect against frostbite, just as the two guys below:




Furthermore I own one of these toques myself, and mine has such a long neck piece that you can actually pull up together so far in both directions that you'll have only a small slit for your eyes, and STILL there is enough fabric to keep the neck covered. Putting on a helmet will keep it perfectly in place.

 

[heady89]

What many of you fail to realize is there is only going to be ONE available. There is only ONE person who will be able to use it at any given time. So out of 64 players, ONE will be armed with an MKb42.

ONE!!!

Secondly, as it's a hero weapon you won't see any heroes for at least the first month. Even then few people will attain that rank as quickly. You are not going to see heroes armed with scoped MKb42's in every server on day one of release.

Where did anyone post that there would be only one ?
On a 64 slot server that would be really few, i'd guess more on 3-4.

 

[Hannula]

ONE!!!

One is too much for a game that should be realistic.

TWI is not destroying their game in anyway, instead they're opening up the possibilities for everyone. They won't add every single gun that was used in the battle, simply because it would be unpractical and take a huge amount of time.

They've stated the reasons for including the mkb42, atvs etc now live with it and if you don't like it you can disable them. Why is that so hard for you to grasp? Simply run a server or join a server that has mkb42 and avts or anything else you don't like disabled.

Original red orchestra mod and Ostfront was dedicated for people who are looking for ultimate realism (atleast in the limits of that time) i think it is stupid to get new players interested by adding guns which havent been in other WW2 games. Yes, there will be servers which will disable hero guns but i still dont understand why people need them. It is so much cooler to be elite with K98 or mosin nagant than using gun which was only at prototype level and propably had some failures just like AVT40, im pretty sure that failures of those guns wont exist in game.

 

[Uffz.Juschkat]

There's a fine line between maintaining semblance of historical accuracy, and having to be so anally retentive about it you might as well say "YOU GUYS CAN'T WIN THIS MAP, WE'RE SUPPOSED TO WIN IT HAPPENED!"

I just can't understand how people who are so knowledgeable in the field of history can be so utterly dense when it comes to applying it, and degenerate into childish brats who demand satisfaction and entitlement.

Ok let me see if this will work,

I've seen what TWI devs are trying to do, that is implement realistic game mechanics on how a person reacts to the environment including weapon handling, functioning ect. And to be as historically correct as possible.

For some people, they are experts on graphic designs and can give input on how the game looks and if it will effect gameplay, such as shadows, lighting, ect... Then there are others like Grobut that are experts on weapons like the Ppsh-41, and he brings his information to the table in order to help TWI get it right. Then there are people like me (who normally have German surnames) are experts on the characteristics, uniforms, tactics, and history of the German army of WW2. It is something we are passionate about, and we have experience because we actually use the historically correct stuff that we constantly talk about. Therefore when we see something that is inconsistent with historical facts, we give our input (such as the forest green parka or the togue that looks like a balaclava because it wasn't modeled correctly.) This is to help TWI get it correctly.

It seems to be though that when we put our input in, it immediately gets ridiculed for being way over the top... That some how pointing out minor uniform details that are inconsistent with historical facts is a travesty and that our input on the historical correctness of certain uniforms is over bearing and disrespectful. Now before I continue let me make a point.

Arguments and inputs, I am showing two different examples:


A: "Hey this isn't correct... TWI is retarded because they can't get it right even though they say they are "historically correct"... You're an idiot, you don't know what you're talking about because you don't have the knowledge and experience that I have therefore what you are saying is utter crap. The game should be made this way, and this way only because that is correct!"
Or
B: " I am having a problem with "x" because it is incorrect due to "fact a" and "fact b". It is my experience that problem "x" should not be included because "stated evidence or experience" says otherwise. I understand that problem "y and z" can be turned off due to server settings, but I have a problem if problem "x" cannot be turned off.

The problem is, when an actual history buff states argument B, they are subjected to ridicule and instantly dismissed. This in turn makes that person mad which leads to Argument A to be stated and leads to massive problems.

