What Gunslinger Weapons should SharpShooter get?

[DeadPlayer123]

I stopped reading here. I give up. I'm out.

The porpoise of SS is to kill big zeds fast, its an required class on teams in small places with hard way outs. Playing SS with out railgun is just noobish, you will not be able to kill trash and mid zeds like other classes, and will not help much to kill big zeds as you could if using railgun, when 3 FPs arrive with 5 SCs, SS with rail can really help to take it fast with out caos, ant that is the way you should play with it, sorry if you dont like it. In our team, SS not using rail are just kiked.

 

[random]

^you said it, in your team.

i can certainly see the advantage of that way of play, but on the other hand if your team has other fast killers you can use another type of SS that compromises the top speed on big zeds for mid speed for bigs and fast for everything else with the M14.

the thing being that SS is likely the perk that benefits the most of good team coordination but suffers the most with the lack of it, so both styles are plenty viable depending on your team composition and tactics.

 

[NokiaSE]

None.

Sharpshooter is about precision weaponry. And for the time being, such type of weaponry doesn't coincide/share much of characteristics with any options from other perks, like how the Medic's HMTech-401 AR is indeed very much of an assault rifle that's used by the Commando perk.

That said, unless TWI rename the perk to Jerry Michulek, I feel crossing Gunslinger weaponry to Sharpshooter is nonsensible and vice versa - as if we're agreeing/suggesting to diminish the specialty/niche/uniqueness of the Gunslinger by allowing the Sharpshooter perk to utilize pistols just as efficient (elite reload) as the Gunslinger.


Still, the whole point of cross-perk weaponry is to allow perk proficiency with its given weaponry not to be lost entirely when it comes to the similarity of off-perk weapons - so the perk's weapon proficiency could work outside of the category, whether it's sorted by the perks themselves or the weapon types, and along with the actual attribute(s) that each weapon possesses.

In Sharpshooter's case, I think it's only sensible to linger its headshot bonus - and just the headshot bonus - onto weapons that are precision-centric enough to justify their crossover.

 

[Scrublord]

None.

Sharpshooter is about precision weaponry. And for the time being, such type of weaponry doesn't coincide/share much of characteristics with any options from other perks.

The single .500 definitely feels like a "precision" weapon. It's like a very compact sniper rifle.
I feel like getting proficiency with single pistols would allow it a bit of variety without stepping too much on GS's toes

 

[RoastinGhost]

I think single handguns only would be a good way to balance it. That way, the sharpshooter doesn't really have access to the Gunslinger's full arsenal, but still has a better way of defending itself against trash without excelling against it like KF1.

 

[Gladius]

I think single handguns only would be a good way to balance it. That way, the sharpshooter doesn't really have access to the Gunslinger's full arsenal, but still has a better way of defending itself against trash without excelling against it like KF1.

I suppose you didn't read the discussion in this thread.

Offperk 1911 and Deagle one-shots trash already without any perk bonuses.

They already have super fast reload without perk bonuses.

And this is why only the revolvers got perked on sharps. The 1858 perked on sharps now one-shots all trash and the magnums can kill scrakes and fleshpounds before a reload.

 

[Scrublord]

I suppose you didn't read the discussion in this thread.

Offperk 1911 and Deagle one-shots trash already without any perk bonuses.

so does the winchester and m14

 

[RoastinGhost]

I suppose you didn't read the discussion in this thread.

Offperk 1911 and Deagle one-shots trash already without any perk bonuses.

They already have super fast reload without perk bonuses.

And this is why only the revolvers got perked on sharps. The 1858 perked on sharps now one-shots all trash and the magnums can kill scrakes and fleshpounds before a reload.

It's not that I didn't read it. I'm just not really convinced that Sharpshooters should be engaging big zeds with another perk's full T4. On-perk bonuses may not be overly helpful for the 1911 and Deagle, but they're something. The weapons, and Sharpshooters' abilities against trash, would be better, if only a little. Recoil and switch speed, for instance, make a difference.

 

[Gladius]

Wouldn't that increased reload speed on Deagle/1911 contradict your requirement of not excelling against trash?

 

[Azukki]

Dual handguns and precision rifles on one perk felt conceptually disjointed in KF1, and fixing that was half the reason I was glad to see gunslinger added in KF2.
I'd like to see no duals crossperked for sharp.

