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Tagging

timur

FNG / Fresh Meat
Just a basic idea I got from Alex(the original creator of KFMod)'s new game "Depth", and I just wanted to see if it could be useful. I acknowledge that there is already numerous suggestions, and the forum often gets clogged up, but the Search function didn't yeild any results, so I decided "Why not?"

Basically the idea would be a sidearm (most likely for the medic) that, instead of firing bullets, basically acts to bring the team together for a large incoming threat. In Depth, this basically draws team awarness to the location of an incoming threat, by having a team "scout" attempt to find and tag enemies. Now, this could be useful in KF, but with a slightly different use; it would be a light, low-ammo weapon for use on larger zeds, and would basically alert the team of the incoming zed, and possibly attach a small damage multiplier to it. This would encourage the team to simultaneously work together to bring down larger zeds, and also give an additional role to the medic, whose role is often confined.

This idea could be expanded, like perhaps the damage multiplier could go up the more people are attacking it, or perhaps it could be manipulated by the medic to act as a damage multiplier to a specific type of damage (aka Headshots, demolitions, ect).

I just wanted to see if there is anything that could be used in this idea. Cheerio!
 

sverek

Active member
May 20, 2009
435
234
43
Great Idea!

It would greatly promote teamplay and make teams more organized.
However, I think it's up to commando to mark enemies, since commando fits more for leader role and call shots.

Alternative fire for SCAR as "Attack Dart", should bring it to right point. If there will be kf2, I want this suggestion to be considered, along with good "Beacon" visuals and perhaps audio support, where too send bullets.

+1
 

Undedd Jester

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 31, 2009
3,071
881
0
Sheffield, England
Sounds to me like a tracer round.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tracer_ammunition

In terms of gameplay use, in BFBC2 the tracer gave a heat seeking target for RPG's lock on to, and such made it easier to shoot down choppers and things. It could could serve as a lock on for the L.A.W, although I can't see a reaon why this would be easier than jsut pointing and shooting at him :)

Some kind of tracking system for the players hud (so you can tag an enemy and track them through walls) might work, but that might ruin the immersiveness of the game. Done properly it could work really well.

A damage multiplyer seems the most practical answer to add it, but it doesn't really make sense.

I like the idea alot... I'm just struggling at coming up with a really good reason to add it... other than public coordiantion of course :)
 

Rhenna

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 26, 2010
267
139
0
Alone in Penn's woods
Sounds slightly reminiscent of something in the Mechwarrior series.

In those games, there is a missile system carried by some mechs known as the NARC Beacon. By itself, it does essentially no damage whatsoever. But, any opposing mech tagged by a NARC will cause it to be acquired much more quickly by friendly offensive missiles. In addition, missiles fired at a NARC-tagged mech are substantially more accurate, and finally, missiles initially directed at another target which is destroyed prior to their impact will automatically redirect themselves to the NARC-tagged target. While I'm not actually recommending something like this for Killing Floor, in any event it would require some sort of weapons system that is not simply ballistic, but actually guided.

Achieving team awareness would be accomplished by what method? A minimap that suddenly appears indicating the relative clock-position of the threat? Perhaps an arrow similar to that indicating the trader location? Or, borrowing the blue path indication from Unreal Tournament as well as the already-used red? Perhaps having the targeted zed turn that bright lime-green color used for pickups? Just wondering...

It sounds like an idea worth exploring.
 

Cockney Nutjob

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 22, 2009
70
39
0
Pretty nice idea, it could be implemented as a simple visual effect like a flare pistol that shoots 'sticky' flares, so you can mark specific targets (basically as a more intuitive version of trying to explain to your tem-mates where that FP is than is possible using text or a mic). Having some sort of damage effect attached would be good too, but maybe not a simple multiplier. Perhaps it could increase fire damage? That way it could possibly be added as a perk weapon for the firebug (although other classes such as medic should be able to use it but with reduced ammo/functionality and increased price).
 

CandleJack

FNG / Fresh Meat
Dec 2, 2009
3,408
1,060
0
VIC
Sounds slightly reminiscent of something in the Mechwarrior series.

In those games, there is a missile system carried by some mechs known as the NARC Beacon. By itself, it does essentially no damage whatsoever. But, any opposing mech tagged by a NARC will cause it to be acquired much more quickly by friendly offensive missiles. In addition, missiles fired at a NARC-tagged mech are substantially more accurate, and finally, missiles initially directed at another target which is destroyed prior to their impact will automatically redirect themselves to the NARC-tagged target. While I'm not actually recommending something like this for Killing Floor, in any event it would require some sort of weapons system that is not simply ballistic, but actually guided.