All I'm asking for is a little respect, and understanding. Just because you are not passionate about it doesn't mean that I need to be dismissed and mocked because you don't understand where I am coming from. Now maybe you're not talking about me but some other disrespectful person-persons in these forums, but many respectful "realism fanboys" have been mocked and dismissed because they mentioned a problem that cannot be fixed by server settings. Its not right to blow what they are saying out of proportion like your comment. Again I am in no way saying that "all the German uniforms are wrong this game is dumb if they don't make the uniforms like cookie cutter uniforms it is incorrect". Infact its quite the opposite. The only time the Germans had "cookie cutter" uniforms was in Sept 1939 when they all had apple green helmets, M-36 tunics, M-36 stone grey pants, and no Y-straps. I have simply suggested that they mix up the uniforms for the time period within historically correct parameters, and get rid of stuff that isn't correct on the uniforms... That is in no way saying that I want "cookie cutter" uniforms and I don't expect that people who don't research this stuff would know that, but I do hope they wouldn't be disrespectful to my concerns about what I have studied and researched for years.

And just as a disclaimer, I have only had one problem with one uniform and we all know which one... Other than that the German tunics look very AWESOME... Just wish they'd throw in officer-NCO-enlisted men differences.

-Thanks for your understanding

 

[Uffz.Juschkat]

Regarding the German "ninja", it doesn't look like a balaclava to me, and that simply because you can clearly see that the entire forehead is uncovered. It's simply a German toque pulled up over the mouth & nose to protect against frostbite, just as the two guys below:
Furthermore I own one of these toques myself, and mine has such a long neck piece that you can actually pull up together so far in both directions that you'll have only a small slit for your eyes, and STILL there is enough fabric to keep the neck covered. Putting on a helmet will keep it perfectly in place.

Unus, look at my Sig... I am the German on the left... What is around my neck? You guessed it right... A togue, and while I am not wearing it like its -30, the model in the picture clearly looks different than the other two pictures that you have googled. I'll tell you what, when I get home I'm taking some pictures of me with a balaclava and with my original togue... You WILL see the difference.

 

[dsi1]

I really don't see the point of arguing realism in a game that can be modded to your smallest desire, if realism clans don't like the original release they can make a realism mod, as simple as that.

Now then, if this game was being developed with modding out of mind (BF3) then arguing like this would be understandable, but it isn't, so it isn't.

 

[MrHat]

All I'm asking for is a little respect, and understanding. Just because you are not passionate about it doesn't mean that I need to be dismissed and mocked because you don't understand where I am coming from. Now maybe you're not talking about me but some other disrespectful person-persons in these forums, but many respectful "realism fanboys" have been mocked and dismissed because they mentioned a problem that cannot be fixed by server settings. Its not right to blow what they are saying out of proportion like your comment. Again I am in no way saying that "all the German uniforms are wrong this game is dumb if they don't make the uniforms like cookie cutter uniforms it is incorrect". Infact its quite the opposite. The only time the Germans had "cookie cutter" uniforms was in Sept 1939 when they all had apple green helmets, M-36 tunics, M-36 stone grey pants, and no Y-straps. I have simply suggested that they mix up the uniforms for the time period within historically correct parameters, and get rid of stuff that isn't correct on the uniforms... That is in no way saying that I want "cookie cutter" uniforms and I don't expect that people who don't research this stuff would know that, but I do hope they wouldn't be disrespectful to my concerns about what I have studied and researched for years.


-Thanks for your understanding

I have read most of the "other" thread and this one and it seems to me that few are arguing with the message that some like you have concerns about the historical accuracy, they are generally objecting to the way some have voiced those concerns. Please stop playing the victim.

 

[Uffz.Juschkat]

I have read most of the "other" thread and this one and it seems to me that few are arguing with the message that some like you have concerns about the historical accuracy, they are generally objecting to the way some have voiced those concerns. Please stop playing the victim.

I'm sorry I haven't made it clear, but there are other threads (not just the "other" one) that I have been attacked for being "too realistic". I am in no way trying to be a victim, besides that I was responding to someone. I also understand that many "realism" people have acted irrationally, and I cannot speak for their actions, but my own, and try to help people understand where I am coming from.

To the other person who said I should mod these things- I wouldn't have a problem with it if I knew how to mod, or even had time to mod. Therefore I am stating what is realistic... If its ignored then whatever I'll go about my merry life.

 

[Zennousha]

Ok let me see if this will work,

I've seen what TWI devs are trying to do, that is implement realistic game mechanics on how a person reacts to the environment including weapon handling, functioning ect. And to be as historically correct as possible.

For some people, they are experts on graphic designs and can give input on how the game looks and if it will effect gameplay, such as shadows, lighting, ect... Then there are others like Grobut that are experts on weapons like the Ppsh-41, and he brings his information to the table in order to help TWI get it right. Then there are people like me (who normally have German surnames) are experts on the characteristics, uniforms, tactics, and history of the German army of WW2. It is something we are passionate about, and we have experience because we actually use the historically correct stuff that we constantly talk about. Therefore when we see something that is inconsistent with historical facts, we give our input (such as the forest green parka or the togue that looks like a balaclava because it wasn't modeled correctly.) This is to help TWI get it correctly.

