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The State of Balance in Killing Floor

Hedon

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 14, 2009
36
1
0
For the record, Killing Floor a decently balanced game. For the most part. That said, in my opinion, there's some glaring issues with certain classes that needs to be adressed before it really shines gameplay wise.

Perks

Commando - Level 5

- 50% more damage with Bullpup
- 30% less recoil with Bullpup
- 20% faster reload with all weapons
- 60% discount on Bullpup|Spawn with a Bullpup
- Can see cloaked Stalkers from 16m
- Can see enemy health from 16m|Up to 3 Zed-Time Extensions

Requirements:
Kill 4,000 Stalkers with Bullpup.
Deal 3,500,000 damage with Bullpup.

Balance Level: Needs some work

Problems with the Perk

#1 - Levelling. The Commando is the hardest class to level bar none, due to the fact that it relies on targetting a SPECIFIC enemy, which compared to most other enemies is spawned quite infrequently. This needs to be adressed. My suggestion: Remove this mechanic entirely.

#2 - Lack of a Power Weapon. When the Fleshpounder comes, what do commandos do? Their only hopes are either to continuously bait the Fleshpounder with the Bullpup, or pick up a weapon outside of its perk, such as the Hunting Shotgun. This is a big flaw. My Suggestion: Make the LAW a part of this Perk, giving Commandos enough carrying capacity to carry both the LAW and the Bullpup.

#3 - 20% Faster Reload Time - This ability is misleading. If you're not using this 20% faster reload time with the Bullpup, what would you be using it on? If you are using another class' weapon, why aren't you simply playing that class and getting a damage bonus instead?

#4 - Seeing health bars. This ability is 99.9% Useless save for one situation. Fleshpounders. Even then it's a tossup simply because of one reason. Either way, you absolutely must kill your target. There is no timer countdown where you can ignore a ZED eventually. Furthermore, on anything but a Scrake and up, health bars don't even matter! They're dead in seconds! My suggestion - Get rid of this mechanic and replace it with something else. Possibly more ammo capacity for the Bullpup.

#5 - Their unique ability barely counts for jack ****. Being able to see cloaked stalkers is slighlty beneficial, but over time you can easily identify a stalker at range from the shadow on the ground and the visible outline that a stalker still has. The other arguement that can be made in support of this ability is the Patriarch. While true, you're better off having a firebug in this situation to simply light him on fire, because you can see the flames still, allowing for more damage and tracking even easier, because now the whole group can see it. My suggestion: Change this ability to a fixed radius where stalkers getting near the commando are seen by everyone instead of just the commando.

Medic - Level 5

- 150% faster Syringe recharge
- 50% more potent medical injections
- 75% less damage from Bloat Bile
- 30% faster movement speed
- 50% better Body Armor
- 60% discount on Body Armor
- Spawn with body armor

Requirements:
Heal 25,000 HP on your teammates.

Balance Level - Perfect. It's my opinion that the medic is a shining example of balance in this game. While the perk has no true bonus to offense, its defenses allow it to excel in an offensive role still, allowing for a Healing class that can both help and do well in a fight. My suggestion - Leave as is.

Sharpshooter - Level 5

- 50% more damage with Handcannon, Rifle, and Crossbow
- 75% less recoil with Handcannon, Rifle, and Crossbow
- 50% faster reload with Handcannon, Rifle, and Crossbow
- 50% extra headshot damage
- 60% discount on Handcannon
- Spawn with Dual Handcannons

Requirements:
Get 5,500 headshot kills with Handcannon, Rifle or Crossbow

Balance Level - Questionable. Near perfect? The main problem with this Perk is the fact that headshots in this game are slightly wonky. Anything but surgical precision results in a shoulder shot in most cases, leading to frustrated Sharpshooters not getting their damage bonuses in.

Problems with the Perk

#1 Wonky hit detection on the Head. I don't know if this is intended to be more hard than other games, or if decreasing the difficulty in attaining a headshot would create an imbalance with this class. That said, to a truly skilled player, the handicap against headshots that the game gives can be overcome.

Bugs

#1 Dual Handcannons count as Shotgun damage. I'm not sure if this also causes it to not give a Sharpshooter his damage bonus on them, and I'm quite sure this causes headshots to be discounted. This absolutely needs to be adressed.