 

[Gladius]

Dual handguns and precision rifles on one perk felt conceptually disjointed in KF1, and fixing that was half the reason I was glad to see gunslinger added in KF2.
I'd like to see no duals crossperked for sharp.

Besides that dogmatic thinking that this perk has to be about this and not that, what exactly should handguns be able to do on sharps, shots to kill wise, in your opinion? Are you saying that sharps should be able to kill fleshpounds with one single magnum?

 

[NokiaSE]

The single .500 definitely feels like a "precision" weapon. It's like a very compact sniper rifle.

In this particular day, I'm obliged to think that the Christmas elves forgot to put a stock and a scope on it. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

 

[WeretigerRei]

Voted for singles, but i think they should still get the dual tier 1s because single tier 1s are crap

 

[WeretigerRei]

Besides that dogmatic thinking that this perk has to be about this and not that, what exactly should handguns be able to do on sharps, shots to kill wise, in your opinion? Are you saying that sharps should be able to kill fleshpounds with one single magnum?

I personally dont think that. But if they want some options other than a Winchester to go with that Rail Gun that would be nice. Rail Gun + Magnum + Deagle was a solid loadout before multiperk weapons and its even better now.

 

[random]

I personally dont think that. But if they want some options other than a Winchester to go with that Rail Gun that would be nice. Rail Gun + Magnum + Deagle was a solid loadout before multiperk weapons and its even better now.

true, however that's kind of an end game loadout, i think the SS weakest link is the LAR that doesn't really makes much sense in base stats, currently the best candidate to fill that spot IMO would be the 1911, don't get me wrong the deagle and magnum are great, but sometimes the dmg/cost per bullet goes to waste, in that regard the higher bullet per clip and lower cost/ammo of the 1911 would be nice, plus the practical dmg is double of the 1858 (that thing needs a buff already).

 

[Watcher-45]

I'm all for keeping the classes separate, in other words Vanilla, but whoever mentioned the LAR being a typically western thing got me thinking.


What if "Gunslinger" was "Cowboy"? He already starts with the 1858 "New Army" revolver, and while the S&W .500 isn't exactly "cowboy" it's still a revolver. Take away the 1911 and Deagle and give him the LAR, and dare I say give him the Double-Barrel as well?

Replace the sharpy lever with something like an Enfield Mk1. Bolt action could have similar, but slower, ROF to the lever, 10 round mag, faster reload because stripper clips, maybe up the damage a smidge because it WILL be slower than the lever... I'm missing my "Single Piston Long Musket" from KF.

Replace the Support double-barrel with something modern and interesting. I remember the HSG from the original KF... Or what about a S&W Judge .410 revolver as a class specific side-arm?

And the 1911 and Deagle? Drop the dual wield and make them universal sidearms, and let us REPLACE the M9!


Ultimately I think it's too late for all that, but it never hurts to dream, right?



But at this point we're so far along you'd need to overhaul the perks to make any major changes. I think on order to give the Sharp access to several pistols two things need to happen.
1) The Gunslinger perks need to be redone to actually make dual wielding pistols as GS strategic advantage over using them as SS.
2) Pistol balance needs to be redone to not make them overpowerd compared to the LAR.

As is, with the idea of there being a "Pistolero" and "Marksman" it makes 100% perfect sense that the Sharpshooter has ONLY rifles and the Gunslinger has ONLY pistols. Giving the Sharp access to revolvers is interesting as a more effective way to control crowds when using the Railgun, but I also think it's unfair as a take-away from the Gunslinger.
If Sharp got their own dedicated handgun it could be interesting. Something weaker than the LAR but lighter and faster. Here's a fun idea, what about a .22 pistol like a Ruger 22/45 or a Browning Buckmark? Make it pretty damn weak but with a ridiculous headshot bonus so a whole mag to the chest will drop a clot but at the same time only one headshot will stop him? Ammo is dirt cheap, but don't let me carry a billion rounds.
If not, then something renowned for accuracy would be good. I'd say give Sharp the 1911. Accurate, quick, medium power, but then replace them in the Gunslinger perk with Glock 23s or something. And give the Sharp A 1911. It'll be a nice tactical choice vs the LAR since it won't have near the headshot power but can deal with crowds better.
And that's it.

 

[Azukki]

what exactly should handguns be able to do on sharps, shots to kill wise, in your opinion?