It seems to be though that when we put our input in, it immediately gets ridiculed for being way over the top... That some how pointing out minor uniform details that are inconsistent with historical facts is a travesty and that our input on the historical correctness of certain uniforms is over bearing and disrespectful. Now before I continue let me make a point.

Arguments and inputs, I am showing two different examples:


A: "Hey this isn't correct... TWI is retarded because they can't get it right even though they say they are "historically correct"... You're an idiot, you don't know what you're talking about because you don't have the knowledge and experience that I have therefore what you are saying is utter crap. The game should be made this way, and this way only because that is correct!"
Or
B: " I am having a problem with "x" because it is incorrect due to "fact a" and "fact b". It is my experience that problem "x" should not be included because "stated evidence or experience" says otherwise. I understand that problem "y and z" can be turned off due to server settings, but I have a problem if problem "x" cannot be turned off.

The problem is, when an actual history buff states argument B, they are subjected to ridicule and instantly dismissed. This in turn makes that person mad which leads to Argument A to be stated and leads to massive problems.

All I'm asking for is a little respect, and understanding. Just because you are not passionate about it doesn't mean that I need to be dismissed and mocked because you don't understand where I am coming from. Now maybe you're not talking about me but some other disrespectful person-persons in these forums, but many respectful "realism fanboys" have been mocked and dismissed because they mentioned a problem that cannot be fixed by server settings. Its not right to blow what they are saying out of proportion like your comment. Again I am in no way saying that "all the German uniforms are wrong this game is dumb if they don't make the uniforms like cookie cutter uniforms it is incorrect". Infact its quite the opposite. The only time the Germans had "cookie cutter" uniforms was in Sept 1939 when they all had apple green helmets, M-36 tunics, M-36 stone grey pants, and no Y-straps. I have simply suggested that they mix up the uniforms for the time period within historically correct parameters, and get rid of stuff that isn't correct on the uniforms... That is in no way saying that I want "cookie cutter" uniforms and I don't expect that people who don't research this stuff would know that, but I do hope they wouldn't be disrespectful to my concerns about what I have studied and researched for years.

And just as a disclaimer, I have only had one problem with one uniform and we all know which one... Other than that the German tunics look very AWESOME... Just wish they'd throw in officer-NCO-enlisted men differences.

-Thanks for your understanding

Except those would be all fine and dandy if you were whining over a Single Player campaign that follows a recreation of the events in Stalingrad. Multiplayer is not this case. These are differing, dynamic battles that take place over a specific time period and location. If you took the same battle and tweaked it slightly differently each time, probability would dictate eventually you'd see things like this. Rarity doesn't matter. If there's a possibility that it could be in, it fits for multiplayer. Otherwise, as I stated before, we might as well concede certain maps because "the Germans didn't win here!"

 

[heady89]

One is too much for a game that should be realistic.



Original red orchestra mod and Ostfront was dedicated for people who are looking for ultimate realism (atleast in the limits of that time) i think it is stupid to get new players interested by adding guns which havent been in other WW2 games. Yes, there will be servers which will disable hero guns but i still dont understand why people need them. It is so much cooler to be elite with K98 or mosin nagant than using gun which was only at prototype level and propably had some failures just like AVT40, im pretty sure that failures of those guns wont exist in game.

The original red orchestra had several authenticity errors as well, yet that doesn't make or break a game. This however isn't even authenticity errors, instead they were just used in small numbers.(mkbs,avts)

Here is the big issue. You make it quite clear that you only care about your own play-style and opinion in regards to how the game should be played, it's honestly none of your business if folks wants to play the game in a different way, especially not since the game allows for tweaking, modding and changing options.

Your argument would only be valid if TWI was enforcing a play-style with heroes , mkbs etc without any server-sided options or abilities to customize the game to your liking, that would've been an issue sorta like 90% of todays games.

 

[Hannula]

The original red orchestra had several authenticity errors as well, yet that doesn't make or break a game. This however isn't even authenticity errors, instead they were just used in small numbers.(mkbs,avts)

Here is the big issue. You make it quite clear that you only care about your own play-style and opinion in regards to how the game should be played, it's honestly none of your business if folks wants to play the game in a different way, especially not since the game allows for tweaking, modding and changing options.