Firebug - Level 5

- 50% extra Flamethrower damage
- 100% resistance to fire
- 100% extra Flamethrower range
- Grenades set enemies on fire
- 60% discount on the FlameThrower
- Spawn with a FlameThrower

Requirements:
Deal 3,500,000 damage with the Flamethrower.

Level of Balance - Needs some work. Seemingly, the Firebug is there to put out stupid amounts of damage in a short amount of time. Unfortunately, this class is completely dwarfed by anything that the Support Specialist can do, but that's for another section.

Problems with the Perk

#1 Flamethrower ammo concerns - Although one fireball can often fry A clot or Crawler, the Flamethrower absolutely chews through ammo for smaller benefit than most guns it seems. Against a Scrake or Fleshpound, it absolutely blows through ammo, and the Firebug has no weapon to fall back on with a damage bonus. I'm also rather sure that headshots don't count at all with this gun, further causing problems.

#2 Flamethrower DoT - Honestly, this needs to be increased by the perk, in my opinion.

Berserker - Level 5

- 100% extra melee damage
- 20% faster melee attacks
- 15% faster melee movement
- 75% less damage from Bloat Bile
- 20% resistance to all damage
- 60% discount on Chainsaw
- Spawn with a Chainsaw
- Can't be grabbed by Clots
- Up to 4 Zed-Time Extensions

Requirements:
Deal 3,500,000 damage with melee weapons.

Balance Level - Near perfect. The Berserker is a perk that can handle almost anything in the game, with the exception of The Patriarch, Flesh Pounds, and Crawlers (En masse). While I don't think that these shortcomings make the class entirely weak, there are some aspects that need to be adressed.

Problems with the Perk

#1 - The Chainsaw. While it is the "Ultimate Weapon" of the class, there's a massive problem with it. It destroys your run speed! I'm not sure if this is a case of the Chainsaw not getting the 15% melee speed boost that all other melee weapons get, but it's a big problem in in one specific case. Fleshpounds. When that fleshpound is red and hauling *** through your ranks to smash your pal's face in, logically you get over to him and start ripping into him with a chainsaw. But there's a problem. He's so much faster than you while you have the chainsaw out that you're going to get 2 hits in before he's a mile ahead of you. Allow the chainsaw to keep its runspeed bonus. I'm not sure if its a bug or not.

#2 - Fleshpounds. On Normal and Below, a berserker can walk up to a Fleshpound and rip its head off. On hard and Suicidal, the berseker will be reduced to pulp in moments. Berserkers need some way of dealing with Fleshpounds, besides SLOOOOOOOWLY handcannoning him into oblivion. Firebugs can light him up, Medics can outrun one, Support can just hunting shotgun him, Sharpshooters nail him with a crossbow from a mile away. Leaving Berserkers and to some extent Commandos out of the loop of people who can trivialize Fleshpounds. My Suggestion - Increase the runspeed so we can BARELY outpace a raging Fleshpound.

Support Specialist - Level 5

- 50% more damage with Shotguns
- 100% better Shotgun penetration
- 25% extra shotgun ammo
- 40% more damage with Grenades
- 100% increase in grenade capacity
- 50% increased carry weight
- 150% faster welding/unwelding
- 60% discount on Shotguns
- Spawn with a Shotgun

Requirements:
Weld 250,000 door hitpoints
Deal 3,500,000 damage with shotguns.

Balance Level - Needs to be brought in line with the other classes. The Support Specialist has absolutely no reason being called support. He does more damage than anything else in the game, and can mass kill enemies fast enough to make a Firebug weep, while using less ammo.

Problems with the Perk

#1 - It's just too damn good. Here's why.
A) This class benefits from getting a bonus from the best weapon group in the game.
B) This class is the only class that actually gets MORE ammo for their gun.
C) The Piercing Attribute Increase makes them excel in AoE damage!
D) They have more grenades than anyone else! And they do more damage!
E) Their increase in carrying capacity allows them to carry both the Shotgun and the Hunting shotgun, which use independant ammo pools, which gives them their ammo bonus twice!
F) A shotgun's effective range is just too far to be balanced correctly. It practically functions as a rifle.

