Why are
- Thread starter Neom.1r
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This is how far I got:
Because I wrote:
So apart from that, and apart from the fact that I said please don't post here if you don't want to contribute, which you yourself said you don't, but you keep posting here anyway, I conclude your nowt but a troll.
You have no credibility to me, I won't even bother reading the rest of your 'response' because your obviously so mad with rage your literally blinded by it. I would hate to be that mad.
I would.
/thread
Because I wrote:
So apart from that, and apart from the fact that I said please don't post here if you don't want to contribute, which you yourself said you don't, but you keep posting here anyway, I conclude your nowt but a troll.
You have no credibility to me, I won't even bother reading the rest of your 'response' because your obviously so mad with rage your literally blinded by it. I would hate to be that mad.
I would.
/thread
I'll give you a /thread. I'll give you a /thread so hard, you ain't gonna walk straight for weeks.
I would love to stop posting but my need to call you out on your dishonest little spiel outweighs that.
Now, that quote.
Here's more of it, including what you left out:
This isn't a concession to me saying that a berserker is pretty bad in a team and much, much better off doing something alone, this is mind diarrhea in which you mistake your pitiful self for being the developer of the game since you assume to be in any position to establish what a class is "meant to be".
Time to wake up here.
Unless you have design documents from twi that specifically claim otherwise, you are in no position to theorize that a game element currently present in the game isn't "meant to" be there or isn't meant to be used in a specific way you happen not to like unless it is a bug or other other obvious malfunction (which movement speed bonuses that are explicitly stated as a bonus in game are not). See also: Calling weapon stockpiling an "exploit".
And of course you would rip the first sentence out of context to look like the moralizer you couldn't be further off from.
-You keep putting words into my mouth
-You ignore what I am saying
-You have put my username into almost all your posts in here, either calling specifically me out or replying to me
-Yet you are unable to answer a simple question
-My "rage" amuses you
-You call me a troll
-You do not actually disagree nor agree with the statements I made -in fact you flat out ignore most of them- yet you still somehow saw the need to harass me for no reason
What is your goddamn problem?
Have a /thread
I would love to stop posting but my need to call you out on your dishonest little spiel outweighs that.
Now, that quote.
Here's more of it, including what you left out:
This isn't a concession to me saying that a berserker is pretty bad in a team and much, much better off doing something alone, this is mind diarrhea in which you mistake your pitiful self for being the developer of the game since you assume to be in any position to establish what a class is "meant to be".
Time to wake up here.
Unless you have design documents from twi that specifically claim otherwise, you are in no position to theorize that a game element currently present in the game isn't "meant to" be there or isn't meant to be used in a specific way you happen not to like unless it is a bug or other other obvious malfunction (which movement speed bonuses that are explicitly stated as a bonus in game are not). See also: Calling weapon stockpiling an "exploit".
And of course you would rip the first sentence out of context to look like the moralizer you couldn't be further off from.
-You keep putting words into my mouth
-You ignore what I am saying
-You have put my username into almost all your posts in here, either calling specifically me out or replying to me
-Yet you are unable to answer a simple question
-My "rage" amuses you
-You call me a troll
-You do not actually disagree nor agree with the statements I made -in fact you flat out ignore most of them- yet you still somehow saw the need to harass me for no reason
What is your goddamn problem?
Have a /thread
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Mmmmmmmmmmmeh. You're argument which lies in that it is a game dedicated to cooperation, and these "boring players" (for lack of better words) who don't understand the concept of FP"SHOOTER"...is completely valid.
However, my advice, build a bridge, and drive your complain train to another server with less boring players.
For F*&^ sake, this thread was not made to ahev a go at each other. And just for the record 9_6, that was not Neom.1r who downvoted you, it was me. I'm sick of your attitude, and your constant wishing of death on Neom.1r is sick. So eyah, there ya go. And stop replying to a thread if you have nothing to contribute to it.
