Who agrees with my opnion on beserker?

[CandleJack]

Yes it is quite perplexing how many people parrot the "no weakness" mantra.
Oh well.

My friend and i were kiting kf-amusementpark, got to wave 7-9, and at the start of that wave, we ran into a group of specs containing 2 sirens.

We did not survive.



Just because a skilled Berserker can top most challenges thrown his way is no reason to nerf the perk overall into The Elder Scrolls IV.

It's like a skilled Commando can wipe out whole hordes of specs on his own in one mag.

People would be clamouring for the Commando to get california-cap* magazines so he can't kill so much per mag.

*In california the magazine size limit is 10 rounds.


I've actually been in a game or read something somewhere where someone said not to use Berserker after wave 6 because it's a weak perk.
IIRC they wanted Berserker to be buffed.

I'd say Berserker is fine as it is, though maybe a 5% damage resist nerf.

 

[Pika-Cthulhu]

Beserkers fine, stealth Nerf Medic run speed IMO, watch them kite away from the healer.

As for weaknesses, I know of a great Zerker weakness, a malicious Support welding each and every door he finds "Instant Lock-in boys!"

Not having been subjected to Zerker/Medic forced kiting or GTFO public servers yet (well, not so much GTFO, more change perk or die), fixing the rage bug is all that is necessary, I mean, it is a bug right?

 

[Fish111]

Zerker is OP.

Your entire team can die on wave 10 6-man hoe and like was said before, zerker only needs time and space to save the day.

Sharpshooter would perhaps be able to do the same thing if the player had the foresight to drop lever action rifles all over the place, but as zerker no situation other than FP+double siren spawning on your head is really cause for fear.

 

[TheBoobyTrap]

It's nice to see majority of you guys seem to agree with me...

It ruins the game for me. Kite teams troll me as much as chainsaw the pat teams. I've bloody had enough of it

 

[Spicy]

...fixing the rage bug is all that is necessary, I mean, it is a bug right?

That would make a lot more sense.

 

[Uk1t4k3]

Using Hell on Earth as the benchmark to judge a perk if it's overpowered or not and i would think that Berserker definitely fall into the category of the "A" team.

Don't get me wrong because there are still other perks that can join the "A" team such as Sharpshooters, Support Specialists, Medics, Demolitions, Commandos and even Firebug.

However out of all the perks so far, i'm sure Berserker is definitely the only perk that can survive most of the odds and the amount of sheer punishment it can take in alone is noticeable.

You can even call Berserker the "Alpha" perk.

Other perks such as Sharpshooter, Support Specialist and Demolitions are some of the alternatives that can also survive and get pass any odds when you know what to do with it. The one thing these perks can't do is to take serious punishment from the zeds.

Commando and Firebug on the other hand would fall under the category of "balanced" and these perks are fairly difficult to achieve what the above perks can do as they are much weaker when comparing firepower and versatility. However it's entire possible to use these perks and win a HoE game but definitely require lots of training.

Lastly this last perk will be given a nickname of 'Joker" because it the only perk that doesn't excel at taking down zeds and neither it has the privilege of enjoying a large arsenal of weapons.

The perk is known as medic.

But why call him a Joker as the perk is neither funny nor does it look like a clown? The only problems that could effectively cause mayhem for medic would be when the individual losses it's armor, grabbed by many clots, ear raped by sirens or unable to dodge the incoming fireball from husks.

Medic is pretty much fine if it can overcome the above problems and can also be use like a Berserker when using the correct loadout.

 

[Neom.1r]

Just re-read the thread.

I do NOT think the Bezerker is OP (I do think his stats need to be reduced slightly at least), but I do think the Bezerker has too much of a negative impact of the games playerbase as a whole. It is fine to play Bezerker. It is not fine for the result of this be that other players are prohibited from playing the game how they want (want to shoot and its a zerker game? good luck in the majority of games).