BIG 'OL SUPPORT SPECIALIST BUG

The LAW counts as a Shotgun for Support Specialists. While they do not get a discount on the weapon, They can carry more LAW rockets than anyone else, and do more Damage with it than anyone else.

Frankly, the Support Specialist is just the best class in the game. Something needs to be done about this. Remove the piercing increase and their Ammo increase for Shotguns, and it should be brought significantly back into line.

And that's my thoughts on Balance in Killing Floor. Let the flaming start.... now.
 
Last edited:
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Reactions: Falidell

Mkilbride2599

FNG / Fresh Meat
Apr 27, 2009
304
3
0
Probably be better in the suggestions thread.

Overall, I tip my hat to you sir. Very well written post.
 

tha MediC

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 18, 2009
105
2
0
Tbh...

1. I agree with you about the medic, perfectly balanced and its the easiest to level imho. only take about 7 hours. if that.

2. Commando needs a huge damage buff and or ammo capacity buff. i only use commando when on beginner/normal as it pretty much 2 shot's anything to the head at level 3. Also no other people shouldn't be able to see the stalkers like the commando can, that just makes it unfair on them as people will steal the kill they need in order to level - Pro-tip, if you want more stalkers, run around more and kill more, you'll run past a spawn and pull a crap load of stalkers on Hard/Suicidal.

3. Sharpshooter is a nice perk but it would be nice if the hitboxes were fixed, i've wasted countless shots on shooting at the head but it didnt get the headshot kill point even tho i know it was.

4. Firebug....well lets see, only decent if you're exploiting or have sharpshooter backup, major downfall of using the flamethrower is they have huge amounts of uncontrollable recoil which really pisses me off, it would be nice if "alt-fire" only shot a small jet of flame which consumed 1 on the ammo count... good for single target lighting up on Farm imho. other than that, they are perfect...but they need to slight speed buff as well, burning things and having them hug me is really putting me off playing as a firebug atm.

5. Rambo's (beserkers) well..they are handy for being able to give really powerful support, and its either a high level bezzy or a high level medic, who are one of the last two alive on hard/suicidal in the later waves. other than that, i think they are pretty much balanced. Have you ever held a chainsaw? they aren't exactly light as a knife or feather.

6. Support, Shotguns do have penetration, mainly because they have insane amounts of recoil, and what is the cause of recoil? a High amount of kinetic-energy which is generated by the explosive reaction in the shotgun's barrel.

I've never been able to snipe a crawler from max view distance on Farm with a shotgun, too much spread at that distance, but yeah.. they have really long range which can be fixed by giving the gun more spread, but then you will cry more about a support specialist being able to not only take out a column of 10 zombies, but three more rows side by side as well.

Support is best left as it is, just add more spread :p
 
Last edited:

BoB Dolen

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 16, 2009
18
0
0
Good thread imo, I made a "bug report" about chainsaw not seeming to get the run speed increase. Truthfully as a mainly zerk player I never use the chainsaw anymore just the fireaxe and shotgun.

Killing a flesh pound for me is either A) Getting the attention of it while my team kills it or B) Kiting it and slowly killing it.
 

RandomChimp

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 15, 2009
3
0
0
Disagree with the Commando part. I am consistanty getting the most kills (over the many support people) dispite support being so much more powerfull in your opinion.

I would say commando is by far the best perk for clearing out waves of weaker monsters quickly (really fantastic at killing crawlers), but they do have some disadvantages,

A) On hard+suicidal you generally run out of ammo if you don't use a secondary weapon (I usually use Dual Handcannons). Allthough if you have good teammates this is less of a problem. (The 20% reload speed is very usefull for secondary weps also).

B) Like you said, they have problems taking out the more powerfull monsters with their primary weapon (But Dual Handcannons + grenades are fine most of the time). But since they are better than support at taking out the weaker mobs, I feel this is balanced.

I would list the leveling as a disadvantage also, but I really dont mind it. I would rather have a level 5 perk that I knew I worked to get rather than a level 5 which I managed to get in a few days.

Overall I am quite happy at the moment with the way commando plays, of course a small buff would be nice, but is maybe not required. 100% against making commando easyier to level also.
 
