Trenches and muzzle flashes

[Stoffel]

It irks me that almost all of the trench maps suck, when that was the typical fight of the eastern front all through the war. So I've spent a lot of time between map loadings trying to think of ways that it could be better. I dont know if all of the ideas would work, but its worth throwing my 2 cents in when it doesnt actually cost me anything...

1. Get rid of the maze like trenches.
2. Get rid of the 'make it fair' open ended flanks that allow easy bypass of a trench.
3. Get rid of hills around trenches and foxholes that enemies can climb and shoot down from. What dumb *** commander would allow that?
4. Add more grenades. In fact, if you could make a role of two or three guys that carry the briefcase looking boxes of grenades, that would be even better.
5. Taking the example from DH Omaha, add trip wires infront of the trenches that if touched, would set off explosives.
6. Get rid of muzzle flashes on the guns. I know its realistic, but with the marksman aim you have in the game, it makes it way to easy to take someone out at hundreds of yards. Diminish the tracers from the MG so that its not such a HERE I AM signal. From what I've read of eastern front battles, sometimes it was impossible to find concealed mg's until right infront of them.
7. And finally, if it could be done, limit the player count to 2-1 in favor of the attackers. Especially if it is the russians attacking. Give the attackers a bigger reinforcement percentage too.


And just to throw in a bit more, I would love to see some better night battles. Equip an officer with a flair gun that would light up the sky for several minutes, until it had to be shot off again.

 

[Apples]

4. Add more grenades. In fact, if you could make a role of two or three guys that carry the briefcase looking boxes of grenades, that would be even better.

Oh god no.

6. Get rid of muzzle flashes on the guns. I know its realistic, but with the marksman aim you have in the game, it makes it way to easy to take someone out at hundreds of yards.

Measure the maps in the RO SDK. You will see 99% of kills in this game are made under 100 yards. In fact, even the largest infantry maps are rarely over 250m wide at the front, and only 50m deep with no-man's land. Take Basovka for example. The area between the Russian trenches and the German line of rocks is probably 30m at most.

Diminish the tracers from the MG so that its not such a HERE I AM signal. From what I've read of eastern front battles, sometimes it was impossible to find concealed mg's until right infront of them.

Good machine gunners don't get shot easily. Admittedly, the game doesn't quite have the suppression effect, but any player can make up for that by learning how to take cover, deploy, and fire efficiently.

7. And finally, if it could be done, limit the player count to 2-1 in favor of the attackers. Especially if it is the russians attacking. Give the attackers a bigger reinforcement percentage too.

Reinforcements are easily changed by the mapper. Most maps do have a slightly larger manpower pools for the attacking side, and they're pretty balanced as it is.

Making uneven teams is another story...I suppose a mutator could do it. But would players even like that?

 

[Killarfromspace]

1. Agreed.
2. Really agree.
3. Also agree.
4. No, no way. No more grenades. Wanna know why? it's because it will lead to grenade spam ( just look at call of duty 4 or TFC ), and there is enough of grenade spam as it is, it's also a realism game and actually some soldiers didn't even get a grenade in WW2, in stalingrad some people didn't even get a gun, that's crazy!
5. Agreed, but only let engineers use them.
6. No, no, no. Muzzle flashes are the only way to find MG nests or snipers in WW2, if you'd remove it in this game then this forum would end up with Threads saying; OMG HOW DID HE KILL ME. Also without tracers a machinegunner wouldn't know where to shoot or have the same accuracy.
7. Agreed with the reinforcement boost on stalingrad charge maps

 

[CommissarGrob]

4. No, no way. No more grenades. Wanna know why? it's because it will lead to grenade spam ( just look at call of duty 4 or TFC ), and there is enough of grenade spam as it is, it's also a realism game and actually some soldiers didn't even get a grenade in WW2, in stalingrad some people didn't even get a gun, that's crazy!

There were more then enough guns to go around by 1942..... looks like someones been watching enemy at the gates...

 

[Zetsumei]

if trenches are made the way you want even though more realistic then the maps become as badly balanced as DH's omaha.

 

[Lt_Kettch]

Dunno why everybody always says a WWI game wouldn't work. What Stoffel described is pretty much how trench warfare in the First World War worked like. And since I am pro WWI biased I agree with Stoffel.

 

[Mormegil]

I wouldn't mind seeing the tracer opacity turned down during daylight battles - they're a bit bright for day-time.

I also understand muzzle flashes aren't 100%, so maybe only make the muzzle flash visible a percentage of the time, at least on rifles.

 

[Oldih]

Dunno why everybody always says a WWI game wouldn't work.

Mainly because way too many thinks that WW1 was just random human waves from trenches with bayonets attached and machineguns just keeps mowing them down.

And not to mention that mediasexiness of WW1 is nonexistant.

 

[Food_for_Powder]

1. Get rid of the maze like trenches.

Don't Agree. A maze-like layout helps a trench system defend itself in the event that the attackers are able to gain a foothold in the trenches themselves. The defenders have a far better knowledge of what goes where. The in-game map kinda ruins the effect of that, though, as both attackers and defenders can see how everything is laid out. Maybe it would be cool to have the map work sort of like in 'age of empires' where presence (in this case recon/intel) makes what the ingame map shows appear in more detail? There's a new class right there. Aufklarer.

2. Get rid of the 'make it fair' open ended flanks that allow easy bypass of a trench.

Agree under the condition that the scenario historically dictates that there was no flanking attempted. If the attackers were able to make flanking manoeuvers originally, we should be able to, too.

3. Get rid of hills around trenches and foxholes that enemies can climb and shoot down from. What dumb *** commander would allow that?

Agree sort of. Logically, any feature that dominates the landscape is going to be occupied by the defenders initially, either as an OP, or as part of the defensive works, in this case a trench. The defenders should start out occupying these positions, or be able to reach them well before the enemy. If the attackers are able to route the defenders and use these positions against the defenders, well tough luck.
Another thing to consider is that some of the maps we play on, we are entering into a middle or later stage of an already existing battle, where the defenders have lost their ideal positions on the battlefield and are just trying to hold on.

4. Add more grenades. In fact, if you could make a role of two or three guys that carry the briefcase looking boxes of grenades, that would be even better.

Agree with those who say yes to more grenades, so long as it is restricted to a specific class.

5. Taking the example from DH Omaha, add trip wires infront of the trenches that if touched, would set off explosives.

Aren't tripwires more of a Vietnam and onward thing? I would certainly agree to minefields, though. A beast of a map would be a trench fronted by a thick line of wire which was fronted by a minefield. Force the attackers to use their engineers to satchel (or bangalore, if applicable) their way first through the mines, then through the wire, and then into the nitty-gritty of trench fighting.
An interesting by-product of that though would be mine clearing tanks. How much fun would it be to crew a Sherman 'Crab'?!

And just to throw in a bit more, I would love to see some better night battles. Equip an officer with a flair gun that would light up the sky for several minutes, until it had to be shot off again.

[/quote]
A flare gun would be neat, but wouldnt it be even cooler to be able to request illumination via artillery? Star Shells, anyone?