is it never the case that 'sensor' thinkers with their unsophisticated tastes in media have engaging, creative and challanging employment say, yet in the real world 'intuitives' are doing bugger all?
What happened to tactical gaming?
- Thread starter Greasemonkey
- Start date
Someone plays one of the newer shooters.....
He's got a point though. BFBC2, for example. It's all driven by reacting to the spotting triangles and HUD alerts. They ripped prone out of the game to force everyone to run and gun more. They give you tons of "+whatever" announcements, much in the same way old arcade games would blast you with ridiculous score totals to stimulate your brain and help you perceive "fun."
Tactical games are much, much slower paced. Flashy announcements and kill streaks aren't what drives player fun there. The psychology of it all is, and that's something your average entertainment consumer DOES NOT get off on. Psychological thriller movies don't do as well here, as compared to say, Japan, where they've mastered the concept of psychological thrilling.
I do agree though, that the current brand of shooters (including TF2) are things you can pick up and put down, which everyone who has a job or any sort of life can appreciate. But there are weekends, there is laziness, and there is time for good, deep, consuming tactical shooters that require a slightly higher investment. The current market paints those games as antiquated or indie, and fans really should be reminding them that they're not, and projects like them need funding just as bad as whatever the big publishers and their slave dev houses can crank out in 6 months.
Bingo! Holidays, weekends, and whenever the girlfriend is out of town is when I find myself searching for a good sit-down tac shooter.
I remember playing co-op in Ghost Recon on the Alpha Squad server. Their Co-op missions lasted 45 minutes to an hour sometimes. You had to read the briefing, chose your kit wisely, and then not screw up in the mission(or you got to spend a long time waiting....). When you have half an hour invested in completing a co-op mission things can get very tense.
One of the things that i liked about GR was that it took the emphasis off of fast-twitch mouse movements and focused even more on good observation and choosing your movement/positions/cover wisely.
THAT is what I want to play again. Well planned, well played online co-op with like-minded players.
I just downloaded X-fire(I've never used it before!) and I'll be playing some GR as soon as possible. Maybe this weekend I'll get a chance.
I remember playing co-op in Ghost Recon on the Alpha Squad server. Their Co-op missions lasted 45 minutes to an hour sometimes. You had to read the briefing, chose your kit wisely, and then not screw up in the mission(or you got to spend a long time waiting....). When you have half an hour invested in completing a co-op mission things can get very tense.
One of the things that i liked about GR was that it took the emphasis off of fast-twitch mouse movements and focused even more on good observation and choosing your movement/positions/cover wisely.
THAT is what I want to play again. Well planned, well played online co-op with like-minded players.
I just downloaded X-fire(I've never used it before!) and I'll be playing some GR as soon as possible. Maybe this weekend I'll get a chance.
i'm going to reinstall it.
I found you needed both addons for mp1+mp2 and i must remember the 2 mods i had as well...it was a long time ago.
i didn't like the way you had to use separate ubi software to browse games though.
I found you needed both addons for mp1+mp2 and i must remember the 2 mods i had as well...it was a long time ago.
i didn't like the way you had to use separate ubi software to browse games though.
What is tactical gaming anyway? To some it's Counterstrike to you it may be R6. Certainly both require some degree of tactics to be succesful but they are without a doubt different games.
There are still plenty of tactical shooters in the works or out there, but just as most people prefer fries and hamburgers the easier and more casual games are more successful on the market.
I think most developers noticed there's a niche of more serious gamers. Yet so far most try to get those "on the side" by including "hardcore modes" or by suggesting there was a depth in their games that just isn't there (see Dragon Rising).
There are still plenty of tactical shooters in the works or out there, but just as most people prefer fries and hamburgers the easier and more casual games are more successful on the market.
I think most developers noticed there's a niche of more serious gamers. Yet so far most try to get those "on the side" by including "hardcore modes" or by suggesting there was a depth in their games that just isn't there (see Dragon Rising).
Swat 4 is my all time favourite tactical MP experience. A group of you discussing loadouts before the round, each picking your role (breaching, clearing, commander, backstop, etc.) Deciding if you are going in hard or soft (less lethal, silenced or just BFGs and FMJs). You even end up with one guy often loaded up with something mundane like door wedges instead of flashbangs, so you can close off doors and areas behind you as you clear them to avoid being surprised.
Carefully stacking up on a door, One guy checking under it with an opti-wand and reporting enemy locations. Another preparing to breach. A 3rd ready with a flashbang or stinger grenade. Everyone else prepped to storm the room shouting and cover their arcs.
Charge goes, door swings open, stunned enemy "WTF!", flashbang is thrown, *CLUNK* hits the doorjam and lands in the midst of your team *FLASH* you stumble blindly as the enemy recovers and slaughters you all but you are all in hysterics at how you went from super cool uber tactical squad one second, to the 3 Stooges the next.
The pace is slower than most, but it just works. Even TDM is fun - I used to play with SMGs and Pistols and light armour etc. so I could be more mobile.
