Victory for Team Realism?

[Spartan1388]

Killing Floor II smells like victory for Team Realism!

Good to see that all of our suggestions and pages upon pages of text did not gone to waste!

Now it is time for Team Realism be summoned and discuss.

Alright, we got Paris instead of America, but I see what they did here. Paris is the city of light, but with the ZEDs crawling around, it is now a city of darkness. It is a metaphor.

Seeing the screenshots and video for the early development stages, I do have some concerns.

Brace yourselves, opinions are coming.

!!! PERSONAL OPINION ALERT !!!

But dear TWI, Killing Floor looks like nothing more than Killing Floor I with better graphics. For now, we have the same characters, same weapons and same ZEDs in new maps.

No, just now!

You should give us new characters! Primarily French, and some foreign volunteers or tourists or whatever, but they must be new! I do not really care to see The Foster family again along with their their steampunk versions.
(Oh, you should add a Greek character. There are many of them in France and UK.)

Forget about the Desert camo SCAR already! This is a weapons that some American units use in Iraq and Afghanistan. There are no deserts in France and the French use the FAMAS.
Also keep in mind that France is very prohibitive about private possession of arms by its sla... ehm, I mean "citizens", so for the sake of reaslism, you should first add weapons that are used by the Police and Army there, older weapons that can be found in Army warehouses, guns that citizens have, like shotguns, and weapons that you can find from the Black Market as well as improvised weapons.
Don't do the same think that you did with Killing Floor I, alright?
( You know, Lasers before SMLE and then more Lasers and still no SMLE... )

Promises have been made about adding realistic weapons. GOOD!
Keep it that way!
Realistic ZEDs would also be essential. A shot to the chest of a Clot should kill it or at least drop it down. If a ZED is supposed to be tough, give it some armour, like steel.

I agree that Killing Floor is "Coolism" and that some "Realism" has to be "sacrificed", this is happening all the time in art. I do understand that this is not a real life like Holodeck simulation from Star Trek, and that even Holodeck users wouldsacrifice realism for coolism to make their experience more enjoyable. Kirk was a cheater, remember?
Games that aim for 100% realism really s##k, but I hope that realism will not be slaughtered in the shrine of Coolism and we will end up having only cool stuff but not actual realism.
Killing Floor is supposed to be about Survival - Horror. It should be like 80-70% Realism, 20-30% Coolism.

Killing Floor II is going to be more bloody and gory. Good!
Any chance for that ZED dissection minigame...?

Maybe we can have anatomically correct ZEDs, (where applicable) since the game is going to be 18+ anyway?

 

[mrsirr]

WOOOO :O
I like realism where applicable and I do understand that it's not always applicable.

Maybe we can have anatomically correct ZEDs, (where applicable) since the game is going to be 18+ anyway?

Mmmm <:I
I dunno about this, I'd rather not have to avert mine eyes constantly.

 

[Chimpster]

Disclaimer: I realize your post is an opinion piece, but by extension, so is my response

I don't see the purpose of anatomically correct ZED's. Do we really need to see Clot penises and Stalker vaginas?

As for the characters, it's pretty much a given they will be adding new characters. After all, they make sales from new character skins anyway, and I highly doubt they'd just do a copy and paste job of characters in the default game. Pretty sure there will be French people seeing as how we have Paris, and I'm sure numerous other new characters.

I also think restricting the fire arms to "realistic" models for the locale is bad. This is an arcade type shooter, not a simulation like ARMA 3. Worrying about weapon models available in France and the UK for realism is a pointless endeavor in a game about monstrous creatures created by a corporation destroying Europe. CS:GO has all sorts of unrealistic weapon skins and nobody seems to mind that. I'll take fun over realism any day, especially in a game like this.

Chest shots dropping a ZED is also a bad idea. That would make things way too easy. We already have head shots, extending that to the body and the game would be horribly easy mode. Plus, these aren't humans, you can slice off their limbs and they keep coming after you, so I'd argue that a shot to the chest dropping them wouldn't be realistic in that scenario.

Realism is an okay thing, but not if it comes at the expense of fun.

 

[Redthirst]

But dear TWI, Killing Floor looks like nothing more than Killing Floor I with better graphics. For now, we have the same characters, same weapons and same ZEDs in new maps.

And...? Killing Floor 1 is almost perfect. Of course, there are some flaws, but all in all, you don't need to change much. Otherwise players will have a lot of complains.
Also, I think that you will be able to suggest everything you want when they release Early Access for KF2. It seems like gathering player opinions on various aspects of the game seems like Tripwire's primary goal.

