• Please make sure you are familiar with the forum rules. You can find them here: https://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/index.php?threads/forum-rules.2334636/
  • Weve updated the Tripwire Privacy Notice under our Policies to be clearer about our use of customer information to come in line with the EU General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR) rules that come into force today (25th May 2018). The following are highlights of our changes:


    We've incorporated the relevant concepts from the GDPR including joining the EU and Swiss Privacy Shield framework. We've added explanations for why and how Tripwire processes customer data and the types of data that we process, as well as information about your data protection rights.



    For more information about our privacy practices, please review the new Privacy Policy found here: https://tripwireinteractive.com/#/privacy-notice

"Why Even Try?" A demonstration of the berserker perks weakness.

TheTCREngineer

FNG / Fresh Meat
Aug 29, 2013
1,465
43
0
United Arab Emirates
If you're going to **** talk about berserker without having any experience with him, I'm never going to respect you. That's like saying "the commando sux" while you're only level 3 with him. I will have a video up soon. Also, don't create a new thread with already discussed things and rather post in that thread.
 

q3.railgun

FNG / Fresh Meat
Apr 30, 2015
590
4
0
y'know, when probably the best solo player in the game is talking about doing just that as berserker, and having just gone off and tested it in a pub game, actually playing like KF1 with a combo like pulverizer + AR works pretty stupidly well if you just don't care about your teams well-being.
I am concerned for my teams well being. I don't go off on my own to save myself, I do it so that scrakes and fps are not an immediate problem for my team and so that I cut down the mob count for them by a third of up to half since any dosh I get until the scrake waves are bonus. The reason why I say other pub zerkers are a waste of a teamslot is because I just see them attempting to tank and not play smart.
 

CrashFu

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 11, 2014
1,143
0
0
Ohio
Oh boy, another "make KF2 exactly like KF1 because I can't adapt to change" thread.

If you want a KF1-style pure melee class, wait for the Martial Artist perk to come out. It's got the katana and everything.

Berzerker is going to get some buffs to make it better at what it's intended to be, not changed to be a reskin of another planned perk.
 

N2MC

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 25, 2015
69
0
0
For all the people in this thread confusing perk stats:

The tooltip says "Commando gets 1% weapon damage per level" so you'd assume it's a global weapon damage buff.
It's not. Commando only gets 1% more damage per level with his perk weapons. Not with assault rifles such as the Medic AR, not a global buff, just his perk weapons.

Same thing with Support. Only for Support weapons.

Berserker's tooltip says "25% melee damage increase and 25% swing speed decrease."
Again, these bonuses apply only to Berserker weapons, but aren't restricted to just his melee weapons. On one hand the Katana gets no Zerk bonuses at all, but the Nailgun gets 25% damage but not 25% swing speed duration since it's a gun.
 

Rattler

Grizzled Veteran
Dec 20, 2009
2,816
313
83
I don't see the problem with taking 5 shots to kill a SCR. It was a joke that in KF you were able to kill a big guy with 1 hit on HoE. Thats BS. And here you were not even playing on HoE. This shouldn't happen with any perk. Even so, I think 5 is also too low amount of hits. You are supposed to take the big guys down as a team, not by one man army. Yes, there are DMG dealer perks but they are there to help killing those enemies faster, not to kill them within 1 hit.
 

Escadin

FNG / Fresh Meat
Apr 19, 2013
1,567
24
0
For all the people in this thread confusing perk stats:

The tooltip says "Commando gets 1% weapon damage per level" so you'd assume it's a global weapon damage buff.
It's not. Commando only gets 1% more damage per level with his perk weapons. Not with assault rifles such as the Medic AR, not a global buff, just his perk weapons.

Same thing with Support. Only for Support weapons.

Berserker's tooltip says "25% melee damage increase and 25% swing speed decrease."
Again, these bonuses apply only to Berserker weapons, but aren't restricted to just his melee weapons. On one hand the Katana gets no Zerk bonuses at all, but the Nailgun gets 25% damage but not 25% swing speed duration since it's a gun.
We've already been there, thank you! I don't think anybody got confused about it, though. Pretty sure it's not 25% swing speed decrease btw.