With enough left side skills active, having singles on-perk for sharp would be helpful mostly for some 1shots and 2shots against medium zed weak points and trash zed bodies that you wouldn't get off-perk. Examples:
1shot weakpoint: .500 vs husk head, deag vs albino clot head, 1911 vs husk tank, 1858 vs gorefast head
1shot body kill: .500 vs gorefast, deag vs clot/slasher/cyst, 1911 vs stalker, 1858 vs crawler
2shot weakpoint: deag vs husk head, 1911 vs albino clot head, 1911 vs gorefiend head, 1911 vs siren head

Being on perk would help single handguns for FP/SC, but not enough to make them appealing for that job, so you'd still want an M14, railgun, or maybe Xbow. This way, crossperks don't so viably replace all the true sharp weapons like dual 500s can and dual deags could, just supplement them.

Are you saying that sharps should be able to kill fleshpounds with one single magnum?

No idea where you got the idea that I implied anything remotely like that.
But, if you throw in a left-skills-active railgun headshot just afterward, sure.
Deag instead of .500 if you want. Giving up all wiggle room, you could maybe go for 1911 instead of .500, or xbow instead of railgun. Combos galore.


Watcher-45, it's not too late for them to back out of some of these crossperks, but taking weapons away from their long-established main perk would not go over well with lots of players, particularly the support's boomstick.

 

[S.N.A.F.U.]

Having not played the 1049 beta myself I don't have direct experience with what TWI has done with all this multi-perk weaponry wizardry. From what has been written here and elsewhere TWI has introduced bonuses to single revolvers for the Sharpshooter and I think that is an acceptable start. I'm of the opinion that Sharpshooter, should he be given handgun bonuses (beyond any given to the M9), should be kept only to single-wield handguns so as not to encroach too much on the Gunslinger's role and game-play. Furthermore, wherein I think I am in agreement with Azukki, any handgun bonuses Sharpshooter possesses should only make a significant difference when dealing with low and medium-tier zeds. As regard Scrakes and Fleshpounds the bonus-buffed handguns should ideally be supplementary to well-placed shots from primary weapons (e.g. Sharpshooter hits a Railgun head-shot on a Scrake and follows up with some amount of .500 or Hand Cannon head-shots to finish him).

 

[Gladius]

With enough left side skills active, having singles on-perk for sharp would be helpful mostly for some 1shots and 2shots against medium zed weak points and trash zed bodies that you wouldn't get off-perk. Examples:
1shot weakpoint: .500 vs husk head, deag vs albino clot head, 1911 vs husk tank, 1858 vs gorefast head
1shot body kill: .500 vs gorefast, deag vs clot/slasher/cyst, 1911 vs stalker, 1858 vs crawler
2shot weakpoint: deag vs husk head, 1911 vs albino clot head, 1911 vs gorefiend head, 1911 vs siren head

Being on perk would help single handguns for FP/SC, but not enough to make them appealing for that job, so you'd still want an M14, railgun, or maybe Xbow. This way, crossperks don't so viably replace all the true sharp weapons like dual 500s can and dual deags could, just supplement them.

No idea where you got the idea that I implied anything remotely like that.
But, if you throw in a left-skills-active railgun headshot just afterward, sure.

The thing is that off-perk magnums are already 2-hitting mediums. And being able to do it in one hit doesn't bring significantly different gameplay. Being able to kill SC/FP with the magnums on sharps on the other hand, does bring significantly different gameplay options, especially for players that use the EBR and struggle with landing 14-16 hits on an unstunned FP. And it doesn't make the gunslinger obsolete at all, because the gunslinger is about mobility and hipfire accuracy, while sharps has to be static for his full damage potential. If sharps would only get his bonuses on single handguns and not on duals, then this whole cross-perk thing would be witless.

It is wrong to look at sharps vs. slinger in a dogmatic box thinking. We have certain skills bonuses and weapons to combine and there has to be a spectrum of flexible gameplay options to use all that for the best variety. Not for everyone the sharps is all about lame stuns and the railgun.

 

[Gladius]

As regard Scrakes and Fleshpounds the bonus-buffed handguns should ideally be supplementary to well-placed shots from primary weapons (e.g. Sharpshooter hits a Railgun head-shot on a Scrake and follows up with some amount of .500 or Hand Cannon head-shots to finish him).

You can already do that with unperked pistols.