 

[Zerginfestor]

...Realism...I'm sorry, but I think you need to see a doctor, badly, because GRAPHIX!!1101!=/=Realism. You still got special force units somehow dressing like punks, and punks somehow armed and knowledgeable of firearms, Zeds that are all hilariously ridiculous in their form. You got a Fleshpound that has metal shards jutting out of it's legs, yet it can run FASTER than you? It's somehow resistant to bullets despite being almost completely naked? You got a female who's got a thing for leather embedding in her skin, her eyes are missing, and somehow can track you down and scream so loud, your skull fragments and explodes outward. Somehow merging Spider DNA and Human DNA made...that thing. Yeah, total realism. Also, "America"? Where the hell did you get that idea? The situation all took in England, with a few slips into America (for no damn reason other than to change the scenery a bit). It's taking place into Paris because England soon got overrun by the Zeds while their military was....somewhere, I guess.

as for Zeds to be correct anatomically, hell no. NO. That's beyond stupid. Think about it, a Fleshpound dying to a single 9mm shot to the chest where the heart cavity is? Or dead from a single shot into the brain pan? Ye-no. Also, they wouldn't even be close to intimidating if they were lean, average human height while not even close to buff. Gorefasts wouldn't even be able to move with such high pain from their skin being gone. Clots would be as tall as an average human(they're slightly smaller in-game), which technically, would make headshots even easier. Scrakes wouldn't be intimidating, Bloats would hardly walk, etc.

As for 'armor', you do realize that bullets can penetrate something like steel remarkably well, right? It would look beyond silly to see an army of clots with body armor like that of SWAT teams (and not the funny kind of silly...the stupid kind of silly).

pissing on the SCAR, yet stating weapons being available in the blackmarket? You know that means the SCAR could come from a 'store' like that, right?

 

[Skell]

I don't know what you're celebrating since the game looks more romanticized than realistic... Also, that personal opinion list is a list of demands. Wouldn't there not be a need for it if the game was going to be 'realistic'?

Either way, you haven't 'won' or whatever you want to call it. I hope TWI keeps doing what their doing with the next installment of their popular arcade shooter - it looks really cool.

Please don't make this the 'muh reelizm' game these people are looking for... they can go play COD if they wanted that.

 

[silverlighted]

I don't care if there are anatomically realistic Zeds. But it seems like a waste of time and resources.

And if you want to go the so-called realism route, I mean. Isn't it reasonable that the zeds' experimentation may have removed some of those unnecessary parts.

 

[Zerginfestor]

I don't care if there are anatomically realistic Zeds. But it seems like a waste of time and resources.

And if you want to go the so-called realism route, I mean. Isn't it reasonable that the zeds' experimentation may have removed some of those unnecessary parts.

technically speaking, having the zeds as experiments is just overall dumb save for the Fleshpound. They're all failed experiments, so why bother having them alive and around? It's usually best to scrap and go back to the drawing board instead of keeping the freaks around.

 

[mrsirr]

I just prefer a tolerable level of unrealism. Alot of people dismiss Killing Floor as being completely unrealistic in every way, but the thing is, some people actually don't know enough about biology and physics to know that alot of the things in this game are either completely possible or have already been done.
To me it doesn't so much matter if context is correct, if we are in France and we all have AK12s then I'm cool with that. Regular humans are also capable of continueing to function after being shot in the chest or head, so this doesn't bother me alot either.
There's really no realistic explanation for continueing to fight once decapitated, but I can suspend my disbelief on this one.

 

[larkstongues42]

KF1 looks for more "real" than KF2 does. Just look at the FP, it's like something out of borderlands. I've much rather than a "real" looking enemies and good game play mechanics than what most people call "realism." `~`

"realism" in a video game hue

 

[mrsirr]

Just look at the FP, it's like something out of borderlands.

I dunno, I don't see any reason a human can't be that big, especially a geneticly engineered human, plus it better explains why he can take so much abuse.

 

[Moskeeto]

I dunno, I don't see any reason a human can't be that big, especially a geneticly engineered human, plus it better explains why he can take so much abuse.

I think he's referring to the color palette and overall aesthetics.

 

[mrsirr]

I think he's referring to the color palette and overall aesthetics.

Oh like just the graphics in general?
It's strange it seems like as graphics get more visually impressive they get further and further from reality.

 

[larkstongues42]

Pretty much everything about it. I can almost hear it say "Come on little one."

 

[Spindletop]

I honestly don't care at all about how realistic this game is going to be as long as they don't do away with the features and and dlc that helped the game be so successful in the first place. Ahem~ >Foster Family

 

[Spartan1388]

The whole "rant" (?) is about the developers who promised realism, so all the realism nerds, with myself proudly included in this team, have reasons to be happy and celebrate, but do they?


If KF II is just KF I with better graphics, everyone who is not a, sorry for the term, a graphics "b####, has not much reason to buy KF II.

KF II should still be KF, but it should have something different. Why not the actual survival horror setting that KF f#### up?

Arma games are just simulations. Simulations are usually boring. A survival horror game should be realistic but not boring.
Think of S.T.A.L.K.E.R.