On the other hand, I completely disagree with kiting being a bad thing, it's just a style of play that half the people don't seem to like. FDair enough, you don't have to like it, you don't have to paly it. I realise that people have said that they go to multiple servers to find kiters, well then go to an empty servert and you choose the gameplay?! It's really quite easy. And as I said in another thread relating to Beserkers, i've kited as a Support before, and I did exceptionally well with another Support and a Beserker. It's really not that hard to do as any perk, and anyone who kicks you for not kiting with them as a Beserker or Medic just has not understanding that it can be done wioth other perks. I have no video proof, but you have my word. I actually find it hard to camp on the harder difficulties because getting run down generally means the team is screwed, whereas kiting one or two people might get scrweed up but at elast the others can keep moving. There will of course be situations in both cases where this is not the case, but I'm speakingi generalities.
And how can constant movement be out of Killing Floor feel? I think that if i was in a zombie apocalypse, i'd be constantly moving, so I think this is more true to it than camping. Although that's not necassarily right either because some people would hole up somewhere. And that si where killign Floor has achieved it's job; it has catered for all plays tyles, not just one. If you don't like the play style, find another server.
And that is a reasoned arguement ladies and gentlemen. I would also like to invite constructive criticsm, as i will provide a valid reasoned response, and if i can't find a good response, i'll concede defeat.
On the other hand, I completely disagree with kiting being a bad thing, it's just a style of play that half the people don't seem to like. FDair enough, you don't have to like it, you don't have to paly it. I realise that people have said that they go to multiple servers to find kiters, well then go to an empty servert and you choose the gameplay?! It's really quite easy. And as I said in another thread relating to Beserkers, i've kited as a Support before, and I did exceptionally well with another Support and a Beserker. It's really not that hard to do as any perk, and anyone who kicks you for not kiting with them as a Beserker or Medic just has not understanding that it can be done wioth other perks. I have no video proof, but you have my word. I actually find it hard to camp on the harder difficulties because getting run down generally means the team is screwed, whereas kiting one or two people might get scrweed up but at elast the others can keep moving. There will of course be situations in both cases where this is not the case, but I'm speakingi generalities.
And how can constant movement be out of Killing Floor feel? I think that if i was in a zombie apocalypse, i'd be constantly moving, so I think this is more true to it than camping. Although that's not necassarily right either because some people would hole up somewhere. And that si where killign Floor has achieved it's job; it has catered for all plays tyles, not just one. If you don't like the play style, find another server.
And that is a reasoned arguement ladies and gentlemen. I would also like to invite constructive criticsm, as i will provide a valid reasoned response, and if i can't find a good response, i'll concede defeat.
Half of people? You saw some people in this forum disagreeing with this gameplay and you're really going to say HALF OF PEOPLE? Join 80%+ of HoE servers and you will find those groups and you want to tell me that 50% of all players disagree with this style?
It isn't that easy if you want to play with random groups like me. For example you are playing the first two waves with another player. Then other guys will join and going to kite. Imo THAT is definitely no teamwork.
Please show me HoE videos of: Bedlam, Hospital Horrors, Wyre, EvilSantasLair, Crash, Departed, .... I don't believe that kiting with Firebug, Support Specialist, Sharpshooter and Commando is "not hard" there.
The point isn't kiting. The point is the missing teamwork on publics.
You are going to play Suicidal or HoE with 6 players and you have two Berserkers in your team playing on their own because they ignore teamplay. Of course, I COULD leave the server but maybe I need this map and the other three guys are (casual) good players. Maybe I don't see a list of 1324576437621 servers in the server browser.
Want to write more but I haven't more time. :s
Mmm... fair enough Skaali, i'll say rgith now that i don't have much experience with Hell On Earth, but Suicidal seems to be alright to kite as a Support, you just need to make sure that you pick a direction, and designate postions, for example, make sure one person is always watching the front, etc. I find this tactic particuarly useful on Departed, Aperture, West London. Kiting as a Support on Departed is amazing on 6 man suicidal, so much fun... and not that hard to pull off.