Achieving team awareness would be accomplished by what method? A minimap that suddenly appears indicating the relative clock-position of the threat? Perhaps an arrow similar to that indicating the trader location? Or, borrowing the blue path indication from Unreal Tournament as well as the already-used red? Perhaps having the targeted zed turn that bright lime-green color used for pickups? Just wondering...

It sounds like an idea worth exploring.
For Killing Floor, would the LAW fit the requirement?

This idea you have brought to my attention seems to me to make the LAW that much more deadly; since "painting" a target, say the Patriarch, allows the local demolitard to aim as well as the local sharpshootard :p

Being able to paint a target for teammates would be a welcome addition to Killing Floor, since pub games currently lack a fair bit of co-ordination, this could provide that co-ordination.
 

ro_sauce

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 26, 2007
3,135
329
0
bwhgaming.com
considering how fast paced the zeds spawn, would this kind of feature be useful?

i can understand if you use it for a kfs-map, where the mapper can choose to significantly increase the health of the zeds, but only script spawned, that way people have a reason and enough time to concentrate fire.
like a clot will take quite a lot of shots to die (like in kfmod) but one person can do it, but maybe an occasionally husk or bloat will need everyone's cooperation to take down as the team navigates through an area.

versus everyone concentrating on a fleshpound while crawlers and stalkers and sirens swarm around it. i think everyone automatically concentrates on the fly towards the imminent threat.

but i definitely support this feature for expanded story maps (i'm working on one atm, and this would help everyone rendevous while exploring the map, because so far it's over 80,000 UU )
 
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Dolphin Buff Man

FNG / Fresh Meat
Dec 18, 2010
396
95
0
27
Victoria, Australia
I believe that this is a great idea. It would add a very positive impact to game play.

I believe that if you were adding this to a perk for realism then the Commando would be the class that should recieve this. However, if you you were to add this for fun and game play, then the medic should recieve it. I reason for this is that when you have a good team, there can be luls in healing requirements (everyone manages to go undamaged) and this leaves the medic with dodgy firepower and little to do. So this "beacon" would add an extra thing for the medic to do, sort of break the monotony a little.

I personally would like to add this to the medic and not simply as a mod, but as a retail weapon. Of course it would need testing and perfecting first, but the idea is great.

I like the damage multiplier idea. I'll add anything else that might be good later if and when i think of it.
 

CandleJack

FNG / Fresh Meat
Dec 2, 2009
3,408
1,060
0
VIC
Does anyone have any starting point imagery for the tagger?

I was thinking something like this:



Works like the LAW in a fashion, you can only "fire" the Tagger when scoped, and it has an adjustable zoom perhaps? There would be a infrared laser for ease of lining up painting, and maybe when a target is tagged it could "glow" like the stalker when looking down the scope.

After this the LAW can lock on to the tagged specimen (hopefully something big) and aim for it, in the way a smart bomb is guided to the target.
 

Salad Snake

FNG / Fresh Meat
Aug 2, 2010
875
148
0
30
Honolulu, Hawaii
Achieving team awareness would be accomplished by what method? A minimap that suddenly appears indicating the relative clock-position of the threat? Perhaps an arrow similar to that indicating the trader location? Or, borrowing the blue path indication from Unreal Tournament as well as the already-used red? Perhaps having the targeted zed turn that bright lime-green color used for pickups? Just wondering...

It sounds like an idea worth exploring.
I would assume something like the glow from L4D, except....not L4D-ish hopefully.
 
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Lucidius134

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 8, 2011
405
168
0
I say we go for some sort of dart gun from a base design.





That or a modified tranq gun.



May aswell make something unique to KF.

As for the LAW locking on, seems a tad OP but that's just me.

I can definatly see its use though. The Spotter hits the middle zed in a very large group; The rocketeer can shoot upwards a little and hit the target in the head, ensuring ALL of the explosive power of the LAW is at head level. It'de make sure you hit a whole crowd in the middle and from the top instead of near the front of them on the ground.