@Rattler
Who or what takes 5 shots to kill Scrakes?
 
Last edited:

C_Gibby

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 18, 2010
7,282
2,720
0
I think the berzerker is fine as it is, zerk players just miss how ridiculously OP it was in KF1 and instead of trying to get better they try to complain their way into OPness again.
 

Mätibaggings

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 7, 2015
162
0
0
Finland
I think the berzerker is fine as it is, zerk players just miss how ridiculously OP it was in KF1 and instead of trying to get better they try to complain their way into OPness again.
This seems to be the case with some people. I find the zerk enjoyable to play, but the enjoyment dies usually because how squishy he is. "Don't get hit, git gud" and all that, but he absolutely needs to be a tad more tanky.
I've seen people do well with evis, but very few ones. Of all the good zerks, which are also few. I don't count myself among them tho
 

Undedd Jester

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 31, 2009
3,071
881
0
Sheffield, England
I still think damage resistance up 15% and movement speed down to 15% is the way to go myself. Who needs 25% movement speed really when we can sprint? It's just excessive.

There are many times I want to say something... but then i see Rattler beat me to it... and here I was thinking we were a dying breed ;P
 
Last edited:

Escadin

FNG / Fresh Meat
Apr 19, 2013
1,567
24
0
It takes 4-5 saw blades as you can see in the video.
Oh thanks for clearifying! I skipped that part.
I personally don't mind high damage weapons which can (2 and up)-shot big ones. Two are already in the game actually and more will come with Sharpshooter and Demo I'm sure of it.
 
Last edited:

q3.railgun

FNG / Fresh Meat
Apr 30, 2015
590
4
0
I still think damage resistance up 15% and movement speed down to 15% is the way to go myself. Who needs 25% movement speed really when we can sprint? It's just excessive.

There are many times I want to say something... but then i see Rattler beat me to it... and here I was thinking we were a dying breed ;P
I need that movement speed, hell I could even use more speed but then we're back to the KF1 style. So I propose change Take Cover to have a static higher speed. Plays normal until 20hp at which point you have the speed to outrun everything but get 1 shotted.
 

Undedd Jester

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 31, 2009
3,071
881
0
Sheffield, England
I need that movement speed, hell I could even use more speed but then we're back to the KF1 style. So I propose change Take Cover to have a static higher speed. Plays normal until 20hp at which point you have the speed to outrun everything but get 1 shotted.
You wouldn't need that movement speed if your skills suited the perk better. Movement speed is a insanely powerful tool, and is a crutch for other deficiencies in the perk. If a perk cannot function without such a high movement speed, there is something blatantly wrong with the perk.

I posted these changes a little while back, but tbh there are so many more perks to come out, it isn't really worth barking changes out until we see the full scope of the classes available.
 

outofrealman

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 29, 2009
1,849
336
0
You wouldn't need that movement speed if your skills suited the perk better. Movement speed is a insanely powerful tool, and is a crutch for other deficiencies in the perk. If a perk cannot function without such a high movement speed, there is something blatantly wrong with the perk.

I posted these changes a little while back, but tbh there are so many more perks to come out, it isn't really worth barking changes out until we see the full scope of the classes available.
Do you know even with the 25% speed you still take damage when you try to run away from gorefasts/clots and brothers/crawlers/stalkers. You are in melee range and very clearly you cant kill trash as fast as other perks. I can tell you berserker do need speed to function, oh and higher resistance too. A melle class do need more speed and tackiness to function. Medic on the other hand... can reduce the speed to 15% or so. And less armor. And medic dont need puke resistance.
 
Last edited:

Escadin

FNG / Fresh Meat
Apr 19, 2013
1,567
24
0
Do you know even with the 25% speed you still take damage when you try to run away from gorefasts/clots and brothers/crawlers/stalkers. You are in melee range and very clearly you cant kill trash as fast as other perks. I can tell you berserker do need speed to function, oh and higher resistance too. A melle class do need more speed and tackiness to function. Medic on the other hand... can reduce the speed to 15% or so. And less armor. And medic dont need puke resistance.
Then again it's all relative...