Last edited:

Bej-Bej

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 5, 2009
146
2
0
The Hinterlands.
My response to your suggestions is that the game is supposed to be played with a team and each team member has his or her own part. Whats the point of playing as a team if each individual person can do everything on his or her own?

The commando and the beserker excel at dealing with the smaller specimens but have more trouble with larger specimens. They need to rely on a class that is more suited for dealing with larger specimens. That class should be the support class, but I would have to agree with you that he support class may be too effective all around.
 

Hedon

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 14, 2009
36
1
0
6. Support, Shotguns do have penetration, mainly because they have insane amounts of recoil, and what is the cause of recoil? a High amount of kinetic-energy which is generated by the explosive reaction in the shotgun's barrel.

I've never been able to snipe a crawler from max view distance on Farm with a shotgun, too much spread at that distance, but yeah.. they have really long range which can be fixed by giving the gun more spread, but then you will cry more about a support specialist being able to not only take out a column of 10 zombies, but three more rows side by side as well.

Support is best left as it is, just add more spread :p
Support is most certainly not best left as it is. If you compare the relative power of all the perks, the specialist comes out on top by quite a bit. If there is one problem amongst six examples, fix the one problem, it's far less work than matching the other five to that one.
 

manhunt0r

FNG / Fresh Meat
Apr 24, 2009
30
0
0
nice wall of text. i have to agree with all of it, especially the support and sharpshooter issues. i love playing as sharpshooter, but with the hitboxes and the random movement due to the retarded(see l4d for proper ai movement) nod led zombie pathing its just not an option, especially considering how ridiculously much damage i could do with my two shotguns and deagles.

imho sharpshooter should replace support as the fp/scrake/patriarch killing class, but only with huge damage bonus on those enemies when they are on fire(perhaps that would be to much obstruction though)


at the moment the sad truth is that you need nothing but supporters on hard and suicidal, anything else just doesnt make it past scrakes.
unless you have half the team healing the failzerker, who sees the firebug constantly running between crawlers and ammo spawns, seeing the sharpshooter cuss over another nonreg hs and hearing the commando weep in his corner of shame.
 

AXEL

FNG / Fresh Meat
Apr 25, 2008
398
0
0
you guys just suck at aiming. I get head shots no problem with all weapons. You just have to aim with one weapon and not look badass wielding 2 weapons. Stop whining and get some skill...
 

Potato Sauce

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 17, 2009
30
0
0
head shot registers are fine for me as well. i can consistently get 4-5 head shots in a row on clots and gorefasts, with or without ZED time.

but the commando perk does need a small buff either in damage done with bullpup or extra ammo/grenades
 

Crunch28

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 7, 2009
74
0
0
For the record, Killing Floor a decently balanced game. For the most part. That said, in my opinion, there's some glaring issues with certain classes that needs to be adressed before it really shines gameplay wise.

Perks

Commando - Level 5

- 50% more damage with Bullpup
- 30% less recoil with Bullpup
- 20% faster reload with all weapons
- 60% discount on Bullpup|Spawn with a Bullpup
- Can see cloaked Stalkers from 16m
- Can see enemy health from 16m|Up to 3 Zed-Time Extensions

Requirements:
Kill 4,000 Stalkers with Bullpup.
Deal 3,500,000 damage with Bullpup.

Balance Level: Needs some work

Problems with the Perk

#1 - Levelling. The Commando is the hardest class to level bar none, due to the fact that it relies on targetting a SPECIFIC enemy, which compared to most other enemies is spawned quite infrequently. This needs to be adressed. My suggestion: Remove this mechanic entirely.

#2 - Lack of a Power Weapon. When the Fleshpounder comes, what do commandos do? Their only hopes are either to continuously bait the Fleshpounder with the Bullpup, or pick up a weapon outside of its perk, such as the Hunting Shotgun. This is a big flaw. My Suggestion: Make the LAW a part of this Perk, giving Commandos enough carrying capacity to carry both the LAW and the Bullpup.

#3 - 20% Faster Reload Time - This ability is misleading. If you're not using this 20% faster reload time with the Bullpup, what would you be using it on? If you are using another class' weapon, why aren't you simply playing that class and getting a damage bonus instead?