And with all the additional tactical equipment, game modes like the VIP escort and bomb disposal were all the more challenging. Knowing if you tried a door and found it wedged shut, that odds are you were already dead. My favourite tactic was to seal myself in a room with the bomb, wedge the doors and place charges on them. Then you just need to wait for the rattle of someone trying the handle and detonate the charge. Instant death to the guy on the other side of the door and a lot of annoyance.
In multiplayer especially I took great delight in arresting rather than killing other people. When you get the opportunity it is so humiliating. Even better you get the extra points for it and then can execute them straight afterwards for the ultimate in pwn.
OK now i need to reinstall Swat4 and find some people to play with again...
Carefully stacking up on a door, One guy checking under it with an opti-wand and reporting enemy locations. Another preparing to breach. A 3rd ready with a flashbang or stinger grenade. Everyone else prepped to storm the room shouting and cover their arcs.
Charge goes, door swings open, stunned enemy "WTF!", flashbang is thrown, *CLUNK* hits the doorjam and lands in the midst of your team *FLASH* you stumble blindly as the enemy recovers and slaughters you all but you are all in hysterics at how you went from super cool uber tactical squad one second, to the 3 Stooges the next.
The pace is slower than most, but it just works. Even TDM is fun - I used to play with SMGs and Pistols and light armour etc. so I could be more mobile.
And with all the additional tactical equipment, game modes like the VIP escort and bomb disposal were all the more challenging. Knowing if you tried a door and found it wedged shut, that odds are you were already dead. My favourite tactic was to seal myself in a room with the bomb, wedge the doors and place charges on them. Then you just need to wait for the rattle of someone trying the handle and detonate the charge. Instant death to the guy on the other side of the door and a lot of annoyance.
In multiplayer especially I took great delight in arresting rather than killing other people. When you get the opportunity it is so humiliating. Even better you get the extra points for it and then can execute them straight afterwards for the ultimate in pwn.
OK now i need to reinstall Swat4 and find some people to play with again...
whoever thinks counterstrike is a tactical game is wrong. counterstrike is setup to be somewhat tactical but it is a run & gun game through and through.
There are no tactical elements to it with the way people play it, only reaction time and accuracy. A real anti-terrorist swat team would not blindly run into a run with guns blazing, so if a game involves that then it is not tactical. Tactical games require some base of realism.
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A realistic damage system (one-shot-kills), freedom of movement and the rewarding of tactics, planning and communication over twitchy reaction times are the most important factors IMO. Add those things together and you pretty much already have a tactical shooter.
Tactical shooters are pretty much gone.
You have HoS coming out and future versions of ArmA.
Not much to choose from.
SWAT series seems to be dead, as is Ghost Recon and Rainbow 6.
GRAW 1/2 PC are okay light tactical shooters. Overall I found them pretty fun.
There is still hope that Black Foot Studios will release Ground Branch (developers of the original Rainbow 6), but I doubt they will get anything out in the next 2 or so years.
But yes, aside from HoS and ArmA, I don't see anything else coming along in the near future...
You have HoS coming out and future versions of ArmA.
Not much to choose from.
SWAT series seems to be dead, as is Ghost Recon and Rainbow 6.
GRAW 1/2 PC are okay light tactical shooters. Overall I found them pretty fun.
There is still hope that Black Foot Studios will release Ground Branch (developers of the original Rainbow 6), but I doubt they will get anything out in the next 2 or so years.
But yes, aside from HoS and ArmA, I don't see anything else coming along in the near future...
I think they just aren't very popular right now, but when the current generations of gamers grow out of their 360 run and gun fests, some of them will want something more.
I'm actually a "sensor thinker" according to typology and what you posted is 100% incorrect in my case.
Pretty much. The casual yet high production quality shooter is all the rage right now. The top publishers will eventually over saturate the market with these games, and the people that have been buying them will be unable to ignore the similarities anymore. They'll become the equivalent of Madden games. An entrenched IP that's kept going by diehard fans of that kind of game, and the fact they sequels can be produced far quicker and far cheaper than the originals.
Meanwhile, someone is going to do a tactical shooter that opens people's eyes again and gains mass appeal, and we'll be back to the era when there was a new Tom Clancy game every year.
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i love swat 4 until recently i played it quite a lot.
i've had problems with the PC i run it on but once it's back up i'd play coop with anyone here on that or any of the other games we're talking about.
you mean me? no, except arma i habitually play the older games that i mention time and time again in threads like this -
your so called 'tactical shooters' i guess.
My point was that, contrary to a few ppl i imagine, i don't feel i'm automatically a winner in the game of life just because i do.
i've had problems with the PC i run it on but once it's back up i'd play coop with anyone here on that or any of the other games we're talking about.
Someone plays one of the newer shooters.....
...
you mean me? no, except arma i habitually play the older games that i mention time and time again in threads like this -
your so called 'tactical shooters' i guess.
My point was that, contrary to a few ppl i imagine, i don't feel i'm automatically a winner in the game of life just because i do.
well it isn't a black and white kind of thing. I am referring to extreme sensor thinkers who show little signs of intuitive thinking, since they are the majority of sensors.