If you don't get away from attacks as easily as you should then it's all due to server sided hitdetection. You're just out of lag. And besides, how could anyone dodge animation-blinking gorefast?

And of course, you can't outfarm an AA12. However, realistically a good support (especially if the only one on team) doesn't farm with AA12. Hell not even with the Boomstick.
Good Supports kill trash with the medic pistol almost exclusively because they need all the ammo they can get their hands on for FP&SC and slow weaponswap speed doesn't allow them to switch back and forth between 2 weapons without getting punished.

Lastely, Medics are tanks too and how would this help zerker at all?
 
Last edited:

Quintuplin

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 15, 2014
297
0
0
All this talk about tankiness lacking, but at the same time it adds up differently as a zerker vs other classes. As a commando, if there's a couple gorefasts in your face, then you're gonna pray for a zed time or your armor is forfeit. Even if you kill them in time to avoid damage, the next wave will be right there as well, and you're gonna have a hard time pushing the zeds back out to a safe distance to use your weapons effectively. So that extra health ends up being a moot point when something gets in range... you're gonna TAKE that damage.

As a zerk, though, you can stand out in the front and center, with an entire wave of zeds all crushing up against your face, and just bash bash bash. As long as your prioritization is right and your aim is good enough, you're not gonna take much damage. The utility of melee gives you far more survivability than a flat numbers increase does for the range classes.

S'why I love zerk so much even as weak as it is. I play a few games of commando, and enjoy killing things efficiently, then play a bit of zerk and feel immortal... until the medic runs off to play his solo rambo simulator and leaves me to die :(

Edit: though to be fair most of the best moments I've had as zerk were also playing solo rambo simulator, where you can kite and manage your zeds more effectively. Hanging with the group without a dedicated medic is a great way to have allies drag zeds into your retreat paths and kill you. And everyone seems to love camping in dead-ends...
 
Last edited:

outofrealman

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 29, 2009
1,849
336
0
Then again it's all relative...

If you don't get away from attacks as easily as you should then it's all due to server sided hitdetection. You're just out of lag. And besides, how could anyone dodge animation-blinking gorefast?

And of course, you can't outfarm an AA12. However, realistically a good support (especially if the only one on team) doesn't farm with AA12. Hell not even with the Boomstick.
Good Supports kill trash with the medic pistol almost exclusively because they need all the ammo they can get their hands on for FP&SC and slow weaponswap speed doesn't allow them to switch back and forth between 2 weapons without getting punished.

Lastely, Medics are tanks too and how would this help zerker at all?
Go play a solo game, you still cant outrun the damage range of the trashes. It only get worst online. I am not talking about outfarming other perks, you simply dont kill the threash fast enough to not take damage. Not to mention if you move forward backwards, you have to interupt the movement to do the horizontal slash.
 

TheIncredibleGrusi

FNG / Fresh Meat
Apr 30, 2015
83
0
0
You wouldn't need that movement speed if your skills suited the perk better. Movement speed is a insanely powerful tool, and is a crutch for other deficiencies in the perk. If a perk cannot function without such a high movement speed, there is something blatantly wrong with the perk.

I posted these changes a little while back, but tbh there are so many more perks to come out, it isn't really worth barking changes out until we see the full scope of the classes available.
What KF1 style? In KF1, you could not just run away from a FP at all if it was raged, it was bound to hit you. Else it was a glitch or you sealed a door to calm it (besides ZED-Eradication Device, ofc). Of course if you were smart, it would not rage at all.

With 25 % mov speed you can run away from everything, which is the reason everyone still thinks Med and Zerker are able to "Solo" all the time. Well no, not as long as there are teleporting Zeds around you.

So, until that is fixed, I suggest everyone tries to play what he likes the most and what's good for the team...a Berserker who knows how to parry is a pretty good Perk, he just needs 15% dmg resistance and a Skill-overhaul and it is fine.

Still, if you choose Berserker in a team without a Medic, you are just an idiot as of the current build. Or someone else who got at least the Medic's AR. Talking about Sui and HoE there, especially HoE. You can't just do what you want, it was not like that in KF1 and it is far less the case in KF2 since we lack a lot of Perks. Well you can do what you want, but you will help your team with losing.
 