#4 - Seeing health bars. This ability is 99.9% Useless save for one situation. Fleshpounders. Even then it's a tossup simply because of one reason. Either way, you absolutely must kill your target. There is no timer countdown where you can ignore a ZED eventually. Furthermore, on anything but a Scrake and up, health bars don't even matter! They're dead in seconds! My suggestion - Get rid of this mechanic and replace it with something else. Possibly more ammo capacity for the Bullpup.

#5 - Their unique ability barely counts for jack ****. Being able to see cloaked stalkers is slighlty beneficial, but over time you can easily identify a stalker at range from the shadow on the ground and the visible outline that a stalker still has. The other arguement that can be made in support of this ability is the Patriarch. While true, you're better off having a firebug in this situation to simply light him on fire, because you can see the flames still, allowing for more damage and tracking even easier, because now the whole group can see it. My suggestion: Change this ability to a fixed radius where stalkers getting near the commando are seen by everyone instead of just the commando.

Medic - Level 5

- 150% faster Syringe recharge
- 50% more potent medical injections
- 75% less damage from Bloat Bile
- 30% faster movement speed
- 50% better Body Armor
- 60% discount on Body Armor
- Spawn with body armor

Requirements:
Heal 25,000 HP on your teammates.

Balance Level - Perfect. It's my opinion that the medic is a shining example of balance in this game. While the perk has no true bonus to offense, its defenses allow it to excel in an offensive role still, allowing for a Healing class that can both help and do well in a fight. My suggestion - Leave as is.

Sharpshooter - Level 5

- 50% more damage with Handcannon, Rifle, and Crossbow
- 75% less recoil with Handcannon, Rifle, and Crossbow
- 50% faster reload with Handcannon, Rifle, and Crossbow
- 50% extra headshot damage
- 60% discount on Handcannon
- Spawn with Dual Handcannons

Requirements:
Get 5,500 headshot kills with Handcannon, Rifle or Crossbow

Balance Level - Questionable. Near perfect? The main problem with this Perk is the fact that headshots in this game are slightly wonky. Anything but surgical precision results in a shoulder shot in most cases, leading to frustrated Sharpshooters not getting their damage bonuses in.

Problems with the Perk

#1 Wonky hit detection on the Head. I don't know if this is intended to be more hard than other games, or if decreasing the difficulty in attaining a headshot would create an imbalance with this class. That said, to a truly skilled player, the handicap against headshots that the game gives can be overcome.

Bugs

#1 Dual Handcannons count as Shotgun damage. I'm not sure if this also causes it to not give a Sharpshooter his damage bonus on them, and I'm quite sure this causes headshots to be discounted. This absolutely needs to be adressed.


Firebug - Level 5

- 50% extra Flamethrower damage
- 100% resistance to fire
- 100% extra Flamethrower range
- Grenades set enemies on fire
- 60% discount on the FlameThrower
- Spawn with a FlameThrower

Requirements:
Deal 3,500,000 damage with the Flamethrower.

Level of Balance - Needs some work. Seemingly, the Firebug is there to put out stupid amounts of damage in a short amount of time. Unfortunately, this class is completely dwarfed by anything that the Support Specialist can do, but that's for another section.

Problems with the Perk

#1 Flamethrower ammo concerns - Although one fireball can often fry A clot or Crawler, the Flamethrower absolutely chews through ammo for smaller benefit than most guns it seems. Against a Scrake or Fleshpound, it absolutely blows through ammo, and the Firebug has no weapon to fall back on with a damage bonus. I'm also rather sure that headshots don't count at all with this gun, further causing problems.

#2 Flamethrower DoT - Honestly, this needs to be increased by the perk, in my opinion.

Berserker - Level 5

- 100% extra melee damage
- 20% faster melee attacks
- 15% faster melee movement
- 75% less damage from Bloat Bile
- 20% resistance to all damage
- 60% discount on Chainsaw
- Spawn with a Chainsaw
- Can't be grabbed by Clots
- Up to 4 Zed-Time Extensions

Requirements:
Deal 3,500,000 damage with melee weapons.