The fact that it is such a popular strategy coupled with the fact it almost totally excludes every other with regards to a 'camping' setup is not on and something must be done to fix this, either through an AI tweak, a reduction in a specific area/s of the Bezerkers class stats, or buffing everyone elses so that they can also kill every single specimen in the game given ideal situations that they themselves, most of the time, can create with their perks bonuses and weapon combinations.

 

[Blockbot]

No No No No.

See some ppl complain that games get destroyed because a berserker bugg of and runs around.

Kiting while having a team stationary at a spot is a really really good thing. if you ask me. because the game/server have a Max spawn(usually 32). having the berserker kiting around with a hord of trash. without killing to much. means it will spawn ALOT less zeds on the camping survivors which means easier survival.

I have to say this is the easiest way to win a Hoe match. but takes some more time yes. but it is a secure win.

but ofc sitting for 10-20min looking at the berserker goofing off killing a zed now and then while ur dead is kinda booring. but remember every perk can just goof of and say screw you! especially trash killer perks like commando and firebug. just dont attack the big stuff, and get out of the reset rage thingy to FP and ur good

 

[TheBoobyTrap]

but ofc sitting for 10-20min looking at the berserker goofing off killing a zed now and then while ur dead is kinda booring. but remember every perk can just goof of and say screw you! especially trash killer perks like commando and firebug. just dont attack the big stuff, and get out of the reset rage thingy to FP and ur good

LOL, I don't suppose a non-zerker can will take a fp hit unarmoured? unless you are EXTREMELY lucky, without armour a raging scrake (which can be enraged from husks or any other specimen) or a raging fp WILL kill you. The beserker will on the other hand, survives. Simple and often without losing half their hp.

With beserkers being able to play like this it's no longer a team game. If theres a way to easily clutch your team mates then everyone becomes expendable.

 

[sph34r]

Oh I have one.
It's like saying and standing by that it has no weaknesses to the point where it apparently is a legitimate argument now.
I know what scary is saying but that doesn't make the statement any less ridiculous. Everything has weaknesses.
Can we, for once, at least agree on that? It's not really much. In fact it's just common sense.
I'm not trying to convince you that he's not overpowered here.

Seemed like you were, but if you say so then I believe you. What I was trying to say in my post was that zerk is OP.

I did not even say anything about a justification on not being overpowered, in fact I never even used that word here and was even talking about nerfs but you surely noticed that...
Then again, recently people seem to love putting words into my mouth and then accuse me of doing the same.

You misunderstand me. I didn't say you used the word justification, I said you were justifying something. But since you just told me you weren't talking about berserker not being OP, it doesn't really matter.

That was directed at me?

Yeah. If it's just the norm on this forum then it just might be at the point where no one even notices anymore. Ha ha

 

[Darox]

LOL, I don't suppose a non-zerker can will take a fp hit unarmoured?

LOL, I don't suppose a non-support can oneshot scrakes? Alternately: LOL, I don't suppose a non-firebug can survive 7 husks?

I remember playing with you several months back on HoE servers where we would be camping, you would decide to 'be pro', pick zerk, and go rambo. I also remember you dying. A lot. And not even on the FP waves. I guess you got sick of sucking and dying and decided to blame the class.

The zerker isn't broken. He could do with his stats (Namely damage reduction) being reduced slightly, but he's by and large fine as a perk.

If you want a good feel for the weaknesses of a zerker, try playing as kiting sharpie on a nice map like Suburbia. It's unreal how easy sirens and husks become if you're alert and accurate. I've had situations where I've been pinned by 4 sirens ahead and the encroaching horde behind, and survived because simply because I was a sharpie. As a zerker I would have been dead. When you're picking your teeth off the pavement because a clot and his gorefast buddies sidled up to you while you were distracted, you'll appreciate the strengths of the zerker too.