Anatomical correctness might include nudity, but this would hardly be an issue for a game that is going to be strictly adult. Alright, I understand that there are taboos, but getting a game in 2015 with great graphics and detail and the Clots will have their "tool" cut and everything sutured? Anatomical correctness does not necessarily mean depiction of reproductive organs.
Since the first day I played KF I I wander how the poor Clots pee. They might be sterile, but they still have to pee.
Some tubes, or something like a medical devise can be added there, or dress them. Stalkers in KF 1 used to wear naughty underwear to hide their genitalia and there is the back story of scientist getting mad in the labs where the Stalkers were created to explain this.

Guns are a big issue in a FPS game.
They should be realistic otherwise the horror survival setting breaks when people start running around dressed as chickens and wielding Laser rifles that look like they came from a cartoon.
This is done to give to the players better weapons, but giving strong weapons to players does not mean Lasers. You can give them shotguns pistols, Molotovs, improvised weapons, limited capacity "civilian" weapons, and if they are lucky some SMGs from the police. The higher triers will include assault/battle rifles, grenades, mines/pipes, sniper rifles and other army issue weapons as well as stuff from black market (AKs).

The SCAR is not as widely used as the AK or the M16.
AKs appear all around the world, in places where the logical conclusion is that they were bought from the Black Market. M16s are more rare, but you can still see them around.

Having 60% weapons that can be found in France and 30% Black Market and 10 % experimental Horzine technology and all the others would be better in my opinion, as we will get the chance to use some real historical French weapons like the Lebel rifle, but I do hope the Chauchat won't be included.

CSGO is a multiplayer shooter. It has no survival horror elements, and the Camos are just micro-transaction to generate profit.
In CSGO you own these weapons, to you can paint them and put stickers on them. People in the USA do at all the time. Actually, if I was in the USA, I would probably had a Black-Purple AR15.

Bullets can penetrate steel, yes, but if the steel piece is too thick, you will need Armour Piercing rounds, and even those cannot penetrate thicker pieces. The targets that shooters, athletes and soldiers shoot are usually steel and armour nowadays is not just steel. There are ceramics and other stuff sandwiched to make armour including exotic things like depleted Uranium.

The current FP is just a brute with a LaForge Visor, grinders for forearms, and a traffic light stuck at its chest.
Some armour could be added to the FP, either under or over its skin, or both. The head should be very heavily armed as well.

Yes, blind sirens that can track you also make no sense, but I believe that with the sounds they make they can move like bats. Like a biological sonar.

Brick from Borderlands is a good guy. He does not look like an FP. He is a nice and gentle man with a good heart. Do not compare him to a FP or you will make him sad. He would rip you in half if you make him sad.


Now, about the shot in the chest.
A normal human can be rendered unable to fight or run after a strong punch to the chest. A bullet is another story, but it should at least shake a Clot a little and I see no reason why the heart should not be a vital area for lesser ZEDs, just like the head is. Even if the Clots are modified so that they can repair themselves in a few moments by instantly creating scar tissue, the heart is still a vital organ.
Maybe during ZED time, brains and hearts will be flashing bright orange so that you can aim at them. Well, that is actually a good idea!
This is also traditional, and it would be nice to aim for the heads and hearts and hold the line against slow moving ZEDs, and then armoured FPs come out and your bullets just bounce of. This would promote teamwork and underpower the Zerker as many people want. Some friends are going to kill me for saying that, but anyway... (Zerkers can get a "lightsaber" later (DLC) )

PS.
Actually I would like to see the French cousin of Mr. Foster, Monsieur LaFoster in KF II, but Foster has stuff to no in England. There are still ZEDs to kill there and after that he has to sell plastic containers to people.

 

[Redthirst]

The whole "rant" (?) is about the developers who promised realism, so all the realism nerds, with myself proudly included in this team, have reasons to be happy and celebrate, but do they?

Where did devs promised it?

If KF II is just KF I with better graphics, everyone who is not a, sorry for the term, a graphics "b####, has not much reason to buy KF II.

And what is the reason for people to buy KF2 if there will be your unnecessary realism. If you want to play realistic game, KF is not your game, try DayZ or something.

 

[CrashFu]

Oh like just the graphics in general?
It's strange it seems like as graphics get more visually impressive they get further and further from reality.

We achieved almost perfect graphical realism and then immediately got bored of it and went back to fancy rendering effects and artistic color palettes.

MADDEN 2015! NOW WITH CEL-SHADING!

 

[mrsirr]

Where did devs promised it?

It was an interview or something I believe, they said there were some specific unrealistic things about KF1 that would be made realistic in KF2

And what is the reason for people to buy KF2 if there will be your unnecessary realism. If you want to play realistic game, KF is not your game, try DayZ or something.

What about us realism folks who want to have fun and realism?

 

[Chimpster]

Maybe during ZED time, brains and hearts will be flashing bright orange so that you can aim at them. Well, that is actually a good idea!

You make a gigantic post about realism and then toss out this idea. Seems like we get to cherry pick our realism. And if we're discussing realism, then ZED time shouldn't even be in the game at all, but I think most everybody still wants it in there.