Balance Level - Near perfect. The Berserker is a perk that can handle almost anything in the game, with the exception of The Patriarch, Flesh Pounds, and Crawlers (En masse). While I don't think that these shortcomings make the class entirely weak, there are some aspects that need to be adressed.

Problems with the Perk

#1 - The Chainsaw. While it is the "Ultimate Weapon" of the class, there's a massive problem with it. It destroys your run speed! I'm not sure if this is a case of the Chainsaw not getting the 15% melee speed boost that all other melee weapons get, but it's a big problem in in one specific case. Fleshpounds. When that fleshpound is red and hauling *** through your ranks to smash your pal's face in, logically you get over to him and start ripping into him with a chainsaw. But there's a problem. He's so much faster than you while you have the chainsaw out that you're going to get 2 hits in before he's a mile ahead of you. Allow the chainsaw to keep its runspeed bonus. I'm not sure if its a bug or not.

#2 - Fleshpounds. On Normal and Below, a berserker can walk up to a Fleshpound and rip its head off. On hard and Suicidal, the berseker will be reduced to pulp in moments. Berserkers need some way of dealing with Fleshpounds, besides SLOOOOOOOWLY handcannoning him into oblivion. Firebugs can light him up, Medics can outrun one, Support can just hunting shotgun him, Sharpshooters nail him with a crossbow from a mile away. Leaving Berserkers and to some extent Commandos out of the loop of people who can trivialize Fleshpounds. My Suggestion - Increase the runspeed so we can BARELY outpace a raging Fleshpound.

Support Specialist - Level 5

- 50% more damage with Shotguns
- 100% better Shotgun penetration
- 25% extra shotgun ammo
- 40% more damage with Grenades
- 100% increase in grenade capacity
- 50% increased carry weight
- 150% faster welding/unwelding
- 60% discount on Shotguns
- Spawn with a Shotgun

Requirements:
Weld 250,000 door hitpoints
Deal 3,500,000 damage with shotguns.

Balance Level - Needs to be brought in line with the other classes. The Support Specialist has absolutely no reason being called support. He does more damage than anything else in the game, and can mass kill enemies fast enough to make a Firebug weep, while using less ammo.

Problems with the Perk

#1 - It's just too damn good. Here's why.
A) This class benefits from getting a bonus from the best weapon group in the game.
B) This class is the only class that actually gets MORE ammo for their gun.
C) The Piercing Attribute Increase makes them excel in AoE damage!
D) They have more grenades than anyone else! And they do more damage!
E) Their increase in carrying capacity allows them to carry both the Shotgun and the Hunting shotgun, which use independant ammo pools, which gives them their ammo bonus twice!
F) A shotgun's effective range is just too far to be balanced correctly. It practically functions as a rifle.

BIG 'OL SUPPORT SPECIALIST BUG

The LAW counts as a Shotgun for Support Specialists. While they do not get a discount on the weapon, They can carry more LAW rockets than anyone else, and do more Damage with it than anyone else.

Frankly, the Support Specialist is just the best class in the game. Something needs to be done about this. Remove the piercing increase and their Ammo increase for Shotguns, and it should be brought significantly back into line.

And that's my thoughts on Balance in Killing Floor. Let the flaming start.... now.
You have too much time on your hands...lol then again, so do I. But nice write up thanks for not mispelling every other word and using headings. Made for a nice read.
 

Reise

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 1, 2006
2,690
851
0
Maine, US
you guys just suck at aiming. I get head shots no problem with all weapons. You just have to aim with one weapon and not look badass wielding 2 weapons. Stop whining and get some skill...
That's not the issue. The issue is missing a headshot when the aiming was flawless. AKA: Dead on perfectly aligned with the sights. It happens all the time.
 

Sheezwack

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 15, 2009
164
1
0
#4 - Seeing health bars. This ability is 99.9% Useless save for one situation.
I do not agree with this at all, sure it isn't useful ALL of the time but it can help get the team out of a tough situation. There is no reason why every skill needs to be useful every moment of the game.

In fact I would like to see more 'utility' stuff like this within the classes.

Keep in mind, this is primarily a team game, and I think even as is the Commando is very useful to the team. I thought the whole team could see stalkers easier when a commando is near? I notice them much easier when our teammate is a commando, I see their outline and not just the shadow.