Side note: Nerfing the Axe won't make the chainsaw any more useful. It's crippled by it's massive weight and slow carrying speed, letting it stun scrakes won't convince zerkers to carry it. About all that might happen is you'll start seeing zerkers drop a chainsaw somewhere on the map and ignore scrakes entirely unless it's the very end of the wave. That is decidedly uninteresting.

 

[Dolphin Buff Man]

My opinion on this is that Beserker is not necassarily overpowered, it is simply that the specimens that could cause it trouble such as the Fleshpound aren't at the moment due to bugs.

As for Beserker being overplayed, its a matter of if you don't like the server, disconnect, it's what i do and I have no complaints. There are a lot of servers out there, and if you join a server late, then it is up to you to play to their style to benefit the team. If they join you late, and try to tell you what to do, stand your ground and tell them to either play yout way or comprimise. If they don't, they'll probably get killed that wave and rage quit.

And Beserker chainsawing the Pattie is not a good excuse as you can do this with most perks, incluiding Firebugs i recently found! Very cool, it's to the point of if you can surround the Pattie, you have a good chance of winning. The Pattie needs to be fixed in this case, not the perks. There was a thread dedicated to this in ideas And Suggestions, but I'm not sure where... Check it out if you can find it.

 

[TheBoobyTrap]

dolphin buff man you went off topic there. You were talking about leaving if you don't like them. Is any of my reasons for the zerker being OP invalid or just wrong?

 

[Dolphin Buff Man]

Wait a tec, ill re read your post and then update this message.

EDIT: Ok, first off, in terms of FleshPound. The fleshpound rage thing is wrong, not the Beserker being over powered. The Scrake stun is part of the Beserkers ability and should remain. I can take a Scrake on 6 Man Suicidal with quite a few classes by myself, you've just got to adjust your play to suit the perk you play. Same as the Fleshpound, you can solo him but it is difficult.
When you say without armor, it doesn't really change too much, as one hit won't kill you if you are on full health as any perk will it? Please correct me if I'm wrong, it's been known to happan. But if this is the case, you could probably take the FleshPound as a SharpShooter easily enough, a Spport can rape a FleshPound, A Demolitions can rape Fleshpound, and the other perks aren't designed to tae on larger zeds, so includin them will actually provide false information.

EDIT II: I've now reread the first post and found that your main contention is the Beseker bein able to defeat most specimens by kiting. Fair enough, this is how he should be played. I've found that most situations on harder difficulties require me to kite, no matter what perk i am. Me and my friend kite as lvl 6 Support some times and it works really well, so it's not just the Beserker who can do it.
In terms of Beserkers over all power against zeds, i believe that eh is reasonable at the moment, it's not liek the SharpShooter used to be and really, most games I join aren't overrun by beserkers, so thats got to say something. I know i'm gonna hate myself for saying this, as a Support favoured player, but the Support is just a wall of carnage and really while you are probably more likely to survive in the long run as a Beserker, it takes a long time to finish a wave sometimes and an effective team of Supports will ahve it finished in no time. So my point is that Beserker is not the msot overpowered perk, it's probably about right.
The only thing I'd fix is the FleshPound rage mechanics and from there we can see how it goes and make further decisions.

Feel free to go against what I say, as it is only my opinion. In no way should this be looked at as the answer, it's just my thoughts. I'm happy for others to make counter arguements, and am even willing to change my mind should a good example arise!

 

[Vulchan]

As somebody who used to use berserker only, my two cents should count for something.

1: Sirens, Husks, and Crawlers makes it too irritating to play as zerk.
2: You have a chance on anything but HoE, Fleshpounds will annihilate you after defeating the first one (I'm not factoring in that rage timer exploit)
3: The chainsaw really isn't a practical weapon to use because it's too weak to eliminate the tougher enemies, and your movement speed is greatly hindered, making it nearly impossible to dodge Fleshpound attacks and clear out the weaker enemies quickly.

With that being said; no, it's not impossible to beat HoE with berserker. Also, it has it's place in certain waves while remaining practical. The perk doesn't need to be nerfed, but rather delicately tweaked, taking away some percentage values while inversely adding to another.