I find camping much more effective on Crash, that is possibly the easiest map. So there are going to be times when camping is more beneficial, but it has to be a mighty good hold on the harder difficulties
Remember that Im'm from Australia, i only really get good ping on 3FL servers, and a couple of Game Arena servers, and they generally have no people in them. I find that people who join them are more than willing to play as a good team and play to the style that we started, but sadly, that may be different for whatever public servers you are joining
Also, it may be more than half the people in the community don't like kiting, but it's not reasonable to use this thread as an example, as a lot of people have not been posting here, and thus will lead to a one sided arguement. If we were using this thread, kiting would be currently among the most hated things about Killing Floor bu the looks of it
Missing teamwork won't be ever solved, due to everyone joining haveing a different mentality. If you had me join your game, I would immediatly pick whatever perk you wanted or the team needed. However, i can say quite a few (not necassarily most) peoplea re not like that and will do whatever they please, whether you are kiting or camping, they won't care, they will just do their own thing But again, nothing can be done about that.
PS. I only get about 20 servers max on each difficulty with acceptable ping, recently it's dropped to just 6... Maybe I'm just lucky down in Australia to ahve good public servers
I find camping much more effective on Crash, that is possibly the easiest map. So there are going to be times when camping is more beneficial, but it has to be a mighty good hold on the harder difficulties
Remember that Im'm from Australia, i only really get good ping on 3FL servers, and a couple of Game Arena servers, and they generally have no people in them. I find that people who join them are more than willing to play as a good team and play to the style that we started, but sadly, that may be different for whatever public servers you are joining
Also, it may be more than half the people in the community don't like kiting, but it's not reasonable to use this thread as an example, as a lot of people have not been posting here, and thus will lead to a one sided arguement. If we were using this thread, kiting would be currently among the most hated things about Killing Floor bu the looks of it
Missing teamwork won't be ever solved, due to everyone joining haveing a different mentality. If you had me join your game, I would immediatly pick whatever perk you wanted or the team needed. However, i can say quite a few (not necassarily most) peoplea re not like that and will do whatever they please, whether you are kiting or camping, they won't care, they will just do their own thing
But again, nothing can be done about that.PS. I only get about 20 servers max on each difficulty with acceptable ping, recently it's dropped to just 6... Maybe I'm just lucky down in Australia to ahve good public servers
For F*&^ sake, this thread was not made to ahev a go at each other. And just for the record 9_6, that was not Neom.1r who downvoted you, it was me. I'm sick of your attitude, and your constant wishing of death on Neom.1r is sick. So eyah, there ya go. And stop replying to a thread if you have nothing to contribute to it.
I am sorry for reacting and standing up for myself and the next time someone says something I never said like for example you saying I "constantly wish death on Neom.1r" I'll thank them for their valuable act of patronization and ignorance that is specifically targeted at me and in itself adds nothing to whatever "discussion" the passive-aggressive question "Why are... Zerkers still ruining games by completely forcing people to kite with them or die?" you think sparked either. Thank you.
Tone over content much?
Protip: If you don't want someones reaction, don't act towards them especially if there really is nothing you have to talk about.
That's the wisdom I'm constantly trying to hammer into a certain skull here but apparently it simply is too thick.
Is yours thick too?
Cause I don't think I could get a bigger hammer.
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Posted by 9_6 -
Time to grab you by your neck and mash your face into it now.
In reference to forcing Neom.1r to see what they've written. You don't think that's alittle harsh? You don't think that's tone over content you idiot? I'll happily admit I'm going tone over content now cos all you've done the whole damn thread is argue with Neom.1r, and while I don't condone him talking back to you with his condescending remarks, i sure as hell don't care for your constant unreasonable abuse. One last thing on this topic, all Neom.1r has being doing is trying to get you to make a valid arguement, and you have as yet to do so. I'm not on anyones side, i am third party to this crap and want nothing but for it to end now.
