That's true. You'd have to limit their numbers as you limit snipers or flamethrowers.
Vietnamese Women in Combat
- Thread starter Jessika
- Start date
That's true. You'd have to limit their numbers as you limit snipers or flamethrowers.
So are you implying that
1) women would be as big as men in-game or
2) women would be smaller but still have hitboxes as big as men?
I've been looking around and it seems women weren't really present in combat. Generally they formed their own units.
They would be smaller, but only by a fraction (hitboxes would be smaller also) but as this is the Rising Storm franchise a smaller hitbox means nothing. If you have a shot on someone they will most likely die, regardless of the size of their hitbox.
Advantage is advantageous. A fraction of any advantage is enough for me to pick it every single time no matter what.
There is that cracked acorn in RO 2, when you hit the spot, but what kind of icon there would be in the kill feed, when you kill a woman character by shooting to her groin.
That shot would obviously be a miss.
Legitimate concern here. But as opposed to an option, I would think that it should just be allocated randomly. The notion of a smaller hitbox might also be a way to give a material, but hardly noticeable edge to the Viets. Since in RS, the Japanese soldiers were far shorter than the Americans, but suffered no such resultant debuff to stamina or gun recoil.
That would be a way to balance it however, and I think it would provide a far more authentic experience. Having female soldiers allocated randomly to Viets, and said female soldiers suffering penalties to recoil as a result of having a smaller frame.
Now that would be immersive.
That sounds perfect. Would anyone really care too much if they sized them all nearly the same? (Just a thought. Would work as a placeholder?) Having it randomly allocated, like having it added to a list of models that the player randomly spawns with would work great!
Except that you'd need a new Phys Asset (Collision and Hit detection) for each one.
And a new model. And new textures.
If there were 64 different player models and physics assets, it'd take up a lot of memory.
Yeesh, you're so right. You should tell TWI to make everyone use the same model instead, and why don't you tell them to roll back the addition of the black character model too because it's just so resource intensive!!! /s
I actually just realized there were more women combatants than black american soldiers in Vietnam, yet here we are?
Black servicemen were 12.6% of the American combat forces (~60,000).
The sources I've read list nearly 200,000 Vietnamese women involved in combat operations. Even if you start taking huge cuts and claiming most were not involved in direct combat, you'll still find numbers matching or exceeding that of the black servicemen.
(Check out "Even the Women Must Fight by Karen Gottschang," it has a plethora of referenced works in it, and the author did a lot of field work travelling to Vietnam to interview with women warriors, and exchanged letters and contact info with as many as it was possible to get a hold of. It was a way better read than I could have imagined.
)Oh, and honestly it doesn't take the resources you think it does, there are so many assets that can be reused that don't actually put any further load on anyone. I'm ecstatic they included a black player soldier in the US forces, and I think they can do exactly the same thing with little trouble for the North Vietnamese women without incurring any performance issues.
@Jessika
Would you mind listing the sources? It is hard to find any definitive information aside from random anecdotes, some of which are dubious at best.
Would you mind listing the sources? It is hard to find any definitive information aside from random anecdotes, some of which are dubious at best.
You were saying everyone should have a different individual skeletal mesh, static mesh attachments, new textures for said meshes. Using a new player model for Vietnamese women (just one.) would not incur massive performance drops. Using a unique mesh for every person would. I also find it hard to believe that there would be higher percentages of women fighting for the Viet Cong than African American men fighting for the USMC & US Army.
I'm not saying Vietnamese women didn't participate, I'm saying in terms of the entire scale of the war it was negligible, not that they didn't do anything, they did, but it's a very small factor. If AMG wants to they can, they will focus on stuff that actually needs attention before they'd even look to something like this. It's like saying we should add the USMC Raider battalions to Rising storm, because they're badass, even though they are a small minority of a massive armed force.
Well that's not really a good example since they did add the Marauders, which where literally just a single unit.
they should have. Japan's postwar Type 64 was downloaded from standard 7.62x51mm NATO cartridges because of the generally smaller stature of their soldiers.
realistically this would be even worse for vietnamese women given that they would be even lighter and smaller than the standard japanese soldier (due to communist rationing) Simple kinematics would say that they would suffer significantly worse muzzle jump and sight time for realignment. Women are simply worse at shooting than men, given the same amount of training. The Marine Corps study that compared women in Infantry MOS that showed them giving worse effective hits on target compared to men in POG MOS proves this. And this is with M16A4/M27 IAR rifles, which have much less recoil impulse compared to Type 56 assault rifles and Type 56 Carbines.
thinking won't change reality, they also suffered training injuries in rates that were significantly higher than men.
There's a reason why there were no women in frontline soviet units such as GSFG during the cold war and that women in Soviet military service were quickly pushed out of the front line as soon as the Soviets won more battles. Women in the Soviet military postwar were primarily in rear echelon roles such as the medical corps and HQ staff.
Indeed, contemporary literature suggests that women in the Vietnam war primarily served noncombat roles and only served into combat when pushed.
bbbbut muh women snipers.
Show me a picture of a woman sniper in Afghanistan in the 1979 intervention. Soviets tried that and decided it wasn't worth it.
TL : DR playing as a woman would suck so that would be another reason not to add them. But if the devs want to add a combat class that is markedly inferior in every combat aspect to the male class but the smaller hitbox, good on them.
Also the majority of photos in your OP are propaganda, it's pretty clear by the staging and style.
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While I'm sure there were many women and children who fought, they don't make up for a big enough portion for it to be realistically implemented in game.
Keep it as it is. Plus it always sounds like porn when I play as a woman in a video game, their screams of getting shot are too similar to their screams of getting ****ed in the ***.
Keep it as it is. Plus it always sounds like porn when I play as a woman in a video game, their screams of getting shot are too similar to their screams of getting ****ed in the ***.