One last thing, the chainsaw massacre on the Patriarch is stupid. My suggestion is to simply give the Patty another attack that hits or throws everybody around him. Problem solved.

 

[9_6]

Yeah. If it's just the norm on this forum then it just might be at the point where no one even notices anymore. Ha ha

So... you... want to tell me where I was specifically condescending to you then?
Or am I just supposed to accept that at some point in this thread, I just was?

 

[FraKctured]

ok i got lvl 6 zerker i like using zerker i dont think its overpowered at all, yes u tank alot n **** but one wrong decision and its ****ing gameover specially if u get 2-3 sirens at the back of a mob u cant kill quick enough, also i didnt find zerker boring i loved slicin heads off its pro. but as for a zerker ive barely even been successful runnin off goin random of leading my team somewhere stupid i stay with my team hold off huge mobs as a meat shied with katana back stab fps and scrakes raging at teammates and heal teamates as much as possible and its very very effective, also if the rest of ur team gets wiped and ur smart enough u can kite around finishin them off

 

[TheBoobyTrap]

Ok, first off, in terms of FleshPound. The fleshpound rage thing is wrong, not the Beserker being over powered.

How is the rage meter wrong which affects beserkers?

When you say without armor, it doesn't really change too much, as one hit won't kill you if you are on full health as any perk will it? Please correct me if I'm wrong, it's been known to happan. But if this is the case, you could probably take the FleshPound as a SharpShooter easily enough, a Spport can rape a FleshPound, A Demolitions can rape Fleshpound, and the other perks aren't designed to tae on larger zeds, so includin them will actually provide false information.

That's incorrect. More often then not it will 1hit ko. if not you will be on so little health and he'll be right next to you to kill you next swing. Your health will be too low to get away.

I'm aware that supports, demo's sharpys can all solo fp's sc and all, but if they muck it up at all, without armour or help they're dead basically. Whereas if a zerker accidently rages fp they will survive and continue kiting. The amount of easiness to run around all day as a zerker is just too much. Not to say it's impossible with any other perk, I remember soloing 80 on wave 8 including fp and some sc dying to the last few when i got stuck on the new abusement map. The way a zerker can survive with the resistance and speed, just makes it too easy when you see how simple they can just run around and kill

 

[FraKctured]

tbh i never thought i would go up to 40% dmg reduced and 30% faster runwalk i thought it would be 35% and 25%. once i got lvl 6 i was surprised they made it that high, but i see you point with the kiting, but like dolphin said u can kite with any class if u play it smart and its true i do it to, yes ur chances of survival on an FP or SC are much lower but beserkers can get screw'd over too just as easy gettin stuck on somthin or multiple sirens with husk spam ur toast,
also i dont usually kite when i play a zerk i try to remain a teamplayer and be a meat shield for on coming hordes its much more effective to play as a teamplayer with zerker.
as for always getting games with only beserkers that has never happened to me period so i dont get what ur talkin about lol

 

[Steeps]

I'm in the middle on the whole berserker situation; I don't think kiting is such a bad thing but I do think he's a little too strong right now. Most people here have a problem with kiting and will continue to have a problem with the zerker until kiting is gone. It has little to nothing to do with him being op or whatnot.

I have no problem with kiting. It isn't something that I like to do every single game, but I don't see why people shouldn't be allowed to play like this if they don't want to. It's fun sometimes, and if I don't want to kite and see a kiting team on a server I just leave and go elsewhere. Sure, kiting games are popular, but I still see more stationary games than zerker ones. It's not like either type is hard to find.

But with that being said it is a little too easy to kite and there really is no downside to making mistakes. I say change the fp rage mechanics so he can't reset, lower his speed to 20%, and lower damage resistance to 25-30%. I personally think support is currently a bigger game breaker than zerker is right now, but that's just me.