And what do you mean if there is nothjing I have to talk about?! You've quoted the first paragraph of my 3-4 paragraph post, and you've conveniently only managed to quote the 1/10th of my post that had nothing to do with the thread so well done, you should try a job in the media. At least when i've quoted you, you'll notice I've maintained context and explained the whole thing.
Here is another, hard to take out of context. Now just tell me this is wishing death:
I concede that you're either incredibly, shamelessly stupid and arrogant (nice mix) in which case, shame on you and die in a fire or you are a troll in which case shame on me for feeding you.
Try explain that one to me?
Now as I said, either make an arguement or get lost, cos all your doing is ruining a thread that while it may have started out as a badly constructed thread, has actually got some reasonable content now. Look back at your posts, stop screwing everyone around and get back to (or actually start) posting some relevent information in this thread. I don't know what the hell your problem is here, I've seen your posts in other threads and you were fine there, sure you are "defending" your self against Neom.1r or whatever you claim, but seriously, there is being defensive and there is a being a d*&^, and you sir are being a d*&^. And by the way, your point of my post being "tone over content" is ridiculous, not because the bit aimed at you wan't that, cos it bloody well was, but because the last 8 or so posts from you in this thread have been nothing but that! There has been no content!
I have gone and made contributuion to the matter at hand, try doing so yuorself.
Just so you know, I read your second post in this thread and it was quite good, it stated your arguement perfectly and I actually agree with it, so why is it now so hard to keep that discussion going and civilised?
Time to grab you by your neck and mash your face into it now.
In reference to forcing Neom.1r to see what they've written. You don't think that's alittle harsh? You don't think that's tone over content you idiot? I'll happily admit I'm going tone over content now cos all you've done the whole damn thread is argue with Neom.1r, and while I don't condone him talking back to you with his condescending remarks, i sure as hell don't care for your constant unreasonable abuse.
One last thing on this topic, all Neom.1r has being doing is trying to get you to make a valid arguement, and you have as yet to do so. I'm not on anyones side, i am third party to this crap and want nothing but for it to end now.And what do you mean if there is nothjing I have to talk about?! You've quoted the first paragraph of my 3-4 paragraph post, and you've conveniently only managed to quote the 1/10th of my post that had nothing to do with the thread so well done, you should try a job in the media. At least when i've quoted you, you'll notice I've maintained context and explained the whole thing.
Here is another, hard to take out of context. Now just tell me this is wishing death:
I concede that you're either incredibly, shamelessly stupid and arrogant (nice mix) in which case, shame on you and die in a fire or you are a troll in which case shame on me for feeding you.
Try explain that one to me?
Now as I said, either make an arguement or get lost, cos all your doing is ruining a thread that while it may have started out as a badly constructed thread, has actually got some reasonable content now. Look back at your posts, stop screwing everyone around and get back to (or actually start) posting some relevent information in this thread. I don't know what the hell your problem is here, I've seen your posts in other threads and you were fine there, sure you are "defending" your self against Neom.1r or whatever you claim, but seriously, there is being defensive and there is a being a d*&^, and you sir are being a d*&^. And by the way, your point of my post being "tone over content" is ridiculous, not because the bit aimed at you wan't that, cos it bloody well was, but because the last 8 or so posts from you in this thread have been nothing but that! There has been no content!
I have gone and made contributuion to the matter at hand, try doing so yuorself.
Just so you know, I read your second post in this thread and it was quite good, it stated your arguement perfectly and I actually agree with it, so why is it now so hard to keep that discussion going and civilised?
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Okay
It seems you don't know what "constantly" means.
It seems you missed the part where I asked simple yes/no questions which he doesn't answer.