You can use both forms of thinking, it's just that most people don't.
There are more variables when you get in depth to it, but generally speaking if the majority of the population were intuitors, games like MW2 would not be as big of a hit as they are right now because they are too simple. Flashy explosions and mindless fighting and violence only appeal to a certain kind of person. Imo that kind of person is unbalanced sensor types which make up the majority of the population.
Also, i don't know what method you used to find out that you are a sensor, but most typology tests are not flawless and can be wrong. Food for thought.
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Taken quite a few of them actually over the years and all result in that (around 60% Sensor FYI). Don't want to derail the thread into a typology discussion but I think the constant pigeonholing of Sensors as stupid (check any site with people talking about typology) is ridiculous and inaccurate. There is more to society than typology and judging great swathes of the population based solely on a glorified personality test is flawed.
Signed, a sensor who cares more about gameplay than graphics.
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No one is pigeon-holeing them as stupid. They just appreciate games a in different way.
One of my best friends is most likely a sensor. Even during team play, he is always off by himself, storming along like a one man army. He doesn't always have the patience to stop and plan, he just wants to get right into it every time. In cooperative games, he's always the one leading the charge, always the one getting impatient when people want more time to plan or discuss.
That might be attributable to some other personality traits, but as far as his gaming goes, I'm not calling him stupid by any means. But he's very easily stimulated and very easily bored, and slower paced game...or even playing games AT a slower pace, does not appeal to him. He admits to me time and again, when I try to introduce him to new, off-beat games "Sorry man, I'm just the kind of person that is drawn to good graphics and less "fill in the mental blanks yourself" genres."
One of my best friends is most likely a sensor. Even during team play, he is always off by himself, storming along like a one man army. He doesn't always have the patience to stop and plan, he just wants to get right into it every time. In cooperative games, he's always the one leading the charge, always the one getting impatient when people want more time to plan or discuss.
That might be attributable to some other personality traits, but as far as his gaming goes, I'm not calling him stupid by any means. But he's very easily stimulated and very easily bored, and slower paced game...or even playing games AT a slower pace, does not appeal to him. He admits to me time and again, when I try to introduce him to new, off-beat games "Sorry man, I'm just the kind of person that is drawn to good graphics and less "fill in the mental blanks yourself" genres."
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stupid isn't the word I would use. there are no types that are better than other ones. when comparing extreme examples of sensor and intuitor people I think the words "simple" and "complex" fit better.
simple might seem like an implied insult to some, but complex might seem like a bad thing to other people also. it all depends on the individual.
in any case, I am well aware of the generalizations i'm making, but this is not a typology forum and i don't need to specify. my point is to just point out a good personality correlation in gaming that I think most people would not usually notice.
That is fairly balanced so you would definitely not relate as much to the more unbalanced sensors I or Nenjin are referring to.
And no I can't say with legitimate proof things like "most sensors are unbalanced" but imo most gamer sensors are, considering most gamers are younger and younger people are less developed and balanced personality wise.
This is what I'm talking about. Chances are his friend just has underdeveloped intuitive functions which would result in him not preferring to play those kinds of games and think in that kind of way. There's nothing wrong with that, it's a matter of preference.
metaphorically speaking, I don't play import games from japan because I don't speak japanese. literally speaking I don't play MW2 because it is not mind engaging and tactical enough. all of these preferences reflect how my particular thought process works and what "languages" my brain speaks.
Based on research I've done there are indeed more sensors in the world than intuitors. This thread strikes a topic that is basically a direct result of this kind of population difference (imo).
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Well, "underdeveloped" is a somewhat loaded term her. For reference, he is an avid reader, just devours books and has an active imagination. But when it comes to gaming, his first impulse is to act, not to consider.
I don't believe the tactical gaming market is a niche and that most people are into mindless pretty action fests. Clearly the Tom Clancy line of games sold well and was a popular franchise. I was also surprised that OFP sold well too, I totally thought it was some small niche game I discovered all those years ago.
Think about it, most tactical games are barely advertised, and those that are popular are far too hard to get into. What it comes down to is a lack of options. There is simply no current FPS out there that appeals to the mainstream audience and does not sacrifice it's tactical attributes. If some game developer were to make a tactical game with the scope and depth of ArmA 2 and with the high polish of and easily accessible as, say, a 1st party Nintendo title then they would be rich overnight.
IMO at this time, and in the near future, your largest selection for some tactical gaming would be in the RPG or RTS genres.
Think about it, most tactical games are barely advertised, and those that are popular are far too hard to get into. What it comes down to is a lack of options. There is simply no current FPS out there that appeals to the mainstream audience and does not sacrifice it's tactical attributes. If some game developer were to make a tactical game with the scope and depth of ArmA 2 and with the high polish of and easily accessible as, say, a 1st party Nintendo title then they would be rich overnight.
IMO at this time, and in the near future, your largest selection for some tactical gaming would be in the RPG or RTS genres.