Your argument would only be valid if TWI was enforcing a play-style with heroes , mkbs etc without any server-sided options or abilities to customize the game to your liking, that would've been an issue sorta like 90% of todays games.

Of course i only care about my own play-style! I don't want new players from COD or BF to destroy this great community we have, you see how retarded these communitys they have, 12 year old kids yelling into cheap mic words like 'omfg i ownd ya serioysly bagfiafsd bla bla'.

I see that TWI wants to get new people interested about RO2, but adding unrealistic elements is not the way. I though RO2 was the game which will fix some problems that Ostfront had and make game even more realistic and fun with cool features.

Would you buy the game if they would add clowns with M249's n sh*t?

 

[MrHat]

Believe it or not there was a (small) realism community in COD a few years ago. I don't know now since I long ago gave up on the COD franchise. I was in a realism unit that played against probably 7-8 other units. We had to mod the **** out of the game and it still had many problems. And this was with COD's crap mod tools. What's my point? The game is what you make of it. RO gears it's game mechanics much closer to realistic combat that I look for, and if you want other changes made the tools will be there to make changes the realism units want.

Even in the midst of a pray and spray game we were able to mod it into what we wanted. This game will need MUCH less modding I am sure if the biggest "problem" is a rare weapon being added and a freaking tunic being worn wrong.

 

[Void]

Would you buy the game if they would add clowns with M249's n sh*t?

No, why do you want things like that in the game?

Do you have a weird fetish for people with over the top make-up who wield Belgian LMGs?

 

[heady89]

Of course i only care about my own play-style! I don't want new players from COD or BF to destroy this great community we have, you see how retarded these communitys they have, 12 year old kids yelling into cheap mic words like 'omfg i ownd ya serioysly bagfiafsd bla bla'.

I see that TWI wants to get new people interested about RO2, but adding unrealistic elements is not the way. I though RO2 was the game which will fix some problems that Ostfront had and make game even more realistic and fun with cool features.

Would you buy the game if they would add clowns with M249's n sh*t?

It is quite pointless discussing with you if you seriously compare RO2 with Call of Duty and clowns.
Makes you wonder who really is the clown here.

 

[Derpus]

Of course i only care about my own play-style! I don't want new players from COD or BF to destroy this great community we have, you see how retarded these communitys they have, 12 year old kids yelling into cheap mic words like 'omfg i ownd ya serioysly bagfiafsd bla bla'.

I see that TWI wants to get new people interested about RO2, but adding unrealistic elements is not the way. I though RO2 was the game which will fix some problems that Ostfront had and make game even more realistic and fun with cool features.

Would you buy the game if they would add clowns with M249's n sh*t?

That's very silly. They won't destroy this community we have. For example: ArmA2. That sim has PLENTY of settings to make it as arcadey as one may want it to be. Did that cause their forum and game to turn into a mass community of 12 year old CoD players? Nope.

It's up to the server owners and sub-communities to handle their servers and such, which means that simply won't happen. Trust me, if you're on a good server, annoying people get kicked, no matter their age. Simple as that.

 

[Dr. Pierre Chang]

Original red orchestra mod and Ostfront was dedicated for people who are looking for ultimate realism (atleast in the limits of that time)

It was?

 

[Leo4444]

I was actually more worried about the mp40 dual mag then the MKb the game was balanced enough with the 32clip mp40 it was just a different style then the ppsh. The dual mag unlock reminds of battlefield and cod unlocks, I like how RO is now, everyone starts off equal and those saying that they can be disabled need to stop. The devs havent yet specified what the server options will be only to trust them, which I will but the community will get split into 2 groups either way.

 

[Derpus]

I was actually more worried about the mp40 dual mag then the MKb the game was balanced enough with the 32clip mp40 it was just a different style then the ppsh. The dual mag unlock reminds of battlefield and cod unlocks, I like how RO is now, everyone starts off equal and those saying that they can be disabled need to stop. The devs havent yet specified what the server options will be only to trust them, which I will but the community will get split into 2 groups either way.

They added things that could possibly have been tested in Stalingrad. If you have evidence that not one single MP40II was tested there, then that's fine. As well, every single player won't be running around with an MP40II. Classes are still limited, therefore it will be barely any. Especially if it's only useable by the Hero slot.

Lastly, an MP40II is still an MP40, simply with a bit faster reload. It isn't a drum magazine. To balance it even further, they could make it so after you use both clips it takes longer to reload than a normal, as it probably would.

In the end of the day, it still fires the same bullets, and it's still a fairly inaccurate sub-machine gun.