That said, it'de suck dick if it hit a stalker while you were aiming for something big.
 

nutterbutter

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 8, 2010
2,019
1,281
0
In Depth, this basically draws team awarness to the location of an incoming threat, by having a team "scout" attempt to find and tag enemies. Now, this could be useful in KF, but with a slightly different use; it would be a light, low-ammo weapon for use on larger zeds, and would basically alert the team of the incoming zed, and possibly attach a small damage multiplier to it. This would encourage the team to simultaneously work together to bring down larger zeds, and also give an additional role to the medic, whose role is often confined.
I'd be for it if it was just an audio and video marker. Alt-fire xbow and the bolt carries a strobe light and a beeper. Not sure what good it would do. What if there was some unique sound it made when fired? That way the team would know when it was fired and that something big was afoot.

I'd even go as far as it carrying a vial of some drug. Something to slow it down maybe. But not a damage multiplier.
 

timur

FNG / Fresh Meat
I'd be for it if it was just an audio and video marker. Alt-fire xbow and the bolt carries a strobe light and a beeper. Not sure what good it would do. What if there was some unique sound it made when fired? That way the team would know when it was fired and that something big was afoot.

I'd even go as far as it carrying a vial of some drug. Something to slow it down maybe. But not a damage multiplier.
something to slow it down could work too. In any case, some (not overblown) effect combined with a visual/audio aid. I do like the whole "special firing sound" idea...as soon as you hear that sound, get ready ;)
 

nutterbutter

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 8, 2010
2,019
1,281
0
I suggested the xbow because it doesn't have an alt-fire. I'd also prefer it to have no damage on the target.

There more I think about it, the more I really don't see much of a benefit to it.

It seems the problem is solves is a global voice command for "FP' or 'Scrake.' So why not just add those voice commands?
 

sverek

Active member
May 20, 2009
435
234
43
well, the fact is, it's works for me and mah team. But getting some tracer with feedback, would help much more. Would be awesome to have a slight damage multiplier (1.05), so it worth shooting it.

Cause usually team is busy with dealing with smaller zeds when big one appears.
 

Undedd Jester

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 31, 2009
3,071
881
0
Sheffield, England
Would it be worth making this damage increase only affect your teammates attacks and not your own?

This would of course make it best served as a Medic weapon, the reasonj I say it I'm sad to say is I can easily see people just buying it to improve their own damage and undermining the whole teamwork principle.

Using this principle a few things I might like to see for the tagger/tracer: -
- serve as a Medic weapon, giving him a very big discount.
- taking up 2-3 weight blocks to further discourage other classes from taking it.
- damage bonus only applies to teammates, not the tagger himself, again encouraging the Medic if anyone to take it.
- be required to be reloaded after each shot kinda like the M9 in MGS 2/3/4 (go to 6 mins 28 seconds)

- deal perhaps 1.025x damage if tagged in the body, 1.05x damage if tagged in the head.
- carrying between 10(Min) - 20(Max) rounds per wave, and each tracer only lasting 10 seconds.
- having a clear red blip on the tagged specimen.
- EDIT: when facing away from the tag, a small arrow appears at the end of your screen indicating where the tag is.
- EDIT 2: Only 1 tag can be active at any one time, regardless of who shoots it. Griefer tool I know, but if all 6 players can tag everything then it kinda dimishes the point of tagging a target specimen. Its what Vote kick is made for :)

I feel that would be adequetly balanced. Might even serve as the new medic wepaon people keep angling for.
 
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Reactions: Spicy and sverek

timur

FNG / Fresh Meat
Would it be worth making this damage increase only affect your teammates attacks and not your own?

This would of course make it best served as a Medic weapon, the reasonj I say it I'm sad to say is I can easily see people just buying it to improve their own damage and undermining the whole teamwork principle.

Using this principle a few things I might like to see for the tagger/tracer: -
- serve as a Medic weapon, giving him a very big discount.
- taking up 2-3 weight blocks to further discourage other classes from taking it.
- damage bonus only applies to teammates, not the tagger himself, again encouraging the Medic if anyone to take it.
- be required to be reloaded after each shot kinda like the M9 in MGS 2/3/4 (go to 6.28 seconds)

- deal perhaps 1.025x damage if tagged in the body, 1.05x damage if tagged in the head.
- carrying between 10(Min) - 20(Max) rounds per wave, and each tracer only lasting 10 seconds.
- having a clear red blip on the tagged specimen.

I feel that would be adequetly balanced. Might even serve as the new medic wepaon people keep angling for.
Thats exactly what I was thinking, Thanks :D

Of course, the damage multiplier would not effect the user, which would help prevent medics buying entire teams worth (along with the discount and weight). Low ammo would mean that you wouldn't be tagging every zed you see, and also encourage (along with the lower RoF) conserving ammo.

I'm glad the idea has worth to it, to be honest I was expecting a much more hostile reaction xD