It seems you missed that I have already made my points in the very second post in this thread already, none of which he disagreed with so where's the discussion value here?
It seems you missed the part where he constantly wanted to incite a discussion on unrelated things, despite that.
It seems you missed the part where I wrote in CAPS that I am not interested in a discussion, that means that I will not add additional points beyond the ones I already made since I've had a mouth full of that time and time again already and there are far better threads or that.
It seems you missed... well I could go on forever.
For instance, that I meant with "tone over content" that you do get mad at the tone of a post without getting all too hung up on the content.
And you have done it again. Bravo.
And since you go all ad-hominem on me now, let me answer that by calling you a downvoting, passive-aggressive, spineless little twat.
Everyone hates your kind. Stop it.
I've always wanted to do that to one of those faceless blighters who keep doing that. Thanks for outing you.
have an up-vote.
Edit: Well I guess since you outed yourself, we can scratch the "spineless" off the list to be fair. Keep it up.
It seems you don't know what "constantly" means.
It seems you missed the part where I asked simple yes/no questions which he doesn't answer.
It seems you missed that I have already made my points in the very second post in this thread already, none of which he disagreed with so where's the discussion value here?
It seems you missed the part where he constantly wanted to incite a discussion on unrelated things, despite that.
It seems you missed the part where I wrote in CAPS that I am not interested in a discussion, that means that I will not add additional points beyond the ones I already made since I've had a mouth full of that time and time again already and there are far better threads or that.
It seems you missed... well I could go on forever.
For instance, that I meant with "tone over content" that you do get mad at the tone of a post without getting all too hung up on the content.
And you have done it again. Bravo.
And since you go all ad-hominem on me now, let me answer that by calling you a downvoting, passive-aggressive, spineless little twat.
Everyone hates your kind. Stop it.
I've always wanted to do that to one of those faceless blighters who keep doing that. Thanks for outing you.
have an up-vote.
Edit: Well I guess since you outed yourself, we can scratch the "spineless" off the list to be fair. Keep it up.
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And how can constant movement be out of Killing Floor feel? I think that if i was in a zombie apocalypse, i'd be constantly moving, so I think this is more true to it than camping. Although that's not necassarily right either because some people would hole up somewhere. And that si where killign Floor has achieved it's job; it has catered for all plays tyles, not just one. If you don't like the play style, find another server.
And that is a reasoned arguement ladies and gentlemen. I would also like to invite constructive criticsm, as i will provide a valid reasoned response, and if i can't find a good response, i'll concede defeat.
This is a good point but there needs to be said a few things:
It's not the concept of kiting itself which is bad, i'd like kiting as a TEAM to happen, with VARIED perks and not just purely Berserkers/Medics. But right now, there is basicly 2 things to do:
1) Kite with Berserker (+ occassional Medic)
2) Camp with a team of any kind of perks
There are multiple reasons for this:
1) Berserkers can handle ANY specimen alone, which i think everyone agreeds is overpowered. Fixing the Fleshpounds rage mechanics so they only pause, instead of reset, when it misses a swing or is out of line of sight, would make the Berserker unable to kite ALL specimen by himself
2) The Berserker and Medic are much faster than every other perk, especially Berserker. Tone down both perks movement speed (15 or 20% max), then all the other perks can keep up a bit better if the team is gonna kite together.
The thing people dislike is not necessarily the kiting itself, it's that the Berserker can kite everything ALONE with ease, without any need of the other teammates, which is wrong. Doing the Fleshpound change makes the players have 3 choices, if there is a Berserker in the team:
1) The Berserker(s) has to stick with the camping team
2) The team can kite around together with the Berserker(s)
3) The Berserker(s) can kite a bit away from the group, but have to fall back upon sighting a Fleshpound, requiring the backup of the antifleshpound perks.
This is good, because any of these choices then requires that you have to play as a TEAM. The Berserker is no longer (not as much at least) the alone hero that kites everything without any need of assistance.
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