Zerethon

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 5, 2009
338
4
0
Ohio
If you're going to **** talk about berserker without having any experience with him, I'm never going to respect you. That's like saying "the commando sux" while you're only level 3 with him. I will have a video up soon. Also, don't create a new thread with already discussed things and rather post in that thread.
Can't beat a dead horse too much, i say, eventually someone will get tired of the smell and listen.

What KF1 style? In KF1, you could not just run away from a FP at all if it was raged, it was bound to hit you. Else it was a glitch or you sealed a door to calm it (besides ZED-Eradication Device, ofc). Of course if you were smart, it would not rage at all.

With 25 % mov speed you can run away from everything, which is the reason everyone still thinks Med and Zerker are able to "Solo" all the time. Well no, not as long as there are teleporting Zeds around you.

So, until that is fixed, I suggest everyone tries to play what he likes the most and what's good for the team...a Berserker who knows how to parry is a pretty good Perk, he just needs 15% dmg resistance and a Skill-overhaul and it is fine.

Still, if you choose Berserker in a team without a Medic, you are just an idiot as of the current build. Or someone else who got at least the Medic's AR. Talking about Sui and HoE there, especially HoE. You can't just do what you want, it was not like that in KF1 and it is far less the case in KF2 since we lack a lot of Perks. Well you can do what you want, but you will help your team with losing.
Really right now, with the off-perking viability, you're actually better off just taking shotguns or some other bursty weapon alongside the pulv, Because we've gone from the king dick of melee damage to a guy in a burger king crown being an overglorified distraction and that's the only way really to match other perks in damage ability.

Least with the shotguns you can actually DPS hard targets and with your speed you can stay out of arms reach. Though i prefer the AK12 or medic shotgun, over say the AA12 or boomstick.

Medic SG gives me a fast reload and a healing ability for the boss + easy one-shots on all enemies, AK12 gives me good trash clears and a somewhat better "oh S***" button with full auto.

And even lacking perks shouldn't be a problem. Literally every perk in KF1 can go solo all the way up to Suicidal (Wait, sorry, they made that HoE in KF1) or HoE when played at the same upper skill level.

Forcing the "Evolve system" into this game isn't going to work, and isn't why KF1 was so successful, even amongst the "Casual" crowd who never left beginner/normal.

it was because you could play what you wanted, solo or with a team, and have a good chance of winning. If a perk has to 100% rely on gimmicky abilities or skills, even in a team, it's got an issue, and that is currently where berserker is.
 

Senario

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 10, 2015
100
0
0
Zerk is fine, stop crying because it`s not as op as in KF1.
I totally disliked zerk in KF1 because it was so op and boring and I was very suprised and happy as I tryed this new Zerk and noticed how well balanced it is now.

The only true Thing you complaining Guys said about Zerk is, that Tier 2 and Tier 4 should get a LITTLE buff.
Also I wouldn`t complain about changed Skills even though I`m fine with them as they are.
But giving him more Strenght, Resistance, HP or Speed would just result in a terrible op Perk just as it was in KF1.

As it is now, Zerk is not the
"I`m going solo till my Team is dead and finish the Rest on my own, Perk."
And thats a good Thing.
Zerk needs his Team, especially Medics now, just as every other Perk needs different Perks to compensate the own certain Weakness.

Thats how you get a good co-op Game.

Btw, just yesterday I played a Game on suicidal with zerk 25 using only the shovel+ medicgun and my Team had another Zerk, a Commando, 2 Medics and a Support and we did very well. ;)

Stop complaining about it but learn how to play it!
Every single dissenting opinion on Zerk needing some work is followed up by "I hate zerk and it shouldn't be OP like it was in KF1".

Problem with that is...Every perk was op. Sharpshooter could easily kill scrakes with Xbow headshots. Demo had crazy pipe bomb things to do on the patriarch round. I don't see how your opinion should count if you clearly are biased against berserker being even slightly viable at high difficulties.