Anyhow most of your other points seem okay.
 

HaYHaYHaY

FNG / Fresh Meat
Mar 22, 2007
109
2
0
It actually make me feel more comfy knowing how much health is left on the Fleshpounds and the Chainsaw dude (forgot his name... scarke... or something...)
 

AXEL

FNG / Fresh Meat
Apr 25, 2008
398
0
0
That's not the issue. The issue is missing a headshot when the aiming was flawless. AKA: Dead on perfectly aligned with the sights. It happens all the time.
I never have that problem, aim for the head, pull the trigger and hit the head. You have to remember we are firing bullets not lasers, accuracies differ, especially for the pistols. The bull pup is very weak, and not good for head shooting (probably what most of you use). There is nothing wrong with the "hit boxes", you guys just need to aim better.
 

Hipocracy

FNG / Fresh Meat
Apr 21, 2009
90
0
0
Disagree with the Commando part. I am consistanty getting the most kills (over the many support people) dispite support being so much more powerfull in your opinion.

I would say commando is by far the best perk for clearing out waves of weaker monsters quickly (really fantastic at killing crawlers), but they do have some disadvantages,

A) On hard+suicidal you generally run out of ammo if you don't use a secondary weapon (I usually use Dual Handcannons). Allthough if you have good teammates this is less of a problem. (The 20% reload speed is very usefull for secondary weps also).

B) Like you said, they have problems taking out the more powerfull monsters with their primary weapon (But Dual Handcannons + grenades are fine most of the time). But since they are better than support at taking out the weaker mobs, I feel this is balanced.

I would list the leveling as a disadvantage also, but I really dont mind it. I would rather have a level 5 perk that I knew I worked to get rather than a level 5 which I managed to get in a few days.

Overall I am quite happy at the moment with the way commando plays, of course a small buff would be nice, but is maybe not required. 100% against making commando easyier to level also.
lolwut? better than support? i have played this game for over 50 hours and i have my commando at lvl 3 and my support at lvl 4, now i come in first most of the time but when i play support i ALWAYS come in first and when i play commando i usually come in first unless there is a support lvl 4 guy who doesn't blow. i enjoy my crawler repellent assault rifle but when i play hard+ and i want to survive reliably the bull pup just doesn't cut it, support IS better than commando for both weak zombies ( excluding crawlers ) and strong zombies, and you know whats the best part? i leveled up my support perk while playing commando using dual handcannons because i had to use them constantly.
 

Hedon

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 14, 2009
36
1
0
I do not agree with this at all, sure it isn't useful ALL of the time but it can help get the team out of a tough situation. There is no reason why every skill needs to be useful every moment of the game.

In fact I would like to see more 'utility' stuff like this within the classes.

Keep in mind, this is primarily a team game, and I think even as is the Commando is very useful to the team. I thought the whole team could see stalkers easier when a commando is near? I notice them much easier when our teammate is a commando, I see their outline and not just the shadow.

Anyhow most of your other points seem okay.
Commandos do not help others see stalkers better. Stalkers were never invisible, just hard to see. They have a slight orange shimmer no matter what, and their shadows are still there.

Like I said, the only way that the Health Bars help people is with Fleshpounds. Which, Ironically, Commandos have no tools of dealing with. If your team is having troubles against Scrakes, you have some issues. Crawlers are more threatening than scrakes.
 
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jaku78

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 16, 2009
9
0
0
As a major support class user I'm going to still agree they are a bit overpowered for their own good with the double shotgun combination. It makes them too good in most situations like tougher enemy killer versus smaller enemy killer. Since they can excel at both. As easy as switching weapons. Keeping the shotgun for regular enemies and the hunting for the larger ones. Allowing them to not have much of any real disadvantages besides range and speed. Which only really mean much on sirens at range and other small situations.

It's not as much of a worry that a class being a bit better than another is a bad thing. Since this is a game where you don't actually fight against your team mates, but it allows for people to pick the perks based on their style. The way they like to play rather than on how great the perk is.

I don't really know what Tripwire is going to do about it if anything. They don't have much choices. They can either link the pool of ammo, which isn't necessary when you can just make it impossible to get the combo together in the first place.